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Converting Crusader 220 to electronic Ignitionany advice

T

tailspnr

Contributing Member
"I'm running '79 crusa

"I'm running '79 crusadr 220's on my 1979 Carver Mariner and I just ordered rebuild kits for the carbs and I'm considering electronic ignition kits that use the stock cap, rotor and coil for about $125.

Good investment or should I re-think?"
 
Make sure what ever you use is

Make sure what ever you use is the marine version. I had a friend who tryed one of thee kits and it ran great for two days and then the moister got to it and it just quit working.
 
"Petronix makes a unit that us

"Petronix makes a unit that uses the stock points cam to trigger itself. Super easy to set up, and the unit does away with the condenser as well. More than 125 bucks, though--more like 180 or so--but it's marine rated.

Jeff"
 
"make sure you know what you&#

"make sure you know what you're buying... an "electronic ignition" is a much higher voltage system than the standard ignitions. What you may be looking at is a "Point Set eliminator". These get rid of many issues associated with breaker points but don't do anything to improve the spark itself.

I prefer the higher voltage with a full electronic ignition. If you are happy with your current setup and just want to eliminate the maintenance associated with the breaker points, those kits are worth while. If you'd like to have a bit hotter spark, spring for the real mccoy.

Also suggest checking the advance mechanism while you are into the distributor; after 20 years, it probably needs a bit of attention, too."
 
"Thanks Mark, I was thinking a

"Thanks Mark, I was thinking about the advance mechanism as well, in that it probably needs some attention as you mentioned. Would the 79' Crusader 220's have a vacuum advance setup? I didn't look too close but from I recall I didn't see any vacuum lines running to the distributor.

And yes, I'm just looking to eliminate the headaches associated with the points setup. Speaking of which, do you know if the ballast resistor is still used to lower the voltage to the coils when using the conversion kit?"
 
"No vacuum advance in the mari

"No vacuum advance in the marine environment - leak path to a spark source. I've never seen one on a factory prepared engine.

The ballast resistor's purpose is to limit the current flowing thru the primary side of the ignition. Whether you need it or not should be spelled out in the kit's instructions. If you're using the Mallory kit, their instructions are on line. My limited experience says you keep the ballast if it was OEM supplied"
 
It's my undestanding that

It's my undestanding that the ballast resistor is used to rduce the voltage from 12v down to about 9v to keep from burning up the points. And if thats the case by eliminating the points then you might be able to run without the resistor and thus increase the spark voltage some.

But I ordered the Sierra kit from here so we'll see what it does.
 
And a question on the timing a

And a question on the timing advance........does it just use a centrifigal / spring setup to advance the timing since no vacuum?
 
"read the kit's instructio

"read the kit's instructions before removing any existing ballast resistor.

Most older ignitions provide timing advance via the "weights & springs" approach.

BTW a vacuum advance typically provides "advance" under idle or light load conditions. Most all auto type distributors with vacuum advance also have the centrifugal, mechanical advance."
 
I just received my pertronix e

I just received my pertronix electronic ignition conversion kit along with a Crusader XL service manual from the site. In looking through the instructions with the kit as well as the service manual I cannot locate the basic initial timing instructions. The XL service manual soes not cover the old points style ignition (believe it or not) and the new conversion kit does not cover the initial timing reccomendations.

does anyone out there have this info that they are willing to share?
 
From what I've found in th

From what I've found in the archives it appears that 10 degrees advanced at 650 rpms should be the initial setting.

Looking for advice. thanks
 
that's a good nominal star

that's a good nominal starting point...should be a plate with a knockout plug behind the flywheel.

The best way is to set the timing at full advance and live with the retarded value given.
 
"Mark, are you suggesting to s

"Mark, are you suggesting to set the timing for the full advanced setting at say 26 degrees at 4000 rpm, and then live with what ever I have at the lower RPM's just as way to compensate for the inherently poor performing mechanical advance mechanism?


And if so wouldn't that cause the lower RPM's to run further advanced than normal rather than retarded, since typically the advance mechanism doesn't advance as far as it should over time due to wear, rust and such? And if that's the case doesn't running too far advanced cause spark knocking and lean conditions? That's always been the case on the old Harley v-twins that I've ridden and worked on for years."
 
"I didn't use the phrase &

"I didn't use the phrase "poorly performing".

My suggestion was to set the timing using the "full advance" parameter as the point of optimization.

My old iron head sportster's 'timing procedure' used just the approach I suggested. In accumulating the 60000 miles I put on it before transfering title, I only had timing issues when the advance springs broke."
 
LOL....are you saying my HD&#3

LOL....are you saying my HD's are "poorly performing"? Just kidding......of course all of my HD's use electronic ignitions now so I just set the timing by the book......actually I adjust for optimum performance and nit by the book.

But I understand what you saying. I plan to fully inspect the springs and mechanical advance mechanism as well as test to see if they are both advancing properly. My thoughts on doing so were to set at 10 BTDC at 650 rpms and look to see if it advances the timing to 26 degrees BTDC at 4000 rpms. If I see a large discrepancy I will look for alternatives. If the advance is only slightly off I may take your suggestion and set it for optimum at 4k rpms.

Sound logical?
 
"I don't believe you would

"I don't believe you would have to go as high as 4K to see the maximum advance. More like 2500 I believe.

And regarding the old vacuum advance units on automobiles, wasn't it more or a vacuum retard unit where it would retard the advance during periods of heavy acceleration. When you stomped on the pedal, there was no vacuum and the breaker plate would rotate opposite to timing advance. Sure it would advance the timing during idle speed or steady speed operation...hence vacuum advance when vacuum existed."
 
"Thanks for the info guys. As

"Thanks for the info guys. As always these forums are a wealth of info.

But as for me, when it rains it pours. Today has been brakes on the truck then a radiator in car. Talk about bad luck. I hope to get down to the boat tomorrow to install the ignition kits.

My plan is to install the ignition kits and get the timing set right before I remove the carbs to rebuild them. I figure it's best to troubleshoot one thing at a time versus installing both and not where the pototential problems are that I'm chasing.

Thanks again for the help. I'll report back once I'm done and let you all know how it went."
 
"Vacuum retard was used for NO

"Vacuum retard was used for NOx emissions control in the 70's. But yes, for performance, vacuum advance allowed for more advance on light throttle settings, and then reduce advance when throttle is advanced and pinging may occur as the engine is working harder with less manifold vacuum. Vacuum retard was also sometimes used to control a hot engine, by increasing the idle speed."
 
and most of the advance mechan

and most of the advance mechansims were controlled via a thermal switch....glad we never see that mess on a true marine engine.
 
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