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2010 BF50D Fuel Pump issue

No problem mello, the more information here the better. I wanted to know more about opening up that valve cover as well. Yes iang I only ran carb cleaner through them while firing them with 12v. I don’t own an ultrasonic cleaner so I figured the money that would go to one would be better thrown directly at the problem. Hopefully it works fingers crossed. Thanks
 
I also cleaned the thermostat and brought it up to temp in a pot of water and watched it open and it closed after taking it out of the hot water. Once parts are shipped and installed I will update.
 
Melloreel said:
I don’t want to hijack his thread, but since we are both having similar problems I thought it might help us both! Are “Keinen Injectors” OEM? Also when I pull valve cover should I go ahead and order gasket first? Are the old ones reusable? Also does it need the 3 bond as manual calls for. I only want to fix it once, so whatever I have to do.
Thanks.
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Yes the Keinen is the OEM brand, at least mine are. I see that branding on the low pressure fuel pump as well.
 
What choice of lube would be best for the injector o-rings…I’ve read a lot of different suggestions on the internet but I’m curious to what you guys use.
 
SaltTime said:
What choice of lube would be best for the injector o-rings…I’ve read a lot of different suggestions on the internet but I’m curious to what you guys use.
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Sorry for the late reply, but I too got sick, and haven’t done anything else! Thanks for the injector info. My Yamaha manual called for motor oil on the O-Rings? However, when I got them they had a silicone white grease packet in the box? I think the oil would be fine!
 
Ok I got the new injectors in and the idle and throttle response has definitely improved. Whoever was in it before me completely took the injector screens out and I didn’t notice until comparing them with the new ones. I brushed the spark plugs off before running it with the new injectors so I could see what they looked like after. And they don’t look great. Could this be all the extra gunk that was in the valves? Or do you think it’s just still running rich.

I did the code checking procedure and I just get a continuous steady pattern of long blinks. No short blinks. Not sure what that means. It still seems to have a tiny stumble while idling but not bad at all and it seems to be way more responsive when given throttle.

My dad will be here later and we are going to check the valves, but not sure they would cause this issue of plugs getting dirty within 10 minutes. Any ideas what to check next? Should I buy a service manual and start checking all the sensors related to fuel management?

Here are some pictures of the old and new injectors, and also the plugs. Those plugs were basically new and fairly clean when I put the new injectors in just for perspective of what it’s doing. Could it be a bad o2 sensor making it throw extra fuel?

Any idea are appreciated, thankfully improvements are being made.
 

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SaltTime said:
Ok I got the new injectors in and the idle and throttle response has definitely improved. Whoever was in it before me completely took the injector screens out and I didn’t notice until comparing them with the new ones. I brushed the spark plugs off before running it with the new injectors so I could see what they looked like after. And they don’t look great. Could this be all the extra gunk that was in the valves? Or do you think it’s just still running rich.

I did the code checking procedure and I just get a continuous steady pattern of long blinks. No short blinks. Not sure what that means. It still seems to have a tiny stumble while idling but not bad at all and it seems to be way more responsive when given throttle.

My dad will be here later and we are going to check the valves, but not sure they would cause this issue of plugs getting dirty within 10 minutes. Any ideas what to check next? Should I buy a service manual and start checking all the sensors related to fuel management?

Here are some pictures of the old and new injectors, and also the plugs. Those plugs were basically new and fairly clean when I put the new injectors in just for perspective of what it’s doing. Could it be a bad o2 sensor making it throw extra fuel?

Any idea are appreciated, thankfully improvements are being made.
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Had same code. It’s the O2 sensor code Im pretty sure. Look on this forum for the big write up on O2 sensor alarm. Luckily once I fixed my other issues,and cleared the codes hasn’t come back yet! Just steady Long beep! I Meant to add it will run terrible as they explain in the post when sensor is bad! Might be your last issue hopefully and let us know on valve adjustment! Goodluck
 
Ok thanks mello, letting the engine cool down now. I have the valve cover off already.

Any idea which thread it was? I will search for it in the meantime. If it ends up being the o2 sensor I’m thinking about trying an aftermarket sensor because the OEM Honda is like $350 on boats.net.

I have heard of people cross referencing them to the automotive version for money savings but I’d need to look further into that. They sure are proud of that sensor for damn near $400. It’s more than the fuel pump lol.
 
SaltTime said:
Ok thanks mello, letting the engine cool down now. I have the valve cover off already.

Any idea which thread it was? I will search for it in the meantime. If it ends up being the o2 sensor I’m thinking about trying an aftermarket sensor because the OEM Honda is like $350 on boats.net.

I have heard of people cross referencing them to the automotive version for money savings but I’d need to look further into that. They sure are proud of that sensor for damn near $400. It’s more than the fuel pump lol.
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I was going to get an aftermarket as well. Found one on Amazon that had good reviews for $50-60. If it last a year it would be worth it to me! I generally only go OEM, but that’s just too much! I’ll try to locate, but I’m sure it’s O2 code. I have a video of mine, but can’t post for some reason?
 
