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Boat flooding

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kmaub1

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First of all I'm new here and i just want to say hi to all.

Second my wife and I along with our daughter and her boyfriend went to get our boat out of the water today and bring her home for the end of the season cleaning and maintenance and when I took the cover off i couldn't believe what I was seeing!
She had taken on water up to my knees:(

First question is why would this happen and second question what do I have to do as far as repairs to the engine as it was fully under water passed the oil dipstick and the alternator was submerged as well. But the carb didn't go under water!

I have taken out the battery and put it on the charger drained the water from the engine through the oil pan drain and sprayed all the wiring with WD 40.
Do I have to pull the motor and take it apart or should this be all I need to do other than finding out why it flooded.
We put her in the water May 1st of this year and all was great till this week.

it is a 1995 bayliner Capri 20' with a mercuser 3L and an alfa-one out drive
 
I would spray ignition parts etc. with wire dryer, pull dipstick as soon as possible, if milky colored get some cheap oil and keep changing until it looks normal, have seen some engines go under like that and were OK. alt. will probably be OK but you will probably need a new starter. start changing oil asap,sooner the better. if possible after a few oil changes start engine to warm up oil for better viscosity to get more crud flowing from oil. does the bilge pump work or are the batt/s dead? is a bellows leaking ? thru hull leaking etc. find the leak.
 
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...it is a 1995...
Click to expand...

Have you ever replaced the OD bellows? Check the drive shaft bellows to cracks. Replace all 3 bellows and water inlet hose at one time. Over the winter install a minimum 500 GPM (1,000 GPM preferred) automatic bilge pump with its own deep cycle battery. Since you keep the boat on the water consider installing a warning alarm in paralell w/the pump. You can use the same type of alarm used by the engine. If it goes off while you are away perhaps someone working at the dock will notice it sounding and contact you.
 
plan on replacing the trim pump, steering cable,alt, starter,battery cables and pull the drive to drain the bellows.
 
the boat was dry up to this weekend

we went out fishing last sunday on Sept. 18 and we were troling for about 6 hours came back to dock ran the bilge pump no water dry as a bone and today it was flooded.

I don't have an auto bilge pump but I will for next year for sure.

I have already changed out the oil once and pulled the oil filter (no water in the oil filter) so that I think is a good sign!

I will run it again and change it out see where I am.

Fingers crossed! Hope it is ok!


I will change out the bellows this fall before putting it in storage
 
fresh water, you are probably ok. find the leak, and dry everything out. if it's the bellows, (likely) the drive will need some work too. don't get overwelmed. you can do this.
 
Water up to your knees, eh?
If you're a short person, this may not mean much, but if you tall like the gal in Lelie Neilson's "N a k e d Gun" movie, you're in trouble! :D :D

Hope won't get you very far! You'd best pull everything apart NOW, rather than later!
Do what's being suggested by the guys here!
Change engine oil/filter........, run the engine up to temp...., change the oil/filter again...., run the engine up to temp again...., take a good look at the oil again.
You may need to replace the starter motor before this can even be done! Hard to say!


Since no one has bothered to mention this, I'll take the liberty of doing so.
What are doing mooring this boat without an adequate bilge pump connected to a float switch with "Un-Interruptible" power to it?????
If this boat was to sink due to defered maintenance and/or neglect, your insurance company has a free "get out of jail" card!

Plus, if you were to wire this correctly, you can connect an alarm or buzzer in with it.
This way if any slip mates were to hear your alarm cycle, they can notify the marina.... the marina can then give you a phone call!
A good battery bank will operate a bilge pump for quite a few cycles, until you or help arrives.

Good luck.... hope you can catch everything early enough!

Edit:
I see in post 5 you mention installing a pump for next season.
If so, be sure that you understand that the "Auto-Off-Manual" helm switches should NEVER be used.
You will want a ON-OFF helm switch, and a seperate float switch that is powered in such a way that this power CANNOT be turned OFF!
The float switch power should be totally independant from the helm switch.

Say NO to these..... these will get us in trouble:
images
 
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You keep the boat in a wet slip, and don't have an automatic bilge pump?

Uh... don't install one for next year... install TWO! ...and a dual battery setup.

One pump on each battery, connected directly to the battery with their own fuses (i.e., not through the disconnect switch). Complete redundant systems. If one battery dies or craps out, or one of the pumps gets a hunk of goo stuck in it, the boat will still have the ability to dewater. Set one float switch just a bit (1/2" or so) higher than the other.
 
Well Ricardo,
Like i said in my post this boat has always been dry ever since it was put in the water plus the three years prior to me purchacing the boat from the owner as he docked it before me. Prior to that I can't say as I'm the thrid owner. If this was a situation that was I knew I was going to get myself into I would have had an after market auto swithch installed with it's own power supply. Hind sight being 20/20 and all. But funny as I had the boat checked by a marine machanic of my choosing (before any money changed hands) a suggestion by the fellow I purchaced it from never even mention this as percaution and knew I was putting it in the marina just down the road from him. I have been on a lot of boats in the same marina as me and at others where it isn't common the have such a set up. Not a good idea as I learned the hard way. Looking for some advice from other boaters on here is why I posted to get a scolding from sombody is not what I was looking for. I have a situation where I'm hoping my baby is ok and yes not going to break the bank plus to see if I can do the repairs.
But thanks for pointing out my stupidity for letting this happen.

