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shift iterrupter help

steve88baylinercapri

steve88baylinercapri

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I have a 88 Bayliner Capri with the 5 liter and King cobra outdrive. My issue is every time I put the boat in the water when i shift into gear the motor dies. When its out of the water it shifts fine into gear without the motor dieing. I recently switched to electronic ignition and put a new coil, plugs, and wires on. When I switched to electronic I did so because of the issue. I replaced distributor when doing so also. I checked the continuity on my ignition interupter switch and the other switch thats tied into it and both check out. Im at the end of what I know what to try. PLEASE HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!:(
 
Which distributor, and/or electronic ignition are you using? Pertronix has a bulletin on their website regarding the Cobra shift interrupter. If that's what you are using you should check out the bulletin. Other systems may work in a similar manner as the Pertronix. Check with the manufacturer of your electronic ignition for more help.
 
If the issue was there with points, you probably have a faulty lower shift cable or issue with the shift linkage somewhere.
You'll want to read this for starters and get a factory manual to make the adjustments.
http://www.hastings.org/~stuart/cobra/

The factory ESA Electronic shift assist module does not work with electronic ignition. You can buy the CDI replacement for around $80. It is compatible with electronic ignition.
http://www.cdielectronics.com/product/shift-assist/123-9898-p-shift-assist/



 
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I'm not an OMC expert, but here's my take on this from what I am familiar with.

steve88baylinercapri said:
I have a 88 Bayliner Capri with the 5 liter and King cobra outdrive.
I've not seen nor heard of a small Capri boat w/ 5.0L and KC drive.
Even if so, this is too early for the KC Cone Clutch drive, so with the KC dog clutch drive, you will have an ESA.
ESA = electronic shift assist

(Merc calls their equivilant an SI = shift interrupt... or SA = shift assist)

My issue is every time I put the boat in the water when i shift into gear the motor dies.
The ESA is there to aid in a shift from gear back into neutral..... it should not be required for a shift into gear.
Could you be mistaken on this?

When its out of the water it shifts fine into gear without the motor dieing.
Again, the ESA is to aid in a shift from gear back into neutral.

While in gear, there is resistance against the dog clutch due to prop thrust against the water.
This propeller thrust resistance wants to hold the dog clutch teeth engaged.
The ESA senses this resistance (via the shift cable and linkage system), and momentarily stubbles the ignition (lowering rpm), until dog clutch disengagement is acheived.
Shifts must be quick and concisive.
IOW, no fooling around.... make the shift quick and deliberate.

I recently switched to electronic ignition
Electronic triggering requires an ESA kit.
See Stuart Hastings web site.
Click to expand...


Any adjustments to the ESA must be made while the boat is in the water. We need the prop thrust resistance in order to properly adjust this.

If anyone suggests that this can be adjusted while on land, they're either very, very, very, good......., or they don't want to be bothered with a trip to the water.
They'd rather send you off, and then see you bring the boat back to them for another attempt.

.
 
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To start with my boat is a 21' Capri. Checked the timing chain its as tight as it should be (almost no play) and have almost perfect compression. Only one cylinder is off from norm and only 1.5 pounds. And since I'm new to the boating world this may sound like a stupid question but, if the esa only assisted with the shift from gear to neutral, why would it interrupt during the shift from neutral to gear? Also I discovered that one of the micro switch's are bad and that the two work together and are also one unit so to replace one I have to replace both. I didn't realize that a small switch set up like that would be so expensive. the ones I looked at were in the $150 range and finally found one on Amazon for $93.
 
steve88baylinercapri said:
............. And since I'm new to the boating world this may sound like a stupid question but, if the esa only assisted with the shift from gear to neutral, why would it interrupt during the shift from neutral to gear?
A shift into gear is not quite the same.
During neutral operation, the propeller is not spinnning, so there is no prop thrust against the water, therefor no cable resistance (from dog clutch engagement) to cause cam lever action.
The spring loaded cam lever is what operates the micro switch.

However, we can still have shift cable resistance (if the cable is in need of replacement), or if the drive itself has an issue internally.

Also I discovered that one of the micro switch's are bad and that the two work together and are also one unit so to replace one I have to replace both.
One is the ignition system "interrupt", the other is an "over-stroke" switch.


