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Shifting troubleshoot nightmare

M

Maj92az

New member
Fairly new to boating. 89 searay 180 has the 4.3

First trip out fwd went great. Minor clunk but always worked. Reverse worked first 3 times but ratcheted everytime before I went in. Then after a few times it did not.

I have the manual and watched all the videos and maybe every thread out there.

I have readjusted the shifting twice by the book. I can easily shift all by hand and feel the prop get locked up for fwd rev and neutral is free.

Once I get it together, seems fwd always engages fine and N. But Reverse would catch more than before but still ratchet. The manual says to raise the stud. Not until the very time it grabs great but then causes the kill switch to roll on all 3 and stick. The lower cable is newer from the PO. I want to think the lower cable is tight but moves great. So obviously it's adjusted to where it's binding up causing the switch to rock. But any adjustment shy of that won't lock REV in.

Any ideas here?? I am out of water. All with not running engine. I'm tempted to put her in the lake and be prepared to do some manual shifting on the water lol
 
Are you anywhere near a qualified shop that can take a look? I fear that you may be out of your depth at this early stage in your boating career and with a model that is 30 years old anything could be wrong.
 
There are many factors at play here so it will REQUIRE additional troubleshooting BEFORE you put it in the water.

1. When was short cable replaced ? How long ago? Note: When shifting into FWD or REV it is done in a quick/rapid way. Shifting slowly and hearing a ratcheting sound is the wrong method.

2. The outdrive should be removed to inspect several of the mechanical components involved in the shifting.

3. After drive is removed first focus on the drive, There is a BRONZE shift arm looks like an upside down L. This shift arm is connected to the DRIVE SHIFT SHAFT by way of splines. Look at the rectangular top part of the arm. Is it square with good sharp edges or is one edge worn and rounded? Report back findings.

4. Take Bronze shift arm,, Rotate clockwise and spin prop C'clockwise to engage forward gear. Is bronze shift arm pointing straight ahead (12:00) if it is not exactly at 12:00 and moves closer to 1:00 then you have a shift spool issue in lower drive.




5. Now look at gimbal housing, There is a stainless steel vertical shaft, at the bottom there is a upside down square U shape that engages with the Bronze Shift arm.
Inspect carefully to see if one side of the U is bent outward. If so this means the drive was attempted to be removed without being in forward gear. If this U shape is bent you must squeeze it back to square. Report back findings

6. Now look at the top side of the gimbal housing shift shaft. There is a arm with a wheel. Inspect this closely and see if there is any slop in this assembly. If the "bell crank" moves but the shaft does not then the slotted pin must be tightened so the bell crank and vertical shaft moves at the exact same time. Also inspect Wheel. The wheel should spin and visually look like a full wheel. If it is worn or broken it will need to be replaced. (use google to get a view of one so you understand how it should look in pristine condition).

7.Take a close look at the Short shift cable end that engages the wheel. It is a grey metallic part and is shaped like an F. This part has a set screw and stainless steel safety wire thru the set screw. This Part should rotate but NOT have much if any in and out movement. If this was assembled wrong when shift cable was replaced this also could be an issue. The set screw is tightened just enough so the F arm rotates but has no BACK AND FORTH MOVEMENT. If it has excessive back and forth the set screw will need to be tightened,




8. If all of this is within specification/visual confirmation come back to this thread and report findings and then we can take you to the next steps in troubleshooting your shift problems.

Dont think there is an easy fix for this yet until all shift components are confirmed good.
There are many things at play here.
 
Thanks. I will look into that. I am curious to learn more about it and possibly find an answer... the outdrive as you call it is the "cover" that contains the 6 bolts and the trim cylinders? ((Of course more going into than that) but once I remove that properaly, will I be able to inspect all the items you list above. And by short cable, do you mean the shift cable from the motor to the shift mechanism in the very aft? That one was done by a shop in 2018. The one from steering eheel..maybe never.
 
o2batsea said:
Oh my gawd Ghost have you turned into PCR now using the blue text?
Click to expand...

Omg.......Sorry, I may need to rethink my approach...

But in my defense, What I posted is 100% product specific and 100% correct based on almost 30 years of direct mercruiser experience and not one item copied and pasted from the internet or someone elses post/information.
 
Maj92az said:
Thanks. I will look into that. I am curious to learn more about it and possibly find an answer... the outdrive as you call it is the "cover" that contains the 6 bolts and the trim cylinders? ((Of course more going into than that) but once I remove that properaly, will I be able to inspect all the items you list above. And by short cable, do you mean the shift cable from the motor to the shift mechanism in the very aft? That one was done by a shop in 2018. The one from steering eheel..maybe never.
Click to expand...

If you do not know what things are called and have little to no experience with mercruiser inboard/outboard products you may be better served to take this to a shop that does................Just saying due to your questions regarding "cover"...............not a good start!