I will certinly let a few of my boating friends know the problems they could face by not having an auto hook up in their boats.

And I guess the answer to the first comment is no I'm not that tall so I should that god for my short parents! LOL

The battery is still taking a charge and testing good on load so there's a hundred I don't have to spend the starter and alternator are off and ready to drop off for repair if possible as the motor wouldn't turn over just clicking so I can't even run it to heat the oil for the 2nd oil change. I'm hoping to get them turned around real fast to install tonight!

The bellows are instock so I'll be picking them up as well. being a sunday I couldn't get a price.


I'll keep updated as I go along
 
troym said:
You keep the boat in a wet slip, and don't have an automatic bilge pump?
I know...... a chew'd his behind also.
Sorry KMAUB1......... Just look'n out for you! :D

One pump on each battery, connected directly to the battery with their own fuses (i.e., not through the disconnect switch). Complete redundant systems. If one battery dies or craps out, or one of the pumps gets a hunk of goo stuck in it, the boat will still have the ability to dewater. Set one float switch just a bit (1/2" or so) higher than the other.
Click to expand...
Troym, I take issue with the "direct battery connection" and with not using the MBSS. (see further down below).

As for the float switch elevation..... I fully agree with you.
Actually, any float switch should be mounted at an elevation higher than the pump's lowest draw-down ability.
Otherwise, you may find a pump running continuously as a result of the float not being able to turn the pump off.

I'm in/around these often. I do V/P work, and I also do marine electrical work, including bilge pumps, float switches, helm switches, etc.
I take a pretty hard stand against these Man-Off-Auto helm switches... so bear with me:

1.... a direct battery connection for a float switch is not preferred. Here's why.
small terminal corrosion that occurs at direct battery connections.
forgetting to re-connect during battery R&R.
For me...... cables ONLY at batteries!

The rear terminals of your MBSS (main battery selector switch) are a perfect location for any additional connections.
This would NOT necessarily be the "Common" terminal..... this will be either #1 or #2 terminal..... which ever is the largest battery bank.... usually #2!
These two are "Un-Interruptible" 12 v power sources......... the "common" is interruptible!
We want "Un-Interruptible" power for a float switch!
This makes it permanent, no small terminal corrosion, no accidental removal, always powered..... and yes, it can and should be fused!

2... the Manual-OFF-Auto helm switch can become accidentally bumped OFF, or forgotten to be left in the "Auto" mode.
For me, these are NOT a good idea, and should NEVER be used.

I'd be OK if these were to default to "Auto" mode (i.e., powering the float switch), and come with instructions that demand that an "Un-Interruptible" power source be connected to them... not hull harness power that could be turned OFF!

But as they are now, too many do not understand the risks in using them.
Quite honestly I wish that they'd be taken off the market!

Use at your own risk! :D
 
KMAUB1, you don't necessarily need your replacement parts now.
What you'll want to do, is to take all of this apart now, so that you'll begin the drying process, and be able to assess the damage, and perhaps prevent further damage from occurring.

Was this in fresh water, or in salt water????

.
 
I understand how you feel there are so many opinions on what should be on anyones boat it gets overwhelming especially when you trust a manufacturer to build a safe product with protections built in by the pros. What I did after buying our latest boat Sea Ray 270SE Sundancer was contacted the Coast Guard Auxillary to have a safety inspection done they will come to your marina or you can trailer the boat to them. It is a free service provided for all boaters to find any safety concerns before it's a disaster. They put a Coast Guard Safety Inspection sticker on your port window after passing this lets any patrol know you at least have minimum safety equipment without boarding you. I learned a few things about my boat that could have been a disaster (like a missing positive battery shield cover).
As everyone has stated do wire a dedicated power source to your bilge pump and CO monitor if it has one if not get one. I would suggest if you can use shore power to leave it plugged in while docked if you can't look into installing a battery tender to keep your batteries fully charged. Also you can do several oil changes now without the starter be sure and pull the distributor now to dry it out then use a drill motor to turn your oil pump it will build up more than enough pressure to get any water out after pressure builds use a breaker bar to rotate the crankshaft this will open all oil passages.
Good Luck
 
Good point re; trusting the OEM. I've seen many boats set up with these Man-Off-Auto switches.
I've also seen many set up with O/B charger leads connected directly to batteries.
Perhaps the engineers aren't forward thinking enough! :mad:

As for opinions...... you are correct. Opinions are just that... Opinions.
However, my life's experience has shown me that by the end of day, some opinions carry their salt, and some do not.

