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Volvo Penta AQ 280 with very stiff steering

O

ocoocher

Contributing Member
Stiff steering is not due to the Teleflex hydraulic steering as wheel turns easily when cylinder rod is detached. From what I've read here, it seems likely it's either corroded steering arm journaling (bushings), or bushings/bearings around the pivot tube. Is there a way to test which while boat is in the water?
I'm wintering in the boat so can't have it out of water for very long. I pulled the trans (upper unit) 5 yrs ago, so repair of steering arm should be fairly quick (?). But intermediate and lower unit haven't been apart in the 34 yrs I've owned this 1978 Tiara Sport Salon 2500. It's at a warm and sunny dock and it's really COLD back in Wis right now, but it would be nice to do a little cruisung. Any thoughts on what's causing the very stiff steering will be greatly appreciated.

[Oh yeh, When the cylinder rod is disconnected, the wheel turns easily, but in the water (poor leverage!) I can't move the I/O.]
 
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ocoocher said:
Stiff steering is not due to the Teleflex hydraulic steering as wheel turns easily when cylinder rod is detached. From what I've read here, it seems likely it's either corroded steering arm journaling (bushings), or bushings/bearings around the pivot tube. Is there a way to test which while boat is in the water?
I'm wintering in the boat so can't have it out of water for very long. I pulled the trans (upper unit) 5 yrs ago, so repair of steering arm should be fairly quick (?). But intermediate and lower unit haven't been apart in the 34 yrs I've owned this 1978 Tiara Sport Salon 2500. It's at a warm and sunny dock and it's really COLD back in Wis right now, but it would be nice to do a little cruisung. Any thoughts on what's causing the very stiff steering will be greatly appreciated.

[Oh yeh, When I cylinder rod is disconnected the wheel turns easily, but in the water (poor leverage!) I can't move the I/O.]
Click to expand...
 
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You should be able to move the sterndrive from side to side fairly easily by grabbing the tiller bar that the cylinder rod was attached to. If not, as you speculated, either the top bearing or the needles in the intermediate housing. My first guess would be the intermediate housing bearings since this bearing is underwater all the time the boat is in the water.
Also, there is a grease fitting at the bottom end of the steering tube ( the thing in the intermediate housing that the drive pivots on) that at the beat of times can be problematic to grease properly. Often it is painted over and missed entirely. The bearing at the top is above the water and is a bit easier to lube.

In my (ver personal!) experience, the drive goes from very stiff to totally frozen rather rapidly, especially if the seal(s) in the intermediate housing steering shaft have failed and the needle bearing rusts. If totally frozen, removing the steering shaft ( a hollow tube) to replace the bearing(s) can be a real b***h. There is no way to do this without removing the drive from the boat while the boat is high and dry. This is a good time to give the universal a good once over as well as replacing the boot(s). I replace the drive boot every 3 or 4 seasons unconditionally or as soon as the rubber shows ANY sign (checkering) of degradation. If the top boot fails, the bearings in universal are not far behind.

As far as in the water diagnosis... There is usually a very minimal amount of slop between the steering fork and the drive itself. Have someone move the helm ( connected to the drive) slightly (~1/4 turn) back an forth while you are hanging over the stern looking at the drive. If the fork moves slightly relative to the drive, its likely the steering tube bearing. If the fork and drive move as one, its the top bearing. If you feel adventurous and the water is warm, you can jump in the water and disconnect steering helmet from the drive ( remove single allen head bolt thingy between the helmet and the top of drive) and see if you can move the helm easily. If not, top bearing, if you can move it easily, steering tube bearings shot. If top bearing on the tiller bar is stiff, you might luck out forcing lots of fresh grease (marine!) in the fitting inside on the transom and "working" the helm back and forth, but that is a long shot.
 
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Thank you very much! Much as I don't like it, I'm thinking as you, that problem is with the steering tube bearings. But I will round up a helper and try a couple of the things you mentioned. Including the swim to remove the helmet pin. Sure do appreciate your help.
 
