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Obstruction in #4 cylinder

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mtodd101

New member
Hi Boaters. I recently got a 1989 Bayliner Baretta 17ft. open bow with a AQ131D and 275 drive. It sat for at least 10 yrs. before I got it. I oiled the cylinders and hand cranked it for a few day. Things seemed to be ok. Changed the oil and gave it fresh gas. Put a battery on it and gave it a try. So it turned over but stopped almost immediately. Discovered the timing belt broke. So i removed the heat ex-changer and other things to get to the belt. Spring and tension wheel were find. No play there. Removed the raw water pump. Will rebuild that as the boat came with a kit. The cross piece behind the raw water pump was broken so will replace that. So was going to put all back into timing positions. The cam gear kind of snaps to 4 position when turning. This must be normal for compressing the valve springs, right? The middle gear which turns the distributor turns freely and lines up fine. The lower crank timing gear I can't get to it's mark as the crank only turn about 3/4 of a rotation and hits something. Pulled the plugs and found something in the #4 cylinder blocking the rotation and it looks like ash everywhere on top of the piston. Sorry for the long story. I was hoping someone could help identify the piece in the cylinder from the pics. Also I think this in a non-interference motor so I don't think the piston would have hit a valve. Could a stuck valve break somehow? I'm confused because it turned freely when I was hand cranking the engine. Thanks for looking, Matt DCIM0002.jpgDCIM0008.jpgDCIM0011.jpg
 
Matt, first off, by 1989 Bayliner boats no longer used Volvo Penta engines/stern drives. The last for Volvo Penta was 1986.
I would say that there is either an error in the year model, or that someone has re-powered this boat.
Be happy...... in 1989 this boat would have been equipped with an OMC, and you certainly DO NOT want an OMC!

As for working on the AQ131, I will suggest that you cut your losses now. These are expensive to over-haul.
Instead, look for a good running AQ131 or other displacement OHC 4 cylinder Volvo Penta engine.

Be sure to replace the PDS bearing while you have this apart!
 
RicardoMarine said:
Matt, first off, by 1989 Bayliner boats no longer used Volvo Penta engines/stern drives. The last for Volvo Penta was 1986.
I would say that there is either an error in the year model, or that someone has re-powered this boat.
Be happy...... in 1989 this boat would have been equipped with an OMC, and you certainly DO NOT want an OMC!

As for working on the AQ131, I will suggest that you cut your losses now. These are expensive to over-haul.
Instead, look for a good running AQ131 or other displacement OHC 4 cylinder Volvo Penta engine.

Be sure to replace the PDS bearing while you have this apart!
Click to expand...

Hi Ricardo. Thank you so much. I was told it was a Bayliner and never questioned it. I thought the "Baretta" was it style, not the manufacturer. So it's an 1989 Baretta with an AQ131D engine and a 275 sterndrive. I really didn't want to rebuild a boat and I really don't want to go farther than a head rebuild which i'm guessing will be a lot more than the $300 plus title transfer I have in it. Is there a market for selling the engine's good parts? I'm going to pull the head and take to the head shop and see what they say. If the pistons are shot, then I think I'm out and will probably look for a buyer of good parts. What do you think? I have the ability to do the work but don't want another money pit. The piece in the picture looks like a valve seat to me. I'll post pictures of the head when I get it off. By the way, I also have a 1977 Reinell with a 4 cyl. GM and electric shift OMC outdrive, haha. Got it for free and spent $ 400 for engine parts to get it on the water. Never had to touch the outdrive accept for fresh oil. Maybe I'm was lucky. Apparently, that luck may have run out. Thanks again, Matt
 
mtodd101 said:
Hi Ricardo. Thank you so much. I was told it was a Bayliner and never questioned it. I thought the "Baretta" was it style, not the manufacturer. So it's an 1989 Baretta with an AQ131D engine and a 275 sterndrive. I really didn't want to rebuild a boat and I really don't want to go farther than a head rebuild which i'm guessing will be a lot more than the $300 plus title transfer I have in it. Is there a market for selling the engine's good parts? I'm going to pull the head and take to the head shop and see what they say. If the pistons are shot, then I think I'm out and will probably look for a buyer of good parts. What do you think? I have the ability to do the work but don't want another money pit. The piece in the picture looks like a valve seat to me. I'll post pictures of the head when I get it off. By the way, I also have a 1977 Reinell with a 4 cyl. GM and electric shift OMC outdrive, haha. Got it for free and spent $ 400 for engine parts to get it on the water. Never had to touch the outdrive accept for fresh oil. Maybe I'm was lucky. Apparently, that luck may have run out. Thanks again, Matt
Click to expand...