Ok. Go to YouTube “how to pull Honda fault codes” by “that boat guy”. He actually disconnects his O2 so it will throw a fault code for the video! I bet it’s the same you’re getting. Let me know.
 
Ok got the valves done. Just went with the stock values that are on the timing cover for the time being. They were for the most part close, only had to tighten up a couple a very small amount. I buffed the plugs clean and there’s just a very, very slight stumble. After about ten minutes of running the plugs were back to the condition I posted earlier. I watched a video about testing the o2 sensor with a torch and a multi meter.

I found that the heater circuit had continuity. When I tested the voltage by heating it with a torch it would rise but when I removed the heat it would very slowly decrease the voltage. From the video I watched his would drop the voltage almost instantly after removing the heat. He called it like a lazy o2 sensor condition? Not actually sure but it was definitely slow to drop voltage.

I pulled the codes again, and once again I’m getting the repeated single blink. I tried to find what the codes meant for this motor but was only able to find the chart for a 225 I believe. Would these be similar enough? Also if there were other sensors that control fuel do you think they’d trip their own code? I guess maybe a new o2 sensor is in my future. I’m going to try and cross reference that o2 and see what I can find. Thanks everyone. Not sure if I’m forgetting anything but that’s all I can think of at the moment.
 
SaltTime said:
Ok got the valves done. Just went with the stock values that are on the timing cover for the time being. They were for the most part close, only had to tighten up a couple a very small amount. I buffed the plugs clean and there’s just a very, very slight stumble. After about ten minutes of running the plugs were back to the condition I posted earlier. I watched a video about testing the o2 sensor with a torch and a multi meter.

I found that the heater circuit had continuity. When I tested the voltage by heating it with a torch it would rise but when I removed the heat it would very slowly decrease the voltage. From the video I watched his would drop the voltage almost instantly after removing the heat. He called it like a lazy o2 sensor condition? Not actually sure but it was definitely slow to drop voltage.

I pulled the codes again, and once again I’m getting the repeated single blink. I tried to find what the codes meant for this motor but was only able to find the chart for a 225 I believe. Would these be similar enough? Also if there were other sensors that control fuel do you think they’d trip their own code? I guess maybe a new o2 sensor is in my future. I’m going to try and cross reference that o2 and see what I can find. Thanks everyone. Not sure if I’m forgetting anything but that’s all I can think of at the moment.
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Well your making headway it appears. Did you watch that video I posted about clearing codes? He shows the fault for O2 sensor. At this point I would run it with either BG44 fuel treatment for a tank full, or chevron Techron which is what I used. Give it a chance to burn the carbon off the sensor and hope it clears the code. Mine was giving the code until I swapped plugs, and ran the fuel treatment, then I reset the code and hasn’t come back on! I read that any fuel system issues can throw the same code as O2?
 
Was it the video with the tiller handle motor? I did watch that one. His light blinks are different than what mine is doing. Mine are just a steady on then off on then off and so on. There’s no long or short blinks really. I’m glad yours is doing good and your code stayed off. Were your plugs getting dark like the ones I posted as well? I’ve also tried swapping plugs and resetting the codes and I’ve had no luck. Starting to lose faith. A lot of ups and down lol.
 
SaltTime said:
Was it the video with the tiller handle motor? I did watch that one. His light blinks are different than what mine is doing. Mine are just a steady on then off on then off and so on. There’s no long or short blinks really. I’m glad yours is doing good and your code stayed off. Were your plugs getting dark like the ones I posted as well? I’ve also tried swapping plugs and resetting the codes and I’ve had no luck. Starting to lose faith. A lot of ups and down lol.
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Yes the tiller. I really didn’t know what was going on with mine, as I had just bought it and had couple things going on, so I just changed plugs along with high pressure filter. Ran it good with cleaner, then reset the alarm, and all good for now? Before you get any deeper, like I said run a tank of strong fuel system cleaner (double the ratio) thru it. Give it a couple hours run time for all the changes you did to settle in! Who knows might clear up. You can order both I mentioned off Amazon, or get the chevron at parts store! I’ve had really good luck with those! It will either get better as you run, or worse and then maybe find the real issue. Might be dealer time after that as there are several sensors that could be bad.
 
I appreciate the suggestion but I’ve basically rebuilt the whole fuel system from the bottom up…not sure if it could get any cleaner lol. New hp fuel pump, cleaned the vst ,new injectors, cleaned entire system. You said your engine stopped giving you any codes correct? Can you tell me what your diagnostic light does without any codes? Does it blink? Just stay on?

When you say you were getting a code, was it an audible alarm, or did you apply the jumper wire.

Sry if I’m bouncing around so much, I’m just running out of ideas I guess.
 
