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2003 200hp Evinrude Need HELP

M

Mako221

New member
I have a 2003 Evinrude 200hp that came with a boat I just purchased in December.
I have currently two problems...

1. The trim tilt motor worked perfectly and then I went to the boat ramp three weeks ago and the trim/tilt motor would not let me raise or lower the motor. I went home and tested and found I had power all the way to the connector that goes to the trim motor. could not get the motor off due to the fact it was corroded to the hydraulics and all four bolts broke off. I ordered a brand new "old stock" unit from someone off ebay and installed that one. It worked perfectly. I tested it constantly until I went out on the water this past weekend and now the unit does not work again. I tested it and it has power all the way to the motor but still no sound coming from motor when the up and down buttons are pressed. I am stumped.

2. Also while out on Saturday under way the motor came to a screeching halt and would only run in safe mode because the "NO Oil Light" came on and the buzzer sounded. I checked and I have 3/4 tank of oil and the primer bulb was hard. I limped all the way back to the boat ramp (approx 1-1/2 hrs) and trailered home. I checked all the fuses under the cowling and found the oil pump fuse blown. I was going to replace the fuse and run it in a barrel but as you can see in #1 the motor won't go up or down. Any ideas why this fuse blew, what I should look for, and did I do damage running that long in safe mode.

Any help is appreciated.
Thanks
 
Gonna be tough to help by sending these replies via a BB forum.

But I will try.

1. You replaced whole trim and tilt unit with a used one? Or just the bad motor? What part exactly did you replace?

Testing methods....disconnect the two contact TT connector with the green and blue wires. Use an ohmmeter on lowest scale to measure across the green and blue wires.
You should get a very low resistance, in the neighborhood of 1 ohm or less.
If that checks out, apply voltage directly from the battery to the green and blue wires. Use a wire size at least as big as the green and blue wires.
If you connect directly with the blue to positive, and the green to negative, the motor will go up.
Reverse the polarity, and you will now have down.
If none of this works, you have a bad TT motor.

Use a voltmeter on the green and blue wires. Put black voltmeter lead on ground, red lead on blue. Press UP button. Meter should read +12v.
Put red lead on green, black lead on ground, press down button. Meter should AGAIN read +12v.

And lastly, just for additional info, you should hear the relays click when operating the switch. It is very quiet, you may have to touch the relays to feel the clicking operation.

2. You really should get the EvDiags software ASAP. It is nearly impossible to diagnose these engines without it. Also, a factory service manual will be necessary. It has about two pages on the testing and debugging of the oil injector pump systems. It's P/N is 5005259. EBay.

But, you ask...why did the fuse blow....
Unknown. All you can really do is replace it and watch it carefully in the future. The EMM should have a stored oil fault code, probably a code 34 and code 38. Here is some bad news....Evinrude is openly trying to let this engine family die, in my opinion. The injectors are NLA, the oil lift pump is NLA, and the oil injector pump is still available, but over 1700.00 new. Most everyone I know is getting their parts off of junk motors. (Take it to an Evinrude dealer and ask for an injector change (for example).....wow...see what happens.)
If you keep blowing fuses, it just about HAS to be a bad injector pump. Either that or an intermittent short in the harness (unlikely).
Be aware that the voltage that drives the oil injector is from the +40v power source. I say this so that you will not be confused if you try to debug this deeper with a meter.
I will be glad to go get you a valid ohms reading for the injector pump if you want to compare your resistance with at least 2 known good ones (mine).

You will know if you did damage by the results of the compression test.

I would get a compression check done ASAP in order to have a stake in the ground starting point in order to watch for compression degradation if it happens.
Look for 120 or so to be a normal number on a healthy engine. Mine is at 120 across all six. And look for no more than 10% variance across all six.
 
1. You replaced whole trim and tilt unit with a used one? Or just the bad motor? What part exactly did you replace?
Click to expand...
I replaced the entire trim/tilt unit. It was actually brand new not used. The problem is no warranty because it was purchased from someone who buys up remaining inventory from dealers that go belly up and liquidate. The weird thing is this is the exact same way the old one was before I replaced it.

As far as my #2 issue. Thanks for your honesty but you are not giving me a very good feeling about buying this boat motor setup. I am starting to feel screwed because replacing the motor is not in the cards any time in the near future. Wife says the boat will sit for a long time while I save money.
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So let's get it fixed. I run a 2004 225HO and I am committed to keeping mine running myself.

Do the ohmmeter tests and let us know what the results are. I have a spare oil injector pump if you need one.
So there is that part covered....but only if you need one....do the testing first. Get the manual first. Get the software sometime down the line.
 
daselbee said:
So let's get it fixed. I run a 2004 225HO and I am committed to keeping mine running myself.

Do the ohmmeter tests and let us know what the results are. I have a spare oil injector pump if you need one.
So there is that part covered....but only if you need one....do the testing first. Get the manual first. Get the software sometime down the line.
Click to expand...


