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Water tube problem

J

jjtotten

New member
I installed a new water pump on my BF30A outboard and apparently did not get the water tube correctly positioned over the water pump. After putting the lower unit back in place I had a serious water leak out of the lower unit. After taking the lower unit off I discovered that while replacing the lower unit I had pushed the water tube up and making it impossible to insert the water tube far enough into the water pump to stop the leaking. I am now faced with trying to figure out how to pull the water tube back down into place so it will seal in the water pump. I have ordered a manual but thought that I would post this question and see if anyone had done the same thing or knows the solution. All posts on the internet end up going to the replacement of the water pump even though I post "water tube seals". Any help would be appreciated. I have not been able to get a good blow up to see how the tube is attached to the power head and how to pull it down into the original position. Don't know if this is the place for this thread or not.
 
You found the right place, Buy a shop manual for that model, In the meantime drop l/u and install a garden hose to water tube and inspect upper seal for damage, possibly powerhead needs to be removed not an expert on those models Wait for other replies.
 
To get to where it attaches to the powerhead, you have to remove the lower unit, then the extension case.

It goes through a grommet in the extension case and that is probably as far as you can see it.

The water tube is #8. As you can see there is a lip around the top of the tube.
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Outboard Engine/2001/BF30A1 LRSA/WATER PUMP/parts.html


It is held on by a part of the exhaust tube #10 in grommet #12 http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Outboard Engine/2001/BF30A1 LRSA/WATER PUMP/parts.html

So, I am not so sure that it was pushed up into the powerhead, but rather possibly bent. As you can see from the parts picture, it already has a bend in it.

It might have just sprung a little.

Are you sure that the tube is really pushed up? Sometimes it seems that the water tube is up so high to begin with and you have to keep eye balling it with a flashlight as the lower unit is going up....and it seems like it is at the very last moment to see it, that it finally goes into the tube.

To be sure, you will have to remove the extension case....then you will know for sure. You just have to remove the lower motor mounts and 8 bolts that hold the case.

Mike
 
hondadude said:
To get to where it attaches to the powerhead, you have to remove the lower unit, then the extension case.

It goes through a grommet in the extension case and that is probably as far as you can see it.

The water tube is #8. As you can see there is a lip around the top of the tube.
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Outboard Engine/2001/BF30A1 LRSA/WATER PUMP/parts.html


It is held on by a part of the exhaust tube #10 in grommet #12 http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Outboard Engine/2001/BF30A1 LRSA/WATER PUMP/parts.html

So, I am not so sure that it was pushed up into the powerhead, but rather possibly bent. As you can see from the parts picture, it already has a bend in it.

It might have just sprung a little.

Are you sure that the tube is really pushed up? Sometimes it seems that the water tube is up so high to begin with and you have to keep eye balling it with a flashlight as the lower unit is going up....and it seems like it is at the very last moment to see it, that it finally goes into the tube.

To be sure, you will have to remove the extension case....then you will know for sure. You just have to remove the lower motor mounts and 8 bolts that hold the case.

Mike
Click to expand...

The particular engine that I have has no bends in the water tube. It appears to be straight but I can put a straight edge on it to check it for bending. I have tested it by applying water pressure to it and there is no leak at to top of the tube. I have used a flashlight to make sure that the water tube is going into the water pump and am satisfied that that is what is happening. Since the tube is about a quarter of an inch to one side on the water pump I use a screw driver to make sure that it goes into the water pump. I also tried to seal the tube with some tubing over the water tube and an old water pump seal from the replaced water pump which seemed to slow it down a little but water was still coming out of the drain holes on the gear case and at times out of the seam between the gear case and the mid extension. Water is being pumped as the tell tail is working but there is also lots of water draining out of the lower unit as the engine is running.

Your suggestions are appreciated and at the present time it appears that the water tube has been pushed up a bit so it does not seal in the water pump. I have a repair manual on order and will see what I can find out from that literature.
 
If I remember correctly that water tube installs from the bottom. Pull it out and take a good look at it. I think Hondadude is correct and it has a factory bend in it and you probably bent it some more. They are easily bent.
 
jjtotten,

Welcome aboard the Forum sir!

What may have happened in your case is that the tube is corroded at the top and is shoved up too far into the "water grommet", item #14 in the parts illustration link below. I've seen this in outboards that have several years use in salt water. The "bead" or lip, as Mike says, at the top of the tube that is intended to properly place the tube by stopping it from going in too deep may be gone or almost gone.

http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Outboard Engine/2000/BF30AY LRSA/OIL PUMP/parts.html

Or, the grommet itself is worn or badly leaking up there. The only way to find out is to take off the extension case and have a look as Mike has said.

