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Crusader 270 Freeport Texas

S

sroberts

New member
"Hello all,

Here is the sto

"Hello all,

Here is the story, I bought a 1986 29' Phoenix Sportbridge from New York and had it shipped to Texas. It was a fresh water boat (Lake Ontario). The boat sat for over a year. I got the boat and ran it. The temps on the starboard engine when I would run at about 3000 RPM Would approach 190 (port is about 180). Temp would go down when I slowed down. I believe I read that 195 is max, so I did not let them get there. Also when I try to dock the boat and have the throttles to idle, the starboard engine dies and I have to restart, after it dies, the port will sometimes as well. Even though the gas had stabil in it, I suspect I have bad gas. I put some Star-Tron in the tanks on the recommendation of a mechanic. I have not noticed any difference after adding the Star Tron, but i have only put about 13 miles on the boat total, so probably not enough to show yet. I have also read that they use heavier engine oil up north due to the cold and that perhaps this is making the engine run a little hot. I know nothing about engines, and had a mechanic scheduled to come give it a once-over. He stood me up twice, so no more. I pulled the fuel/water seperators and the starboard was a little rusted at the bottom. The port looked fine (but then I really don't know what I am looking at). I also pulled the spark arrestor/breathers to look at the carbs. I would like to know how to tell what carbs they are (probably qjets from what I read). They looked ok, but I don't know what they would look like if they were bad. I didn't do a complete inspection, only what I could see from the top down after removing the breather. I would appreciate Jeff or Mako or any of you coming in with helpful suggestions. Here are a few questions:

1. Does anyone know a good crusader mechanic who works in Freeport Texas?
2. Can I run the gas out of the boat?
3. If they did run a heavier oil due to the cold in New York, could that be causing the engine heat?
4. Where do you add transmission fluid (how can I tell which transmissions I have)
5. My seacocks for the engines are on the bottom of the bilge, seems impossible to get to them, they have a wingnut type screw in the bottom, do I just have to undo this to clean them, or do they come apart and there is a filter. Many of you will probably think I should not have bought a boat knowing so little, but offshore fishing is my passion and I am willing to learn. Anyone who knows crusaders very well is invited for a free fishing trip!

Thanks in advance for your help.

Shannon

Since the boat has been sitting, i am of a mind to just run her good and "blow the pipes", I am just afraid I might blow something else (expensive). It has oil, transmission fluid, and will have new fuel filters, can I run it without doing harm (will head back if temps get close to 190)

I would also like to install some things to make life easier for doing things like backflushes like I read on here with a clear PVC hose hooked to the cooler to watch the flow."
 
"shannon:

start with the ow

"shannon:

start with the owner'm manual. Do all the maintenance actions so you have a known quantity.a substitue would be one of the service amnuals from this site - see top of right hand frame.

I'd start with the cooling system. running that warm sounds like a blockage somewhere.

The oil weight will make the engine work harder if too heavy but unlikely at this time of year.

The owner's manual will ID your transmission and go over the fluid level, etc. Most likely a borg warner velvet drive. fluid level is checked by the dipstick on the LHS - look opposite where the shift control connects. may need to unscrew it - DON'T over tighten it when replacing.

As far as running the gas out - yes but major pain - safety hazard - and - potential environmental fines if you screw up. Better to burn it out, if it will run.

For the most part, if you gauges are good and you what them - keeping them in the appropriate range, you won't really hurt anything. If you don't know for sure, check them as well as their circuits. Check the www site for the mfg of the gauges you have. Many will go to half scale with a 110 ohm resistor substituted for the sensor.

As far as changing anything to make maintenance easier, I haven't found a way to keep things installed and switch over. Keep the stuff in a 'kit' in your dock box or the tool box in the pickup and use it when you need to. If you really keep up on the recommended maintenance, you'll be very unlikely to have to go thru all the troubleshooting 'learning curve' hurdles."
 
"I ordered a manual for the en

"I ordered a manual for the engine, but I do not have an owners manual for the transmission and can't order one since I don't know what kind of transmission. I will try and run the boat this weekend and burn up some of that bad gas. Any answer to the other questions? Thanks again,
Shannon"
 
"Shannon:

The "engine&#

"Shannon:

The "engine" owners manual will have the basics for the "marine gear". Given the timeframe, I'd bet money that you have a pair of Borg Warner "velvet drives" behind your engines. their basic construction/maintenance is the same. The differences start with the different gear ratios and how they are implemented, internally.

For your other questions:

1)Know nobody in Freeport.
2) see previous post
3) see previous
4) see previous (see this link for a start ->http://www.simplicity-marine.com/velvetdrive-borgwarner.htm ) There is an ID plate/tag on the top of the gear - you'll see 1017/1018 in the number on that tag - its that simple.
5) sea cocks or strainers?

The sea cock performs the raw water shutoff function and has a lever - see good marine catalog. The strainer should be the next item in the cooling line. They usually have wingnuts on the top. these are removed and the lid is extracted - then you should be able to get the basket out. Flush it out - brush it off and flush it again. Also rinsh any crud remaining in the body of the strainer. reassemble and make sure the gaskets/seals function.

These are typically supplied with 'clear' bodies...if you can see thru the basket, you shouldn't have to mess with it.

If these are located in the hard-to-get-at spot, I'd be inclined to move them over the winter. If your sea cocks are inaccessible, you really should relocate them over the winter.

Check out similar boats at your marina...most owners are proud enough to show you the good and the bad on their stuff. You can usually go inspecting at a boatyard...just make sure the owner is there and you ASK before Looking. A couple cold refreshments can usually get more than equal opinions...if you get enough opinions saying the same thing, its probably more truth than anything else.