Thanks I just printed your instructions and I am going to try them this weekend
I will keep you posted
 
I tested the trim tilt motor directly. That works fine. I then tested the power from that plug coming from the power distribution panel. I had 12.71 volts. The relays are clicking but when i connect the harness back together nothing on the trim motor. I even took the connector apart and plugged in without the black casing and nothing. I am confused. I even checked to make sure using a wiring diagram I found on line and I definitely had 12.71 volts coming from A & B see attachment

http://www.etecownersgroup.com/file?id=596379
 
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It sounds very much to me like you're encountering a voltage drop to the PTT electric motor. Without disconnecting the plug in connector leading to the electric PTT motor, install your colt meter and take a reading when you press the up/down switch, whichever mode gives you a positive reading. What was the reading?

Check the voltage at the battery... Remove wiring terminals, plug connections, PTT connections at the battery, etc one at a time so as not to get confused. Clean "all" of the wiring terminals and whatever they connect to in order to insure proper connections and transfer of voltages, including the battery terminals.

After cleaning the battery terminals etc thoroughly, then...... install your volt meter again at the connector leading to the PTT electric motor (without disconnecting it from the electric motor). Did the reading increase? Let us know what you find.
 
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joereeves said:
It sounds very much to me like you're encountering a voltage drop to the PTT electric motor. Without disconnecting the plug in connector leading to the electric PTT motor, install your colt meter and take a reading when you press the up/down switch, whichever mode gives you a positive reading. What was the reading?

Check the voltage at the battery... Remove wiring terminals, plug connections, PTT connections at the battery, etc one at a time so as not to get confused. Clean "all" of the wiring terminals and whatever they connect to in order to insure proper connections and transfer of voltages, including the battery terminals.

After cleaning the battery terminals etc thoroughly, then...... install your volt meter again at the connector leading to the PTT electric motor (without disconnecting it from the electric motor). Did the reading increase? Let us know what you find.
Click to expand...


All connections are as clean and tight as you can get. With the PTT connector apart I get 12.71volts. Attached directly to battery I get 12.72volts. I don't know of any way to get the reading at the PTT motor without disassembling the connector.
 
Hold up...not a big deal....

OK, clarify....You get +12v on the A and B terminals only when you press the up or down button, right?

With no button pressed you should have no voltage. You have to be specific and clear on what you are doing.

So, If what I said is correct, +12v only when trim buttons activated, and on both A and B, then you have a ground issue at the PDP The relays are not grounded properly.
People do not often remember that you gotta have ground to complete the circuit.

So, take your meter, on lowest ohms setting, and measure those black terminals (per drawing) on each relay (2 per) to ground. Make sure you got continuity.
Notice the diode in the circuit. That could be blown, but not likely because if it was, you would not get ANY operation ever. You said it was working at first.

Notice, that ground to the PDP is supplied thru terminal C of the big 4 pin plug black wire. Gotta check all that.

You probably have an open circuit on the PDP. But let's see.
 
yes 12v only when buttons are pressed. So are you saying the relays may be faulty or are you saying the socket has the ground problem.

Also if I place my meter directly on the male side if the trim tilt pump connector I get +12v
 
yes 12v only when buttons are pressed. So are you saying the relays may be faulty or are you saying the socket has the ground problem.

Also if I place my meter directly on the male side if the trim tilt pump connector I get +12v
 
Using the diagram I remove the 4 pin plug from the PDP and I checked that I had continuity between the "C" terminal and socket #85. I then check for resistance and I had 235k from "C" to #85 and from "C" to #87a I had .1 on the down and .2 on the up

I then metered the actual relays and I have continuity between #30 and #87a Also I have 78ohms between #85 and #86
 
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Been out. Got things to do.

OK, look at your diagram. Remove the relays. There are 2 points in each socket that have ground at all times. Put meter on low ohms or continuity test and Measure from those points to engine block ground. You MUST get continuity at all four points.

If NOT, check terminal C to engine block ground. You have an open to ground somewhere. I think.....

PM me with your phone number and maybe we can call when you are at the boat, and ready to meter some things.

Two points....you have no ground to complete the power circuit to drive the PTT motor, AND you have no ground to even pick the relays....you said they were not clicking.
 
To be clear I DO get relays clicking. I metered between the ground bolt and the four points in the relay sockets and I DO have continuity.

I unplugged the trim tilt motor from the A/B connection on the power distribution panel and I connected my 12vdc directly from the battery to this end of my PTT wire harness and it goes up and down as it should.

So here we are... Trim motor- Confirmed working correctly. Relays- Clicking when up/down buttons pressed. Wire harness from PDP to PTT motor-working correctly.
All plugged together- Relays click, No Up/Down on PTT Motor, and no sound coming from Motor.
 
Here is the way the circuit works.
When no TT buttons are pushed, system at "rest" so to speak, both TT relays are OFF. In the OFF state, BOTH the BLUE and GREEN wires (running to TT motor) are connected to ground inside each relay on the relay terminal labeled #87A. 87A and 30 are connected when the relay is off. The diagram shows the relay in it's OFF state.