Remove the helmet pin from the transmission clamping collar, and raise the helmet up. If the drive articulates Port to Starbord easily, then you will know that the collar steering fork and bushings have tightened up. Corrosion between the bushings and bushing bores grows and expands, causing the bushings to squeeze down on the collar steering fork "shaft" to the point of too much friction!
I've repaired many of these due to this very same thing!

The collar steering can be a bitch to remove if this is the case!
Use wooden wedges at the exterior of the fork..... between the fork and the transom shield!


With the helmet still disconnected, if the drive is still stiff Port to Starboard, then it's likely corrosion within the ID of the reverse latch bearing sleeve...... of which would involve removing the complete outdrive, and a trip to the workbench.

The transmission and the lower unit will need to be removed from the Intermediate housing.
Now the pivot tube can be removed (from the bottom down), and the bearing sleeve and pivot tube can be cleaned up.
Once cleaned up, it can now be reassembled.

This is also your opportunity to replace:
.... all O-rings involved
.... the pivot tube needle bearing cage
.... water neck fitting and special beaded gasket
.... inspect the latch unit
.... suspension fork hinge pin bushings

and it would be advisable to also replace the eccentric piston seal!


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Many thanks Rick. I think you're saying what sandkicker said, but a little more technically and with some very good additional suggestions. (Tho I will need to track down a few of the terms you used [like reverse latch bearing sleeve] :) I'll get in the water soon and hopefully define the problem better. But likely will wait until I get boat home in another month or so to pull the I/O. I'm deeply appreciative of the great service you and sandkicker and others do us neophites with our boating problems.
 
Went swimming to remove hemet pin. (Delayed doing this until I bled/purged Teleflex hydraulic steering (Just to be sure, since last time out, helm was kinda unresponsive, in addition to being very stiff. Bit of a chore for an old man cuz I have upper and lower stations but one steering cylinder.) Drive moves easily from port to starboard. But steering arm/fork wouldn't budge. Both helms turned very stiffly, but cylinder rod did not move of course, so I presume the pressure relief valves were kicking in. I'll soon go see about having boat hauled and bushings replaced. If that doesn't work out, I'll wait until I get home in a month to pull the transmission and see if I can dynamite the fork/arm loose. In the interim, I'll pretend I'm living in my pickup camper rather than on my boat. Feels good to have the problem defined, even if not yet remedied.
 
An additional thought, and a question. I talked with a VP mechanic and he's gonna stop by and have a look before we haul the boat to replace spindle bushings. He said he would check on parts availability since removing the steering arm and fork could result in some breakage. I'm wondering, since used forks are available (part # 839441 I believe) for not too much $, why not remove helmet pins and helmet, if can't free spindle, then cut either the spindle or fork arms and remove it and steering arm together, for disassembly at bench? There's probably something I'm not seeing, but what? Is it the transom shield that prevents this approach? Is there room to slip a saw blade between the fork and shield? Could then drive spindle remnant and attached arm upward and out? Using a torch to super heat the connection in that area would make me kinda nervous.
 
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We are talking about a collar steering fork, correct?

The spindle arm is steel, and will have a pinch both!
The coller steeing fork must drop down before the spindle arm can be removed!

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One more thought, and with your best interest in mind.

I've met Volvo Penta mechanics who trained on the AQ series drives, but who may never have been required to get into this area due to a problem like this.
Sometimes these issues do not show up for 20 or 25 years or so.
Some of these guys have worked with the AQ series for years, yet may have only removed collar steering forks that were still nice and free.

When we get into a collar steering fork that is frozen as yours is, we'd best be carefull, or we may accidentally cause further damage and an even more expensive repair!

Point being...... make certain that your AQ series Volvo Penta mechanic speaks the language, has past experience, is familiar with the parts, knows how to source the replacement parts, and is most familiar with the procedure!

If you are not comfortable with his level of experience, perhaps find someone else who you are comfortable with!