Hi Ricardo. So I just talked to the head shop I've used in the past and they said $250 including any seats that need to be repaired/replaced. So If I don't need to go beyond the head I may go ahead with the Head work. Any thoughts? Thanks again, Matt
 
mtodd101 said:
Hi Ricardo. So I just talked to the head shop I've used in the past and they said $250 including any seats that need to be repaired/replaced. So If I don't need to go beyond the head I may go ahead with the Head work. Any thoughts? Thanks again, Matt
Click to expand...

Here's pics of the exhaust ports on the head. #4 exhaust port is completely plugged. I broke off two bolts also. #4.jpgAll.jpg
 
sandkicker said:
What is that white material in the port. Hard to tell from pix.
Click to expand...

Hi Boaters. Thanks for your replies and suggestions. So I took the head off last night, well started. I stripped the last bolt at about dark and spent today drilling and grinding it out. So I found the obstruction. It was the valve seat and also the valve. It had broken probably long ago and let loose when I put a battery to it. Top of piston #4 was loaded with the white powdery stuff. I assume that is erosion from the Head?? Cleaned the piston top up and you can see the contact marks. Doesn't look too bad. Cylinder walls look good. Pistons are snug with very little play side to side. I can't tell if the rings are fused to the piston or not, but will look at that more closely. And who every said Volvos are expensive, wow. A brand new head, $4,000, New exhaust manifold, $1500. So I'll be watching Craigslist for some bargains I guess. Any way, here's some more picture to make you feel good about your boat. Matt#4 exhaust port.jpgexhaust manifold exit.jpgmissing valve.jpgValves.jpg
 
In post #3 I suggested cutting your losses and finding another good running OHC 4 cylinder Volvo Penta Engine.

I spent about 24 years doing AQ series Volvo Penta repair. Please trust me when I suggest that you would be spending far more money than need be if you attempt to repair the Engine that you now have!


.
 
RicardoMarine said:
In post #3 I suggested cutting your losses and finding another good running OHC 4 cylinder Volvo Penta Engine.

I spent about 24 years doing AQ series Volvo Penta repair. Please trust me when I suggest that you would be spending far more money than need be if you attempt to repair the Engine that you now have!


.
Click to expand...

Hi Ricardo. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge with the AQ series Volvo engine. I currently have about two weeks experience with them. There is so much that this boat needs beyond just the engine that even if the engine was running, I'd still have more money in it than I could sell it for. That being said with the new parts that came with the boat and a good galvanized trailer I took a chance for the $300 that my friend owed me, plus $60 for title transfer. So I'm in for $360. I have a receipt for the new parts that reads $515 which I'd discount for an easier sale and the good parts and the trailer. I'm just looking to see what can be fixed and what can't and I like tearing things down to see what's inside, haha. That's not costing me anything except my time and at this point I'm not hurting the engine. I won't be looking to replace the engine either. I already have a couple running boats. My "never fails me" boat is a 14' Lund with a Honda outboard for fishing and crabbing. My Reinell is there also, so this was a quick "use it for the summer" kind of deal that didn't work out. I'm confident I'll get my money back. Thanks for your input. I see your name come up on a lot of question from people looking for answers. You are an obvious asset to this board, so thanks for that from all of us.

Can you tell me what's the deal with the #4 cylinder? Why does it always fail there? Thanks again, Matt
 
mtodd101 said:
Hi Ricardo. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge with the AQ series Volvo engine....................................

Can you tell me what's the deal with the #4 cylinder? Why does it always fail there? Thanks again, Matt
Click to expand...

Matt, the exhaust manifold is what actually fails first (has to do with the seawater mixing chamber area).
Then this failuer affects the #4 exhaust port.


.
 
Thanks Ricardo. I found a what appears to be a complete aq131d locally that the guy says the engine was recently ran and remove from a boat. Said I could remove the exhaust manifold to take a look. I figured it doesn't cost me to look. Said he'd take $200 for it so will see how it looks. I figure if I can get the two pieces in working shape that i need for a couple hundred, I might consider upping my "I'm out" price. Plus I need a winter project. It very well might be trash like the one I have. We'll see. I feel you shaking his your head saying" why do I try,Ricardo, haha. I promise I won't let it get away out of hand. Thanks Matt
 
Hey Ricardo or others. Guy called me back on the donor motor and said he also has an AQ125 head that he says looks pretty good. Also says he does boat repairs, but i do also, haha. He said a OHC 4 cyl. uses the same head. Is this accurate? If so I may be able to just get the head for much less than buying a complete motor. Thanks, Matt

I also saw this post from 2012 El Pescator:

Regarding the original question, the heads are identical on the AQ131 and AQ151 engines, but the cams are different. The AQ151 has a V cam installed and the AQ131 has an A cam. Just install the head from the AQ151 with the AQ131 cam and you should be fine.

so I'll look to see if he has an AQ151 also. Thanks again, Matt
 
Hi Boaters. I found this on a thread from 2004 comparing the different heads. So it looks like a aq125B would be a straight swap out for my aq131d head or a aq151 and change out the cams. Does that look right? Here's a link to the entire thread. Question: is the casting stamp how the different heads are identified? Meaning how do you tell if a head stamped 1000531 is from a aq125b, aq131 or a aq151 or does it matter? Thanks again, Matt.