When you hit the UP button, the UP relay only energizes, and now 87A is NOT connected to GND in the UP relay only. When UP relay is ON, #87 and #30 are now connected. This provides +12v on the blue wire, supply to the TT motor, returning from the TT motor on the green wire, to the DOWN relay and as we said above, the green wire is grounded inside it's DOWN relay at terminal 87A. So you get a complete circuit.

Let the UP button go, system returns to rest. Press DOWN button, DOWN relay picks, and the opposite circuit path is established.

Both relays provide the ground path for the opposite TT function. Down relay provides ground for UP function; up relay provides ground for the DOWN function.
 
Mako221 said:
To be clear I DO get relays clicking. I metered between the ground bolt and the four points in the relay sockets and I DO have continuity.

I unplugged the trim tilt motor from the A/B connection on the power distribution panel and I connected my 12vdc directly from the battery to this end of my PTT wire harness and it goes up and down as it should.

So here we are... Trim motor- Confirmed working correctly. Relays- Clicking when up/down buttons pressed. Wire harness from PDP to PTT motor-working correctly.
All plugged together- Relays click, No Up/Down on PTT Motor, and no sound coming from Motor.
Click to expand...

OK, good....your TT motor blue and green harness is GOOD. TT motor is GOOD. We can eliminate them.

The only other thing that could do as you are describing is TWO bad relays. If both relays had internal opens between 87A and 30, you would get these results.
BUT, in an earlier post, you state both relays have continuity on those two pins.

Use a couple of relays from other locations on the PDP panel and see if the TT system still does not work.

You might have to get down and dirty and start figuring out how to probe these circuits with everything connected up. Backprobing is what it is called.
I usually make up a very thin stripped wire, and plug it into the socket, and plug the mating half together, creating a pigtail that I can probe with the meter.
Gotta be careful not to let that pigtail touch any other part of the plug/socket circuits.
 
I just went and switched the relays around and still only get the clicking relays......and then a lightbulb went off in my head!!!

I decided to meter the battery again and found it is still at 12.71vdc. So then unplugged the TT harness from the PDP again and using my aligator clips on my meter I metered the output from the PDP when I press the Up/Down buttons........... only got about 5vdc
 
You will NOT meter across the green and blue. You must meter between the selected UP or DOWN color....BLUE for UP, Green for down....and ground.

Put meter leads on blue wire at PDP, and ground . Press UP. you should read 12v. Screw the .71...it is meaningless.
 
If you are getting odd voltages...5v on a 12v circuit, you probably have an open ground somewhere. Likely a broken solder joint on the PDP.
 
Re-thinking, meter with a voltmeter directly to the pins of the PDP, red lead on blue contact, black lead on green contact.

Press UP, you should see +12v. Do not move leads. Press DOWN, you should see -12v. (Notice the "-" !!!!)

If not, you have a bad ground somewhere in PDP.
 
daselbee said:
Re-thinking, meter with a voltmeter directly to the pins of the PDP, red lead on blue contact, black lead on green contact.

Press UP, you should see +12v. Do not move leads. Press DOWN, you should see -12v. (Notice the "-" !!!!)

If not, you have a bad ground somewhere in PDP.
Click to expand...

I just metered again and yes I got 12 volts across the pins
but if I reconnect the harness I still get nothing to the tilt trim motor.
This is so confusing
Why would I have my 12 volts everywhere and still not work.
I cam across this website. I may call them this week. Supposedly they are former Evinrude people that specialize in this engine

http://www.dfitechnologies.com/products-and-services

 
So, over the phone, we debugged this problem.
It was an open circuit on the PDP between terminal "A" of the PDP TT motor connector, and the terminal 30 of the UP relay.

In UP mode, the relay couldn't supply +12v to the TT motor. In DOWN mode, the circuit could not get it's ground thru the UP relay.

Refer to the drawing he posted as a link up above.

He was seeing voltage, but it was a float voltage...a false voltage...due to the open circuit.
 
I spoke with the owner of Marine Computer Supply in Alabama this week. He was one of the engineers for Evinrude during the Ficht years. He explained how easy it was to repair the PDP and that the loose connection on pin A was a common problem. I opened the unit and soldered a short piece of #10 tinned wire between pin A and the solder joint for socket #30 on the up relay. I resinstalled the PDP this morning and the trim tilt motor seems to be working now.

I am waiting on my Evinrude software to arrive from Monaco, Italy. so we can start diagnosing my blown fuse on the oil pump circuit.
 
My Evinrude software finally arrived today. Unfortunately I am going away for a few days and won't be able to play with the new software and do some troubleshooting until Saturday.
 
OK
I connected the software to the motor and started the motor. It said I had no active codes but on the active screen the oil pressure tab was red.
When I clicked on the tab for history codes it says my last two codes were 38 and 39.

Seems to be running ok on the test barrel but whats the chance I will get back out there and the fuse blows again and I am back in the same boat.
 
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