Your Carbs are Qjets, probably the 170 series like on mine. Unless you get salt water in the gas, or something else gums them up, they are pretty reliable. I'd encourage you to leave them alone if they are working. you can't tell much is wrong by looking at the outside beyond the obvious - broken linkage, fuel fitting leakings, etc. make sure that the four nuts securing it to the manifold are hand tight - lean condition will cause overheating, especially with the loads boats make."
 
"shannon,
Wow, another phoeni

"shannon,
Wow, another phoenix 29 owner, I'm excited. I too have a 29 phoenix and have learned ALOT in the last year, most of the learning was painful. I would pull the raw water hose off of the exchanger and compare the flow from port to starboard and you will verify that the sea strainers and the raw water pumps are OK without too much effort ( only for a few seconds on each motor). If they are the same amount of flow, then I would definately guess the heat exchanger needs to be cleaned and pressure tested. As far as your stalling at Idle, first make sure nothing is wrapped around your shafts (fishing line, crab line, etc) then check and see if the idle setting is too low. Mine idles about 750 rpms for each motor. If you are idling at 500, you will probably stall when put in gear. If the boat has sat for a long time, you may just want to make a long run, and see if the idle is higher after the run since you've "cleaned the pipes". By the way,on my heat exchangers, the zinc pencil was removed and used as a discharge port to cool my shafts. That zinc would have saved my exchanger. If you don't have a zinc pencil, then get one soon."
 
".."If they did run a heav

".."If they did run a heavier oil due to the cold in New York, could that be causing the engine heat?"

Hey! You think we live in the freakin' Arctic or something! (No difference.)

You need to drain and drain and drain the water separators as you put hours on the boat, and the fuel filters as well.

Jeff"
 
"Thanks for all the answers gu

"Thanks for all the answers guys. I looked long and hard for the Phoenix, I think it is a lot of boat for 29'. Would have probably went another route (ie CC) if not for the family needs. I love the boat. I took it for a 20 mile run Saturday. You all are not going to believe me when I say the boat engines both idle at 200 RPM (in or out of gear). Yes that is 200 RPM. The first tick on the guage (3 more ticks gives 1000RMP). I suspect from what I have read that that is low. I can have it out of gear and Idle at this RPM for a long time. It only seems to be a pain after it warms up. Also I was loosing RPMs on the starboard engine at about 3000 RPM. Then I went and ran it in the intercoastal and she ran fine (maybe blew the pipes?) I will have a pro check the idle (i am mechanically illiterate). What really concerns me though, is that running at cruise (about 3000 RPM) The starboard engine will run 190 degrees, the port is at 185. I believe I read that 195 is absolute max. I have about 1/2 of the bad gas left in the tank. Have added startron. Don't know if I want to pull any hoses off the exchanger (since I don't have a clue) And again I am clueless about the zinc pencil. My engine manual still has not come in. I know I have not given you much, but I welcome your suggestions. Thanks for helping a newbie out, sorry for being so ignorant.
FastJeff- I changed the oil to 15w40 ( what I read is called for over 50degrees F) And the fuel filters (I believe these are water seperators/fuel filters- does this make sense? They are WIX 33436.) I did both these things myself WAHOO! Probably saved a bunch of $$.

Thanks,
Shannon"
 
"Shannon:

Don't go nuts

"Shannon:

Don't go nuts over what those gages read, for they can be off a bunch (and usualy are). Buy yourself a non-contact, infared temp gun ($50) and keep it on board. With it you can be sure what's happening and see if the exhaust system is running the same temps on both sides of the engine. Great, essential tool!

Jeff"
 
"I am still getting conflictin

"I am still getting conflicting information.

1. What exactly is the correct oil for 1986 350CID 270HP Crusaders? I hope 15W40, cause thats what i put in her.
2. What are the correct running temperatures for these engines? I have heard everything from 160 to 185.

Thanks

S"
 
"Shannon:

I've had 15W-

"Shannon:

I've had 15W-40 synthetic in my big blocks for going on 20 years now ( > 3500 hrs w/ one rebuild) and have had a bit of problems.

Mine are fresh water cooled (FWC) with 160 thermostats - both idle @ 160 and at 3000 rpm cruise will run 170-180 depending upon the sea water temp flowing in.

The first thing that usually clogs up, beyond the strainer, is the oil cooler. Look at the inboard, bottom of the "U". You should see a pipe plug going in, horizontally. Pull it out - 9/16" wrench if it is hex head and 3/8" if it is square. See if you can catch the "stuff" that comes out. If you see little "flakes" about the shade of ashes (or darker), that is the residue from the zinc pencils. These screw into the bottom of the pipe plugs.

When new, the zincs are ~ 1.75" long, depending upon the brand. My owner's manual says change them every 30 days. If you run the boat much, this is a good interval. You may get up to two months but risk the "clogging" event. For a couple of bucks each, it isn't worth the risk to extend the interval much over 30 days.

You can also back flush the cooler by removing the hose From the oil cooler To the heat exchanger. Get a 1.25" ID piece of hose, a reducer, and a garden hose female fitting. Go to a good hardware store and tell the service rep you have to connect a garden hose to a 1.25" hose barb fitting and they should be able to get you going.

You may want to get a few extra clamps, too. Hook up the clear 1.25" Hose end to the oil cooler and the dock hose to the other end. Remove the zinc and turn on the hose. Probably good idea to close the sea cock, too. Watch watch comes out of the cooler. turn the hose on and off a few times, letting it run a few minutes each time. When it runs clear, you should be ok.

Based on my memory, there are about 25 holes for the water to flow thru the cooler, anything bigger than an eraser will plug a hole. It only takes three holes to be plugged to reduce the efficiency of the cooler. The bigger impact is reducing the water to the heat exchanger and the rest of the exhaust system."
 
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