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Crusader 454 rebuilds

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ccollins

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What is the going rate for a r

What is the going rate for a rebuild of a 454? Is it more involved since it's a marine motor? Do you have to have special gaskets and such?

Sorry for all the questions here is a little background info. I just bought a project boat and it came with motors that may run fine but the guy that sold it to me said that a plastic thru hull came out and the water got all the way up to the manifolds before he found and plugged the hole. The bilge pumps drained the water in an hour but he said the motors haven't run right since. They will crank but won't take fuel. A marine mechanic that I had check them out stated the it sound like it just need the carbs rebuilt.
 
"you caould expect to pay $2K

"you caould expect to pay $2K up to $3K depending upon their condition and the effort to recondition them. The long block requires the appropriate marine parts - mostly around the head gaskets and the block plugs. All of the bolts on are marine and will be more. Ask you machinist to get you a better swag...you may want to go the reconditioned long block route.

If they may have been submerged, don't forget to check the gears, too. Nothing like having it all back together and finding out the connection to the prop isn't working.

Check the wiring to see what it is like.

definitely check the fuel tank, too and make sure there's nothing bad in it. If the maintenance was done by the guy that installed the failed thru hull, you really may have a 'project'."
 
For a little more you can buy

For a little more you can buy one professionally remanufactured with a warranty and no wait.
 
"A long block might be the way

"A long block might be the way to go, but think of this: A long block won't likely fix the non-start issue. If the motor turns over without bad noises, I'd encourage you to get it started in its current state. Carb, dewater the fuel lines, etc. Is this a salt water or fresh water situation? How does the oil look, both transmissions and engine? The transmissions would have taken in water thru the vent, they are low in the bilge."
 
"One motor will idle fine but

"One motor will idle fine but you have to work the throttle to get it to take gas. If you put this motor in gear it will die under load unless you really work the throttles. The other motor will idle some but it will die also. It will die if you try to give it gas. We were able to get both motors to rev up enough to open the 4 barrel. The one motor that runs the best has gas in the oil its thin and you can smell it. The oil is still black in both motors its not milky at all. We did these test by backing the boat down the ramp so the motors could pull water but we left the boat on the trailer. My plan is to pull both fuel tanks and empty them, replace fuel filters and have the carbs rebuilt.
What should I do about the transmissions?"
 
"It sounds like the idle jets

"It sounds like the idle jets may have issues in the carbs. Rebuild time for them. Velvet drives? look at the dipstick, red ATF is good, milky means drain and refill a couple of times. Even with the engines in neutral, you are running the transmission oil pump.

Gas in the engine oil to the point where its thinned out? Maybe a consequence of the carbs, not sure. Or, the PO pouring gas down the throats in an attempt to start."
 
"I went down to the boat today

"I went down to the boat today and they are velvet drives model 10-18-1006 Ratio 1.88:1 The oil was still just as red as the day they put it in, no milky discoloration. Is that a good ratio on a boat? How do you determine what is the best ratio, shaft size and prop for a boat? Should I create another thread for this?"
 
"I agree with Rick and Jeff.

"I agree with Rick and Jeff. If you decide to replace the engines, go with a remanufactured one from a professional unless you like a project boat enough to undertake the rebuild yourself. On the other hand I also agree with Diver Dave, I am not sure what is driving your need to replace the engines. Running rough can be caused by a number of problems that can be resolved by rebuilt carburetors, cleaned up or replaced plugs, coil, and distributor and an updated fuel cleanup and delivery system. If you have the engines rebuilt you are going to have to do some or all of these things anyway. I would suggest starting there.

I had a mechanic look at my engines in 2007 and he told me there was no way to salvage the port engine. A few hundred dollars later I had both purring like a kitten. You have a project boat. Make a project out of it. There are a number of people on this forum that are willing to help if they believe you are making a serious attempt yourself. When you get done you will feel more confident in taking the boat away from shore where there are no mechanics.