There is a "worse case" scenario at this junction too, I'm sorry to say. When the tube gets loose up there, for whatever reason, the force of the water can erode the block where the grommet is inserted. I've had to use epoxy to "rebuild" the seat for the grommet on a couple of old outboards. This is a real pain to do but it seems to work ok.

Just my 2 cents on this one.

Good luck
 
It is a not a curved tube it is perfectly straight and is not bent. Thanks for the info though. I have attempted to pull it out but was careful not to damage it. There appears to be a seal at the end of it. When I get my repair manual I will know more about how it is removed.
 
So far as I know this motor has never been in salt water and is is not corroded. The picture you sent is not this particular motor. There is no flange on the bottom of the block which would be nice if it were as I could just take it out from below and replace the seal. Thanks for help though.

I suspect that there is a ring around the tube but I cannot see it from below. I have the manual ordered and it should be here any day and hope that it is the correct one.
 
Well, you may have something I'm unfamiliar with. But my access to documentation is admittedly limited. I'm looking at USA models only. Any chance your outboard is a Euro or Japan model?

Anyway, I went back and looked up the pre '97 BF 30 A all the way through the post '07 BF 30 D and they all are very similar to one another, if not the same. It is also a "theme" for the water piping system on many of the Honda (American) models.

The tube on all of those has a "kink" in it and is secured at the top by a U shaped "flat", that is part of the exhaust pipe flange. That flat "U" cutout acts as a clamping device on the tube when the exhaust pipe is bolted up. So, no, you couldn't just pull the tube out the bottom without going in and loosening the exhaust pipe.

So I guess we will wait to see when your manual arrives.

Good luck and please keep us informed.
 
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What is your frame serial number? ...and is it a 20" shaft or 15" shaft? Evidently, we are looking at the wrong parts breakdown.

Mike
 
My manual has still not arrived. You mentioned removing the lower motor mounts and 8 bolts that hold the case. Do you have any pictures? The eight bolts for the case are clear enough but not the "lower motor mounts". Someone said that there is also a ground strap which I have not seen. There are two bolts that hold the yoke in place so I presume that is what you referenced. Regards John Totten.
 
Well I found the ground under the absorber covers. Also as I pulled the center unit off found that the water tube is as you said. It has two bends in it that are not visible with the center section in place. Thanks for your help. Regards John Totten
 
Looks as though the mystery has been solved. After removing the center section and the curved water tube I find that there is a 1/16 inch or so hole in the side of the water tube that would direct water onto the exhaust pipe that also goes through the center section. So the water that was running out of the drain holes was more than likely coming from above from that part of the water tube. Regards John Totten
 
I would advise against patching the tube. Because of the force these pumps produce, erosion is likely what caused your hole. After many years of service, there are probably other places in the tube that have been weakened. I would replace it. But, your call.
Let us know what you decide.

Good luck.
 
jgmo said:
I would advise against patching the tube. Because of the force these pumps produce, erosion is likely what caused your hole. After many years of service, there are probably other places in the tube that have been weakened. I would replace it. But, your call.
Let us know what you decide.


I have already ordered a new water tube. I was not sure if that was feature or a defect. Thanks John Totten
Click to expand...
 
jjtotten said:
jgmo said:
I would advise against patching the tube. Because of the force these pumps produce, erosion is likely what caused your hole. After many years of service, there are probably other places in the tube that have been weakened. I would replace it. But, your call.
Let us know what you decide.


I have already ordered a new water tube. I was not sure if that was feature or a defect. Thanks John Totten
Click to expand...



I don't know if the past post was entered correctly or not, but my new water tube arrived and the hole is a feature not a defect. Not sure just why it is there, but Honda must have a good reason. I just put the old tube back as it is SS and there was no sign of a problem with it.
Click to expand...
 
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Well, I haven't seen those tubes with the hole you describe. Does your shop manual mention anything about why it's that way?

I suppose it could be a form of cooling for the exhaust but since water is pumped through the exhaust it seems redundant.

In a pure hydraulic sense it may be a form of pressure relief but, here again you would think that the tell tale bypass would suffice for that.

I sure would like to know. If you find out why Honda did that, please update the group.

I'm sorry I couldn't warn you about not buying an unneeded part but I have just never seen that before.
 
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