I didn't realize that a small switch set up like that would be so expensive. the ones I looked at were in the $150 range and finally found one on Amazon for $93.
Welcome to the expensive world of boating! :D
Click to expand...

Look around and shop on line...... you may be able to find a better price.



.
 
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I think I have a couple, but it will be several days before I can get to the boat. They are yours for shipping. The ESA engages any time you move the shift lever. You probably have the single lever control (hate those) which has to have both the cables adjusted perfectly. Also, do you know when the lower shift cable was done last? If it is original, then that 25 year old cable is probably not doing you any favors.
 
Unsure if lower cable is original but checking into that. and I would appreciate the Interrupter Switch if you could dig one up that is functioning. I am having a hard shifting issue and will be timing the linkage and checking cables as soon as I get my service manual. I sincerely appreciate any AND ALL help I am receiving from all of you. It truly is making my life and understanding of omc out drives a lot easier!!! I am so truly thankful!!!
 
o2batsea said:
I think I have a couple, but it will be several days before I can get to the boat. They are yours for shipping. The ESA engages any time you move the shift lever. You probably have the single lever control (hate those) which has to have both the cables adjusted perfectly. Also, do you know when the lower shift cable was done last? If it is original, then that 25 year old cable is probably not doing you any favors.
Click to expand...

So replaced the micro switches still having issue. Took esa out and wired it to shift like a merc still has the issue. The cable is my only hope as to why I have this issue. The only other thing I could think of is the fuel pump is going bad and starving the motor for fuel under a load. Buying the cable soon. Hopefuly that is the issue......
 
I just reveiwed your first post. This may be redundant.... so forgive me.

steve88baylinercapri said:
  1. I have a 88 Bayliner Capri with the 5 liter and King cobra outdrive.

  2. My issue is every time I put the boat in the water when i shift into gear the motor dies.

  3. When its out of the water it shifts fine into gear without the motor dieing.

  4. I recently switched to electronic ignition and put a new coil, plugs, and wires on. When I switched to electronic I did so because of the issue. I replaced distributor when doing so also. I checked the continuity on my ignition interupter switch and the other switch thats tied into it and both check out.
Click to expand...

  1. Not that it matters, but I doubt that you have a KC drive behind a 5.0L engine.

  2. Shifting into gear should not be an issue.
    While in neutral, the propeller is NOT turning, nor will the Dog Clutch sliding sleeve be turning.
    However, the two lower unit "driven" gears will be turning.
    A shift into FWD or REV occurs simply by allowing the sliding sleeve to engage with one the "driven" gears.
    Prior to this shift into FWD or REV, there is no Dog Clutch teeth resistance... or in other words, very little force to cause the cable to resist.
    With a good lower shift cable, and while going from Neutral into FWD or REV, this shift should occur easily.

    The Dog Clutch teeth resistance is caused by the propeller thrust while in either FWD or REV, and is what causes the Dog Teeth to resist separation/disengagement.
    Dog teeth separation resistance will cause the ESA micro switch "cam" to close the contacts momentarily..... just what we want!
    Dog teeth separation resistance would be considered normal. We need this to operate the ESA cam.

    However, a stiff lower shift cable becomes a problem. :mad:

  3. This would suggest no prop thrust when out of the water.... of which is normal.

  4. With electronic ignition, the ESA requires either a "diode fix" or an ESA electronic ignition module.

I do not often work on these, so I'm not your best person for this.
However, what I do know that works, is using the P of E........... Process of Elimination.
Use the P of E while testing or checking one item only at a time.
Only after isolating or eliminating the one item, move on the next suspected item.

Questions:

What work had been done just prior to this problem showing up?
Was it after the electronic ignition install?
Were there any carburetor modifications prior to this?
Anything else done just prior to this?


Perhaps re-install the previous ignition system, and test it.


.
 
RicardoMarine said:
I just reveiwed your first post. This may be redundant.... so forgive me.



Questions:

What work had been done just prior to this problem showing up?
Was it after the electronic ignition install?
Were there any carburetor modifications prior to this?
Anything else done just prior to this?


Perhaps re-install the previous ignition system, and test it.


.
Click to expand...