The outdrive is the outdrive (that black thing that hangs off the back of the boat where the propeller attaches.................
Put shift contol in FWD gear postion.
Spin prop c'clock wise to lock in.
Remove two trim pistons, remove 6 nuts and 5 washers.
Pull drive away from BACK/transom of boat.

Short shift cable is short shift cable, control cable is the long one connected to the shift control box
 
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I understand your concern. Boats are new to me no doubt. So my verbage might be off. But my ability to learn and figure things out as I go is top notch. I am trusted to rebuild aircraft engines with little to no parts.

Now let's get this "Cover" off. Btw I only bought this bought 4 days ago. I'd say I'm doing pretty good lol
Btw thanks for your help so far. I've read some of your posts that go back quite some years!
 
If you can get a hold of Mercruiser service manual # 6 That would help a lot. It covers your Alpha 1 Gen 1 drive
 
I do have the manual. Thanks. Ok got the "cover off". Just kidding. Got the outdrive off. The unit shifts great. Holds well for all 3 gear options. The wheel is good and has a firm seat in its position but rolls nicely. The shift arm with the set screw was slighlty loose. While moving it, grease would ooz out. Tiny bit though. Will tighten that. Now for the cable end.. it has under quarter inch of movement. Seems like a lot of cable movement is wasted. I will try to reseat. Although I can't see how the set screw holds the cable. Both are facing sane direction. Once I cut the safety wire im sure it'll make more sense.

Now I did notice moisture inside certain areas. I know part of it holds water but some was in my bellow...will investigate.
 
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Where is the grease coming from? the inside of the Grey "F" part towards the Gimbal housing back wall??

Also it is not important that when moving the Bronze shift arm that you get gear engagement and neutral.

WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS, When the arm is moved to 12:00 does it stop there or go past towards 1:00. This is the key to this check. It MUST stop at 12:00 when forward gear is engaged.

Also as important is how far it moves to reverse but if forward is good we can assume rev is ok also for now.

Was the wheel assembly and the vertical shaft it is attached to move as ONE? There CANNOT be any bell crank movement and the shaft not move with it????


The set screw does NOT set cable play. It only sets the F arm play.

Only a cable that is perfectly straight will have no play, Once one bend is made this creates play, add another bend and that cable play inceases more.
The Short shift cable has two bends in it so ~1/8 inch of "slop" is normal........


One additional thing to check. Look where the cable is threaded into the gimbal housing. It is a brass nut looking part of the cabel (behind the F part).

The nut surface should be ~1/16" or less from back wall. If that gap is greater than 1/16" let us know. Pics would help also
 
The grease I was refering to was just the slop or movement between the crank and arm it sets to. It was a tad loose. But after that I confirmed every in and out movement of the end of the cable is absorbed by the arm. Move as one for sure. And I now understand the cable "F" set screw. The cable is fed in from this side and it bottoms out. The play is as you mention from throughout the cable. I rewired it bottomed out- in a tightening direction.

Hopefully my picture added. It appears to be 4 or 5 threads sticking out..

https://ibb.co/748HyKJ this link should work. Uploading is tough.. boy if I need to tighten that...
 
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In my opinion that may be your issue.

You can get positive forward or reverse but not both?

Is this the case?

With the cable not tightened almost all the way to the housing
If you get forward adjusted right then reverse is going to not fully engage when shifting.

So for now, lets say we have a potential probable cause.

If you found slop in a couple of places and tightened things up.
Lets reassemble drive to gimbal and we can go thru the shift cable adjustment procedure and see if it work as is.

Do you know how to reinstall drive?

Where are you located?
It may be easier to talk thru some of this.
If u are in Usa, send me a message with ur phone number and I will call
 
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I am in the U.S. in Idaho. I'll message you. And yes fwd worked all the time. Reverse was not reliable. Polaris ATV saved the day. My kit comes with a 8" 9/16th spark plug socket. I will attach loosen clean and reseat it soon.
 
Maj92az said:
I am in the U.S. in Idaho. I'll message you. And yes fwd worked all the time. Reverse was not reliable. Polaris ATV saved the day. My kit comes with a 8" 9/16th spark plug socket. I will attach loosen clean and reseat it soon.
Click to expand...

Dont do anything yet, Lets talk first
 
In your pic , you cannot have more that 1 thread visible , that nut should almost touch the housing.
To remove it you must first disconnect from inside the boat, lay it out as flat as possible , remove the tie or clamp from the shift bellow
click to enlarge
 
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Thanks everyone. I was walked thru the possible options by someone with direct hands on experience of this motor.

Upon removing the outdrive I determined there were a few items that was effecting the slack and movement of the shift arm.
The bell crank set screw was lose resulting in not immediate transfer of shifting. The next major item (pic included) was my new shift cable installed by P.O. was not installed properaly and the nut was NOT seated all the way to spec. The cable housing/straw plastic was extended further aft causing reverse to be less likely to engage.

After all corrections nade and adjusted cable after (and moved cable stud 1/2" up, I am getting perfect shifting.
Thanks and hopfully someone finds this useful.
 
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