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Once again I'm most appreciative of your help. Pics do help, partcularly with nomenclature( e.g., spindle arm/steering arm). Re the mechanic, I'm told that he's the guy for V/P work here in Key West. He's been at it for decades, but I/Os aren't popular here and he does mostly diesel engine stuff. I'll sound him out as best I can w/o pissing him off too much. Haven't had much luck with V/P mechanics back home in SW Wis either. May end up trying to separate the spindle(steering) arm from steering fork spindle myself, and using heat and wedges to force spindle down and out.
 
If you can move the tiller arm/fork side to side at all, it might pay to force some fresh grease into the fitting on the transom and working the tiller side to side to side. SOMETIMES, things loosten up. This is not a fix, but inducing improved side to side motion would likely make removing the fork easier. A word of caution, be VERY VERY careful when (if) you hammer on the top end of the steering fork pivot, since any peening over of the edge of that pivot rod will make removing it even more difficult (if not impossible). This BTW, applies as well to removing stubborn pins ( drive itself to the transom shield) elsewhere. Any peening over can be removed with careful filing.
 
I'll make a few more key points here, and then I need to run:

This part in question is a "collar steering fork".
The all steel portion is a "spindle arm", and it will be secured to the vertical shaft via a "pinch bolt"!
The fork is tight because the OD of the black plastic bushings are being compressed, causing further compression against the collar steering fork "shaft"!
No amount of additional grease will free this up.
The fork must be removed, the bushings must be removed from the transom shield bores, the aluminum bushing bores must be cleaned free of corrosion, new bushings must be bedded in place, the grease ports on the fork must be "pressure cleared", and only then can this all be reassembled!

Important notes:
These fine splines will allow for the spindle arm and fork shaft to become indexed in several ways.
The Port to Stbd steering stops are integral with the spindle arm.
If we are off by only one spline, we will end up with a noticeable difference between a full Port stop, and a full Stbd stop....... and it will drive you crazy while maneuvering the boat at dockside or even out on the water.
I would suggest that we index these two parts while on the work bench, and then clearly stamp each part showing the correct indexing.


Wooden wedges work very well between the top of the collar steering fork and underneath the outside of the transom shield.

With regard to freeing up the spindle arm splines from the fork shaft splines......, remove the pinch bolt, and drive a steel wedge into the pitch slot as to expand it!

I can't tell you how many of these I have repaired over the years! Some worse than others..... and some extremely stubborn ones! You can rest assured that I know what I am talking about here!



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There's nothing to kick off of for a hydraulic unit.
The only area where a jacking force would be helpfull, would be between the arch of the collar steering fork, and the actual transom shield itself!
Oak wedges typically hold up well!

If you can access the top of the fork shaft (grease fitting removed), you can drive on this with an aluminum punch of a slightly smaller diameter.
Use the wedges simultaneously with a driving force!


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Thanks, that's helpful. I mentioned the press because the mechanic had. Will search out an aluminum punch, although access is an issue. I've some sharply tapered "plastic" wedges (used for directional tree felling) that I may try between the fork and transom shield. But I've some oak wedges as well. Given your earlier comments, I'm leaning toward not hiring the local mechanic because it seems he's not done a lot with sterndrives. He's well known and regarded for V/P diesel work. Will sound him out further.
One final question (hopefully :) , any tips on freeing the spindle arm pinch bolt? I've been applying PB Blaster penetrant but the head is buggered a bit. When I get home and boat in the barn I'll strip some engine stuff out of the way. Many thanks for your help.
 
The pinch bolt is nothing more than a 3/8" grade #8 national course bolt.
Be sure that nothing other than a six point wrench or socket is applied to the bolt head.
Penetrating oils are going to be fruitless.
I'd rather see you apply heat to the threaded area of the spindle arm.

Your plastic wedges should work great!


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Many thanks again. Boat will be in water for some time yet, then a long haul home, but will post if/when I make some headway. Wouldn't have known where to start or how to proceed w/o you and this forum. If I knew of a mechanic in my area with the expertise displayed on this forum, I might not attempt it myself, but such people seem to be few and far between.
 
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