Pulling Trans Gear off 283 Crankshaft

[mtuck02]

Looking for some advice / direction. In the process of rebuilding Chris Craft 283 for use in Jersey Sea Skiff. Tearing down the block and am at the point where normally the harmonic balancer would be on a car engine. Instead, it has a gear that will go into a manual paragon trans. (This is I guess what you would call an opposite rotation engine and has a large gear on the cam meshing with the crankshaft gear instead of a timing belt).
How difficult is it to pull the gear? What should I use and anything to look out for.
I am following a "How to Rebuild a Small Block Chevy" book and I need to obviously deviate for any marine specific part.
Pics attached, thanks!
Tucker

 

[mtuck02]

sorry...Jersey Speed Skiff not Sea Skiff!

 

[the_tassie_devil]

Looks like you need to get a large puller to sit behind the gear, and once you remove the retaining bolt in the centrew of the Crankshaft, it should "simply" pull off.

But, before you put any strain on the puller, place a bolt in the threaded hole, for the puller to push against, so you don't damage the thread.

Bruce.

PS. This is a reverse-rotation engine.

 

[the_tassie_devil]

Forgot to mention that you will have to remove the Camshaft Gear first.

Bruce.

 

[mtuck02]

Thanks....that is what I was thinking. The bolt in the center of the crankshaft is hollow and the bolt head has a hole in it. I assume this is to allow oil into the manual trans.
Should I mark anything so the gears go back in the identical positions?
Yes...it is a reverse rotation engine
thanks again

 

[the_tassie_devil]

I don't think the Transmission would have engine oil for lubrication.

So I don't know exactly there would be a hole in the bolt, but when you get the crankshaft out, I would be seeing if there is any oil gallery continuation from the Journal to the thread.

There is going to be some form of Timing Marks to allow you to re-align the gears when assembly time comes.

Bruce.

 

[drrot]

Save the bolt that holds the gear on. It feeds engine oil pressure to the reverse gear for lubrication. If the crank is changed you need to drill an oil passage from the end main journal to the snout.
To remove the gear you usually have to remove the crank and use a press. Wrap it in blankets with bunji cords to protect it. Why does the gear need removed?

 

[mtuck02]

Thanks for asking that question...I guess at this point it does not need to be removed in the event the original crank is still ok. First time doing a rebuild and following an auto engine book. Process they have is to remove harmonic balancer first thing but that is probably because it assumes the timing gears will be replaced later.
I am sure this isn't the first question I will be asking......

 

[the_tassie_devil]

Well, the question was asked about removing it, and I answered the question, and added the bit about removing the Cam Gear only so that the Crank Gear can be safely accessed by the Gear Puller.

The old 283 Chev engine never used a Harmonic Balancer, and only had a hub that you attached the Pulley to, and the Timing ring was attached to it as well.

GM couldn't find any reason yo need to fit an H/B, as I don't think these cranks suffered from any harmonic problems. They were only a 3" Stroke, and were Forged Steel.

Bruce.

PS. Unless you have to remove the gear, there is no real need to as the timing can be done by meshing the gears together as the crank, or the Cam is inserted into the block. Timing Chains are attacked differently.

 

[mtuck02]

Thanks once again for the answers....really appreciate it
M Tucker

 

[Ned L]

Mike - It looks like you have your answers. I didn't have to pull my stub shaft, so I don't know how though they are to remove, The only one I have ever pulled was the stub shaft on my wood speed skiffs Graymarine '109', - very similar set-up. I made a special puller for that & it came off ok.
On my glass skiff, the previous owner (who built up the engine) did not drill the crakshaft, so I had to do that, and also drill that bolt. - Slow & careful & things went fine. Be careful with that bolt in the end of the crankshaft. It is the size of the holes in it that control how much oil is taken away from the main crank journal & first con-rod bearings.
A lot of the skiff guys don't bother drilling the crankshaft, figuring that reverse isn't used much in a speed skiff, but that oil also lubricates the stub shaft spline, which is important. Rob Garratanno says he has always drilled them when putting an engine together with a reverse gear for a speed skiff.
Glad to see you are making headway, good luck, I think you should have a good boat there (I thought of buying it from Mick).

Ned

 

[mtuck02]

Things seem to be going good....even though everything is froze up, i got the first 3 pistons out with no trouble at all. 4th one is in a bad position, I will eventually need to move the crank.
Soaking it with PB Blaster...maybe it will budge in a few days.
Gold Cup Detroit Unlimiteds tomorrow! Will be at Roostertail turn (always fantastic)....will be having a good time...taking Monday off.

Nice to work on this when things go as planned.
Actually pistons seem to be in decent shape considering everything sat in a barn for over 30 years

pisc just before popping out the pistons
Tucker

 

[the_tassie_devil]

If you can't get the pistons out because of corrosion, then you might have to do what I did once.

Took the engine to my Engine Shop, and had them dip the whole block into the Caustic Tank, and eventually, the aluminium pistons were eaten away, sufficiently so I could remove the remains that were attached to the connecting rods.

This will destroy the Cam Bearings, and everything else that isn't steel or cast iron, but you were going to replace those weren't you.

But, beats doing any further damage to the bores as you hit them out.

Bruce.

 

[mtuck02]

Slow but steady got all the pistons out & crank (see pic). Bores seem to be in good shape, pistons too...
Now the cam...which is completely froze.
I am told that all the lifters must come out before the cam but these seem to be frozen. Any tricks to get these out? Do I soak them in PB Blaster? Do i need to get the cam spinning first?
Maybe time to turn it over to engine rebuilder?
Appreciate comments / advice

 

[the_tassie_devil]

Great news on the pistons.

The Lifters have to be removed, sufficiently to allow the journals of the Camshaft to clear then, and if they are stuck, you need to pressure them up from underneath, without damaging the Cam Lobes.

Ones I have had, the Cam and Lifters were no good if they were in the condition yours are, and if they are hydraulic lifters, I would be replacing them no matter what. Being so stuck in the bores, there is no way that you are going to get them cleaned out inside, the tolerances are so tight.

If the Cam is still stuck, after pressuring the Lifters out, and I have been known to use a long drift to "Persuade" them, you could remove the rear Cam Plug that is in the back of the block, and "Push" it out.

I would still be looking at using the Engine Shop to soak the block in their Caustic Bath, as that will eat away the Cam Bearings, and allow the shaft to be removed.

Bruce.

PS. Engine rebuilders don't really like someone giving them all the parts and just get them to machine and assemble. They need to be able to dismantle everything, so they can see what was wrong, and know where and what to really inspect, deeper than other parts.

 

[mtuck02]

Once again, bit of patience paid off, soaked the lifters and gently tapped them out.....then tossed them. Freeze plugs were a bit stubborn but got them out also. Going to take your advice on cam, then the boiling bath. Know what you mean by dumping all the parts on the rebuilder. I live in Detroit so a lot of (marine) shops / gearheads here.....I am going to do as much work myself as possible so I am sure I will find a sympathetic one to work with me ( I hope). Got a pic to show almost have it stripped down.

 

[Ned L]

I looks like you are making good headway Mike! I'ver pretty much finished adding a forward cockpit back in my skiff (previous owner had completely decked over up froward during his rebuild), and had her out this evening. I think I 've fianlly got most of the oil staying inside the engine now (5 helicoils & a drilled out tap later. The broken tape came with the boat).