I just got off the water, and trying to remember about the MIL. Yes, I was getting a beep, and the light was slow flashing like the vid. Maybe once per second! I actually bought the boat from a buddy who only used it twice after he bought it used. He replaced the thermostat, and didn’t realize the bolts were different lengths. So when I got it water was pouring over the plugs/wires running rough, and I was getting a voltage code (bad ground wire) and the crazy O2 sensor. Fixed water leak, replaced plugs, repaired ground wire. Still was getting the O2 code. Ran fuel cleaner hard, then came back reset codes again, and all is well other than the stumble at idle. Gonna order new injectors as they made my Yamaha run a hundred times better. Now the light comes on with key, and two short beeps, then when motor starts all lights go off! I found a diagnostic booklet on line, but can’t link it here? Send me an email, and I’ll try to forward it to you. I think it’s exactly what you need to move forward. I’ll remove my email as soon as you contact me. Hopefully it will be of great help to you.
 
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Message sent mello. Ok thanks, my engine isn’t making any audible alarms. I guess I need to bring it to the launch and put it under a load and see what it does.
 
SaltTime said:
Message sent mello. Ok thanks, my engine isn’t making any audible alarms. I guess I need to bring it to the launch and put it under a load and see what it does.
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I’ll send it shortly! Any idea how to edit a post on this forum?? Never seen one you can’t edit!
 
Hi vekerik,

This looks to me as a well thought out and executed "work around" to solve the problem of overpriced Honda fuel pumps. Thanks for doing the work.

My aftermarket fuel pump of choice in the past has been Walbro. Those pumps have proven to be reliable and long lived in several automotive applications I have retrofitted but that's not to say that your AliExpress choice/recommendation is inferior. Just stating what's worked for me.

I would use a plastic housed Bosch, single throw, diode equipped relay suitable for automotive compressor clutch control. Bosch offers the relays with selectable diode polarity so attention to your positive cathode recommendation needs to be observed when ordering.

I would imstall the relay into a matching 5 terminal automotive type socket instead of fabricating my own set up

But I see all that as simply a matter of personal preference and is not intended as criticism of what is suggested in your write up.

Actually, my experience with the Boxch blade style relays has proven to be susceptible to vibration and coming out of socket when mounted so that they plug in horizontally. I would mount the holder so that the relay plugs in vertically from above to counter this.

Or, I believe that they do make holders with positive latches to keep the relay held securely in place and I think a simple zip-tie would work too if horizontal plug in is desired

Again, I really do appreciate your thought and attention to detail for this and THANK YOU for the effort required and generosity in sharing your solutions here.

GOODONYA!
 
jgmo said:
Hi vekerik,

This looks to me as a well thought out and executed "work around" to solve the problem of overpriced Honda fuel pumps. Thanks for doing the work.

My aftermarket fuel pump of choice in the past has been Walbro. Those pumps have proven to be reliable and long lived in several automotive applications I have retrofitted but that's not to say that your AliExpress choice/recommendation is inferior. Just stating what's worked for me.

I would use a plastic housed Bosch, single throw, diode equipped relay suitable for automotive compressor clutch control. Bosch offers the relays with selectable diode polarity so attention to your positive cathode recommendation needs to be observed when ordering.

I would imstall the relay into a matching 5 terminal automotive type socket instead of fabricating my own set up

But I see all that as simply a matter of personal preference and is not intended as criticism of what is suggested in your write up.

Actually, my experience with the Boxch blade style relays has proven to be susceptible to vibration and coming out of socket when mounted so that they plug in horizontally. I would mount the holder so that the relay plugs in vertically from above to counter this.

Or, I believe that they do make holders with positive latches to keep the relay held securely in place and I think a simple zip-tie would work too if horizontal plug in is desired

Again, I really do appreciate your thought and attention to detail for this and THANK YOU for the effort required and generosity in sharing your solutions here.

GOODONYA!
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Thanks for the kind words, jgmo, and for the solid additions!


1. On pumps. Walbro — noted, proven brand. My AliExpress choice was more of an experiment that ended up exposing the root cause. And actually, this very thread is a perfect illustration of it: back on page 1 SaltTime measured 4.77 A on his pump, the test-light check proved the ECM and main relay were doing their job (the 2-second prime was there), and a genuine pump with its ~1–1.7 A draw is what cured the start-and-die. It all lines up: the ECM cuts the pump's ground when the current is too high.


2. On the relay. The Panasonic in my build was simply what I had on hand 😄 A Bosch with the built-in diode is even handier — one less solder joint. Just two notes for anyone repeating this: a diode-equipped relay is polarity sensitive — there's always a small schematic printed on the housing, match it against my diagram before wiring. And most importantly, the relay must be a sealed type: many plastic Bosch-style relays are only dust-protected, and under an outboard cowling they won't live long. Look for "sealed/waterproof" in the spec.


3. On mounting. A 5-terminal socket — agreed, tidier than individual terminals, same removability philosophy. And the vertical-mount + latch/zip-tie advice against vibration walk-out is golden — adding it to my notes. Thanks!
 
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