Chuck Hanson"
 
I'm hoping I will not have

I'm hoping I will not have to replace the engines. I would love to undertake the rebuild if that comes along. My only concern would be not knowing what internal parts are specific for Marine application. I am just feeling out all my options. I'm having a blast so far learning about everything.
 
"Chuck Collins:

After rerea

"Chuck Collins:

After rereading you original post, Im with the other Chuck (gettin' confusing around here!) in that your motors may be salvagable. You need to put a GOOD, reliable mechanic to work on them.

Jeff"
 
"Chuck:
if you go down the re

"Chuck:
if you go down the rebuild path, some of the internals are 'marine' but are readily available as they come from the auto supply system. Some of the bolts ons are available from the same sources.

on the velvet drives, the boat builders makes those calls. The better boats usually have margin in the whole drive train; the average boats have an adequate design. Overall, changing any of it isn't cheap and with twins, you only double the price. As long as the props are sized to load the engine correctly, you should be fine.

You may want to get a compression check to assess the engines' health. GM's 'new' procedure states you can do this cold.

also, a vacuum gauge on the engine that idles will compliment the compression check and may provide additioonal insight, too."
 
Okay another question. I try t

Okay another question. I try to research all of this before I bother ya'll with it. How much horsepower are the 454 producing? I see anywhere from 280 -350 on the internet. My serial numbers show that they are 1986 models.
 
"HP of the stock 454 @ WOT @ 4

"HP of the stock 454 @ WOT @ 4400rpm. I'll take an educated guess at 350 HP gross; meaning, measured at the crank, with no accessories running, running gasoline (E0)."
 
"the 86's i have were rate

"the 86's i have were rated 350 hp at 4400rpm. Like Dave said, the method used isn't stated. The mercrusiers from that same vintage (with the same internal components) are rated 340hp, at the couplers - this is consistent with the 3% loss usually given to a marine gear."
 
"I called a local shop in orla

"I called a local shop in orlando who has been there for about 35 yrs. basic short block rebuild for 454 is 1400 to 1600, heads are 250 a pair plus hard parts if needed. I am guessing that if I had to do one that if I prepped engine for pulling and paid someone to pull it and stripped it down to short block then did the re assembly of the bolt on parts etc and paid someone to install and allign that with parts i would spend less than 2500.00 each."
 
"After just doing my port engi

"After just doing my port engine, new bores on up, I agree with stephens assessment. There are a couple of things to think about on salt water boats. I went with stainless ARP head bolts, and most other external bolts went stainless as well. The oil pan bolts changed from rusty 12point to SS allen's. Inspect the pulleys for rusty grooves, and expect a lot of sandblasting on things like the rw pump bracket, the manifolds and the like. Sand cost me more than the main bearing set..."
 
"Anybody know? Will a 454 mer

"Anybody know? Will a 454 merc cruiser bolt up the same as my 454 crusader? I need a 454 crusader, 1990, and my friend has a 88 454 merc cruiser. Will it work ?
Thanks
Mike"
 
"One of the first things to do

"One of the first things to do would have been to drain the oil and change it and the filter. And as you have said you are doing drain the fuel and change the filter there as well. Then I would get a can of "Sea foam" which is a fuel additive and add that to the tank of fuel. The caveat is to make absolutly sure you have a filter as the sea foam will clean your fuel system from the tank to the carb's.
I went through this with a buddy of mine with his lobster boat back in the '70s and though its not a fun job it's cheaper then repowering, particuarly where the engines did not get totaly submerged.
If she got that much water in it I would also start looking over the electrical componants and any conections for corrosion. a corroded wire or conector can teally mess you up."
 
"..." Will a 454 merc crui

"..." Will a 454 merc cruiser bolt up the same as my 454 crusader? "

Yes. Some accessories are going to be in the wrong place and need finagling, but that's always the case.

After re-reading the original post, I think all you need is some minor mechanical work and the present motor may be okay. After all, if the trans didn't get water in it, the motor shouldn't have either--it's higher up.

Jeff"
 
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