So the Gimbal (correct me if Im wrong ont the spelling) bearing in the out drive was replaced prior to the problem showing up.
The aftermarket distributor was instaled after the problem showing up.
It was installed to try to correct the problem.
I also removed the esa entirely to wire it to shift like a merc to see if that would correct the issue and of course it didnt.
The carb was rebuilt by a local auto mechanic thinking it may have been the issue but the issue remains.
Can not put the orriginal dist. back in because the prvious owner replaced that.
The only thing that has not been done to my knowledge is the lower shift cable from the motor to the drive...

I just am about done with this whole deal.....
It seems that buying a boat with the omc drive is not worth it. It has been nothing but trouble for me...
I bought it so I could fish halibut this year and hopefully many more years but I allready pretty much missed the season this year becase of this issue.
I think I was screwed when I paid $3500 for the boat and only should of paid $500!!!!!!!
 
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My issue is every time I put the boat in the water when i shift into gear the motor dies.
Click to expand...
Steve....... if you have completely disconnected the ESA for a test....., then it would be safe to say that the ESA is not the problem.

Have you pulled the engine harness/hull harness connector apart?
Have you looked at the connecting pins within this harness connector? (your ignition circuit is in this harness)

Is there a chance that when the engine torques from being IN GEAR, that some part of the wiring harness is breached and is "arcing" or "shorting"?

Is the shift cable rubbing against any portion of the wiring harness?
Is the shift linkage rubbing against any portion of the wiring harness?


.
 
I will check into the harness conector but as far as the shift cable goes I have checked, double checked,
and triple checked clearance, wether it is rubing against anything, and to make sure it is routed correctly.
 
Any boat that old could have lower cable that went bad . Doesn't matter it's a omc.

If you took it out for a test run before you bought it would have revealed the problem.

And if you asked before hand i would have told you if it said anywhere on the boat omc pass.

Lets get back to the lower cable there is a adjustment in the lower where the cable meets the lower. It is a piece of metal with holes maybe just maybe you can move the cable to a different hole.

Will it work i don't know the cable got stretched it is a common problem.

Good luck !

Now my boat is in perfect mechanical condition is a 86' i would sell it with the trailer right now for 3500.00.
 
RicardoMarine said:
Steve....... if you have completely disconnected the ESA for a test....., then it would be safe to say that the ESA is not the problem.

Have you pulled the engine harness/hull harness connector apart?
Have you looked at the connecting pins within this harness connector? (your ignition circuit is in this harness)

Is there a chance that when the engine torques from being IN GEAR, that some part of the wiring harness is breached and is "arcing" or "shorting"?

Is the shift cable rubbing against any portion of the wiring harness?
Is the shift linkage rubbing against any portion of the wiring harness?


Well I checked the harness and the harness plug all seem to be ok. No rubbing or worn through spots.........
Click to expand...
 
Master mechanic said:
Any boat that old could have lower cable that went bad . Doesn't matter it's a omc.

If you took it out for a test run before you bought it would have revealed the problem.

And if you asked before hand i would have told you if it said anywhere on the boat omc pass.

Lets get back to the lower cable there is a adjustment in the lower where the cable meets the lower. It is a piece of metal with holes maybe just maybe you can move the cable to a different hole.

Will it work i don't know the cable got stretched it is a common problem.

Good luck !

Now my boat is in perfect mechanical condition is a 86' i would sell it with the trailer right now for 3500.00.
Click to expand...

know anyone who wants to buy a boat????? just kidding
I am going to replace the lower shift cable and go from there..
It is the last thing I can think of..........
 
Steve, as per post #15.......

RicardMarine said:
steve88baylinercapri said:
My issue is every time I put the boat in the water when i shift into gear the motor dies.
Click to expand...
Steve....... if you have completely disconnected the ESA for a test....., then it would be safe to say that the ESA is not the problem.
Click to expand...
Point being.... if the ESA is not the issue, then why would the lower shift cable be the isssue?

Let me explain:
A stiff lower cable will no doubt tug on the ESA micro switch cam lever more so than a good cable. This will cause premature micro switch function.
The key point here for me is......... you disconnected the micro switches , did a test, and the issue is stil there.

There's nothing else in the loop that could kill the ignition system while making a shift into gear.

Don't get me wrong..... the lower cable may indeed be in need of replacement, and it's not a bad idea to replace it.


.
 
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