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=24675


volvo factory info/ sales lit

Aq125a
-2.1L
-80MM stroke
-8v 1000160 head
-"A" cam,
Aq125b+
-2.3L
-80MM stroke
-8v 1000531 head
-"A" cam,
-CR 9.8:1
-120hp
Aq131 / aka 230, 275
-2.3L
-80MM stroke
-8v 1000531 head
-Single Carb
-"A" cam
-120hp
- cast crankshaft
-529.1lbs
Aq145
-2.3
-80mm stroke
-8v 1000531 head
-Dual Carb
-"V" cam
-All Square Tooth Belt
-CR 9.7:1,
-138hp
Aq151 = aka 250
-2.49l, or 151ci
-86MM stroke
-Forged crankshaft
-8v 1000531 head
-Dual Carb
-"V" cam
-CR 9.7:1. comp press 142-170psi
-Cast V pistons
-All Square Tooth T-Belt
-146hp
-551.2 lbs
-max speed 5500 rpm
Aq171/ aka 251a(dohc)
-2.49L, 151.9ci
-86MM stroke
-16V Head
-Dual Carb
-"PZ" cam
-CR 9.7:1
-Cast V pistons
- Forged Crankshaft
-All Round Tooth T-Belt
-167hp
-637.15lbs
 
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Well I went to look at the other AQ131D motor on Saturday and it was only slightly better than mine and would need a lot of machining like mine. He also had an AQ125B. The exhaust manifold exit port was crumbing and the bolts were stripped so I couldn't get it off to see into the head. So at this point I'll save my money and just tinker with the boat until I find something that I can use. Thanks for the input and I'll update this if something changes. Thanks again, Matt
 
mtodd101 said:
Hey Ricardo or others. Guy called me back on the donor motor and said he also has an AQ125 head that he says looks pretty good. Also says he does boat repairs, but i do also, haha. He said a OHC 4 cyl. uses the same head. Is this accurate? If so I may be able to just get the head for much less than buying a complete motor. Thanks, Matt

I also saw this post from 2012 El Pescator:

Regarding the original question, the heads are identical on the AQ131 and AQ151 engines, but the cams are different. The AQ151 has a V cam installed and the AQ131 has an A cam. Just install the head from the AQ151 with the AQ131 cam and you should be fine.

so I'll look to see if he has an AQ151 also. Thanks again, Matt
Click to expand...

FYI
Most Volvo engines in United States Automobile came with a B camshaft, the AQ131 boat cam is an A. Not much difference IMHO, a little less horsepower. When I had my JY engine apart, I did not upgrade to a hotter cam, mainly because the Auto engine runs fine in my boat.

Start looking in JY's near you. There are a couple of on-line JY databases.
 
I think the linked reference site, Turbobricks, has the horsepower ratings wrong.Volvo literature that I've read said the model number is the horsepower.


If you start selling parts, you could turn a profit.
 
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Thanks for the follow up, Dennis. So the 530 head is automotive? I read a discussion on a thread somewhere, maybe on this one, about this. I'll have to go back through all my bookmarks and re read it. I assume the 530 would be somewhat cheaper than the 531. I ran across company making exhaust manifold by the name H2o? Not sure of the quality, but the price was about $200. Well, I order a carb gasket kit to pass some time. anyway thanks for the reply. Matt

Also found this showing the differences between the two heads if your interested.

http://people.physics.anu.edu.au/~amh110/Head/cylinder_head_531_530.htm
 
Hello Boaters. I picked up a couple of things in the last week or so. I have been patiently looking for another 531 head and a decent exhaust manifold to go back on my aq131d. I found a 531 head on ebay that was told came from a running motor. #4 exhaust port has had a repair but had no pitting or material loss like the one I had to start with. I paid 102.50+ 40 shipping. And yesterday I picked up a galvanized exhaust manifold that looks awesome. Had not seen a galvanized one so I was stoked to find it. Paid $170 for it. So I still think I haven't gone past the break even to losing money point on this boat. Anyway I have a question on gaskets. Is the Volvo Brand gaskets the only ones to use. I've read various opinions. Thanks, Matt. Here's some pics of the new pieces.FullSizeRender-1.jpgFullSizeRender-2.jpgFullSizeRender.jpg
 
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