Take the 12v CO dedector, for example.
Many are set up to be powered via the Un-interruptibe power side of the system, and when so, are known to become sources of an unwanted power drain.
My thoughts are, if you were to leave the boat unattended, then there's no need for continued CO dedection.

I'm not sleeping on my boat unless the O/B 12 vdc power is ON........ frig, anchor light, etc, all require 12vdc.
When I'm not O/B, I cut my O/B 12vdc power (w/ exception to the Un-interruptible side).

IMO, unless you cut the main 12 vdc power while sleeping O/B, there's no need for a CO dedector to be powered via the Un-interruptibe power side. It can just as well be on the Interruptible side!

Opinion, yes.... but see if that carries any salt! ;)

.
 
Ricardo,
Concurr with using the terminals on the battery cut-off switches as the preferred place to make the direct (Always Hot) connection. My point was to not be on the other side of the switch so as to turn the bilge pumps off when the battery switch goes to "off" before leaving the boat.
BZ on identifing having the float switch above the pump suction too!
Also, in lieu of the Man-Off-Auto helm switches, I prefer a manual switch at the helm, that runs electrically parallel to the float switch. I like having the ability to pump out that little bit of water below the float switch setpoint every once in a while... especially when I trip over the bait bucket and half a bucket of squid juice goes down the deck drain...
The toggle switch I have on the helm also has an indicating lamp associated with the switch so I'm less likely to foget about it and leave it on till it kills the battery.
 
I agree there is no need for CO detection with DC power off my battery switch only leaves the bilge pumps on. If connected to shore power or running a battery tender to maintain batteries I would prefer having the CO detector on in case of a battery failure and possible fire.
 
Bob, agreed on all points! :D

As for the helm switch being paralled with the float switch.... this too I fully agree with, and is exactly why we can connect into this same circuit for an alarm or buzzer.
The MBSS need not be ON in order for this circuit to become live!

Had the OP's boat been set up like this, someone may have noticed the issue early enough to have spared him these problems.
 
Ricardo,
I guess maybe you hit a soft spot as I always had it in the back of my mind I should have and now it's a could have but ddin't. Now I just need to get it dry and in working condition.

All of the views are helpfull and taken to heart! Thanks all for your posts.


Went to pick up my parts today and the guy tells me he can rebuild mine for have the price of a the new ones (starter and alternator)

I have had both done in my car before so this should be ok as far as a boat i'm sure.

problem is a week longer.
 
1995 mercuser 3.0L uses the small staggard bolt pattern starter motor.
You can buy a good HTGR/PMGR motor for about the cost (or less) of over-hauling one.
These spin the armature approximately 3:1, and will usually outperform the OEM non-gear reduction units.
All new everything..... case, armature, contact brushes, permanent magnets, nose and reduction gears, pinion gear, solenoid, etc!



The mounting bolt length is often different, so be sure to get the bolts that are intended for it.
Some of these are being sold for under $100.


I'd not waist a dime on over-hauling a 16 year old non-gear reduction starter motor, if this is what you now have.
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.


 
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This thread is a great source of information about bilge systems and how they should and should not be set up.
Thanks to all who have posted so far.

Rod
 
She's alive!

she's alive! :)

well the gods were smilin on me today. I checked with a little know boat repair guy been in the biz for about 25 years semi retired a friend at work remided me about him and he had the starter on the shelf and it's the same one in your pick (Ricardo) as this is the only one he gets! as replacements $126 and change with taxes plus he kept the old one (no worries as I wont be needin it!)

Cleaned up and tested the alternator good to go.

I changed out the oil one more time cold and refilled 3rd time

I put on the starter and alternator with a new belt :)

Cleaned and sprayed all the wiring again cleaned plugs and turned over a couple of times with out the plugs in with the water going to the lower unit!

Reinstalled plugs and fingers crossed ........LIFE! with the old plugs ran a little rough for a bit but smoothed out like before warmed up nice charging system is working! Oil pressure perfect!


Shut her down and drained the oil still draining new oil filter installed and will refill in about 20 min!


A couple more oil changes and I can start replacing the bellows maybe this weekend.......and installing the auto bilge pump


again guys thanks for all your help here much much appreciated ! :)
 
Next thing you need to do is go buy a LOTTERY TICKET. It's great to hear all is well to many times the only winners in these problems are the parts sellers and mechanics you're really lucky there wasn't more to replace. Keep reading these forums you can learn a lot I learn something new almost everyday, next time you'll be able to help someone else. Boats are almost a full time job but well worth it when you have something like a pod of Orcas surface next to you or see one of the poster type sunsets.
 
Bob & Sue said:
Next thing you need to do is go buy a LOTTERY TICKET. It's great to hear all is well to many times the only winners in these problems are the parts sellers and mechanics you're really lucky there wasn't more to replace. Keep reading these forums you can learn a lot I learn something new almost everyday, next time you'll be able to help someone else. Boats are almost a full time job but well worth it when you have something like a pod of Orcas surface next to you or see one of the poster type sunsets.
Click to expand...

well said.
 
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