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Stalling on Shifting to Reverse Intermittent Hard Starting

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vinny_c

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"Alpha 1 Gen II 5.0l carb Bayl

"Alpha 1 Gen II 5.0l carb Bayliner 2150
Most times, the engine fires right up with a half second turn of the key. Last season, I had intermittent hard starting issues, hot or cold. Engine would crank and crank and seem to not even kick, but eventually would start after a long time. Then, it would be fine for a while. Other times, started right up no problem. Also, several times when docking, when I shifted from forward to reverse to slow or stop the boat, the engine died. Hit the damn bulkhead pretty hard a couple of times, too.

Reading up on here about shift interrupt switch and lower shift cable problems, does it seem like the two problems could be related, and possible traced back to one of these things? Could the shift interrupt switch be getting stuck in the open position and cause this?"
 
"It sounds more like a Carb ch

"It sounds more like a Carb choke related issue.

You need to check some things first before a diagnoses can be made.

When it starts fine, After it warms up look under flame arrestor and see if the choke butterfly is completely vertical. Push it slightly closed with your fingers and it should snap back to full open (when warm) if not then maybe there is a linkage issue with choke causing it to close when ever it wants to.

If that is OK then have some one shift the boat into forward ( while in the water only) and watch the shift cables and interuptor switch assembly.

When shifting into forward you need only to shift control handle to the ~10:00 oclock position. You should have full forward. Now have other person push throttle and watch the short shift cable to see if it continues to move. If not or very little (like less than 1/4 inch) all is good.

Now repeat this for reverse. shift control handle to ~ 2:00 oclock position and you should get reverse with no engine stalling. ( issues typically show in reverse before they show in forward). If so then move throttle handle more as if giving more gas in reverse and watch short cable, again if no movement or very little (1/4 inch or less) than all is good. If the short cable continues to move more and the shift interuptor switch looks as if it will be activated or does activate then you either have a cable adjustment issue, linkage issue, or bad short shift cable. (linkage being the components at the bell housing, ie: removal and installation of outdrive incorrectly causing bent link arm or U shaped end of vertical shift shaft in bellhousing) or possibly the vertical shaft in bell housing is too tight and not spinning easily.

Just some ideas..........."
 
"The old style shift interupto

"The old style shift interuptor switches did fail in the closed position I am not sure of the newer style.

If you suspect that to be the case all you need to do is disconnect one of the wires going to the switch.

All the switch does is short the negative side of the coil to ground when it is activated which stalls the engine.

Also when shifting a merc it is done in a quick controlled stern fashion, not slowly as one may think."
 
"starting issue, what year mot

"starting issue, what year motor? Reason i ask is if you have points might be as simple as cleaning them.

Also when was the last full tune up done? Want to try something? Run the boat in total darkness look at the motor, see sparks then something is amiss find them and get rid of them you should not see one spark off a plug wire maybe only the alternator no other sparks.

Cranking and cranking, could also be dirty filters, check the one in the inlet fitting that enters the carb,.

Also could be dirty electrical connections, and maybe the slav going but first check all the connections clean and keep following the connections, starting at the battery, but disconnect the battery when cleaning the starter connections.

Also don't forget the main ground at the block, follow the neg cable for that one.

Finally cranking and cranking could be the dead man switch."
 
"The motor is a 2000. The firs

"The motor is a 2000. The first time it happened I was thinking carb/choke myself. A few more clues....I took off the flame arrestor and shot some starter fluid down the carb, no difference, still just cranked. I gave up trying and took the battery home to charge it because I had beat on it so much trying to get it to start. When I came back a couple hours later and put the battery in, it started right up. Next time, same thing, took forever to start. Before all this started, my mechanic took the outdrive off last winter to change the pump impeller, but it started fine right after that. The first time it happened was about a month into the season. We had been tubing for a couple of hours, and were wrapping it up for the day. When we pulled the rider close to the boat I shut it down. When I tried to start it, it was hard starting, but started, but then when I put it in gear, it died and wouldn't start for a long time. We anchored up and had lunch, and it eventually started, and started right up every time after that the rest of the day.
Next time, a few days later, took forever to start."
 
"alpha genII was introed in 19

"alpha genII was introed in 1991 so I dont believe any model engine in that era was running points.while the shift interupt switches have caused many a good marine mechanic go bald,the genII did have a better set up and stiffer lower cable.thats not to say that it still couldn't be causeing the stall-at-shift problem but the hard starts tend to point more towards aother issue.is there any sigh of a miss when it does finally start?"
 
"how old are the exhaust manif

"how old are the exhaust manifolds and risers?..if they are begining to fail internally and are leaking a small amount of water down and into the rear cylinders after shut down,this would cause those cylinders to miss,causing shut down at low RPM.once the engine sits a while it will start fine.also,when run at a higher RPM,the exhaust pressures and high temp keeps the water out and thus will run fine."
 
"It runs like a dream when it

"It runs like a dream when it warms up, always has, but a little rough when it's cold. The mani's and elbows are original. The starboard side mani showed a little rust at the elbow joint this past spring, so I've been keeping an eye on it. At the end of the season, it was dripping a little water from one of the threaded plugs on the bottom, so I am having both sides pulled and checked this winter. Also, when I pulled the plugs to winterize, the one from the back cyl on the starboard side had a bit of water on it. I thought (was hoping) it was condensation, but maybe not. It would be really nice if changing out the mani's and elbows, which I figured I was going to do anyway, solved the hard start/stalling problem. Not to mention having dodged the bullet of getting a whole bunch of water in the cylinders. Keep you posted. Thanks for the input. This is a great example of how these things are supposed to work, have a problem, do a little poking around, narrow it down a little, and throw it out there."
 
The problem sounds like classi

The problem sounds like classic lower shift cable sticking. Cable sticks and causes shift interuptor switch to stay on too long or even stay on period causing the no start condition. I have been through this on my Alpha Gen I including the no start. New lower shift cable properly installed and shift linkage properly adjusted should solve the problem. Any friction in the cable and you will have problems mostly in reverse.
 
"Ok no points. All above posts

"Ok no points. All above posts are good, you take off the dist, cap and everything is making good contact.

I'll bet a dollar this is going to come down to a bad connection. Ether the main ground, main plug, or maybe, one of the wires coming in or out the dist."
 
"Ayuh,... I see Carb mentione

"Ayuh,... I see Carb mentioned, but not Which carb....

It appears to me, with the statements presented,...
That the Manifolds are Junk,+ need changing...
And,..
The Carb is leaking internally, causing the Hard Starts...
It won't restart when shut down, short term, because it's leaking,+ Flooding the motor...
When shut down, long term, it's leaking off, evaporating,+ the motor turns over with No gas in the carb...
And,...
The Dock Bashing is probably the lower shift cable dragging, causing the interupt switch to activate...
Is the Lower Shift Cable also Original,..??
If so, it's long outlived it's design life..."
 
"Yep, shift cable is original

"Yep, shift cable is original too. Sounds like that should be next on the list.
Mani's are going this spring, I'll clean up connections and do full tune up, too. It only hard started once when it was warmed up (the very first time it happened, actually). All other times, it was really hard to start cold, but then ok once it did start. I'm trying to remember if I ever tried to restart immediately after having stalled going into reverse. Most times, it happened when I was docking at the end of the day, so I don't remember ever trying to restart immediately after stalling. One time, it stalled when I was docking at the beach, but started up pretty easily an hour or so later when we left."
 
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