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Are my winterization steps good for my 2003 4.3 MC engine?

this is a repeat of my post #11

Jason Denzel said:
So I wanted to attach some pics of what I did. I took all 5 plugs out which are not in this pic (too hard to take pics of those. I let them all drain thoroughly.
Make sure that you probe these drain ports to ensure that all water will drain out.

I took off the 4 hoses shown in the pic. let those drain (although there was not much to drain after the plugs. I poured AF into each of the 4 hoses. Mostly 1/4-1/2 gallon per hose. I did notice AF coming out the back once filled on 3 of the 4 hoses.
The one hose did not seem to empty out the back like the others did. I must have poured over half a gallon in this one. so I called it good there. This hose was the bottom left (bigger) hose.
This larger hose would connectd to the Stbd side of Circulating pump.... correct?
If so.... that would be the Circ Pump suction hose.
This plug will allow water to drain from the Circ Pump.

From my description and pics can you tell if I am missing anything?
Again....... adding AF is unnecessary..... it simply gives some of us that "Feel Good Feeling".
If Hell Bent on doing this.... just make certain that there is no residual water that could possibly dilute the AF.
Better yet..... drain it again afterwards.

Just plain ole air will not freeze expand and crack our expensive cast iron components.



I also sprayed fogging oil into carb till engine stopped. This was done before all of the above.
Two points:

1...... Fogging a carbureted V engine requires us to spray an equal amount of fogging solution into each primary throttle bore.
Reason.... these engines use a dual plane intake manifold. Each plane delivers fuel/air to 3 cylinders (V-6 engines) 4 cylinders (V-8 engines).
If we miss one plane, we also miss 3 or 4 cylinders.


2..... It's best if we do not allow the fogging solution to kill the engine.
Instead, have a second person hold 1,200 rpm while you introduce the fogging oil.
Have that person continue to hold the 1,200 rpm throttle position and cut the ignition while you continue spraying the fogging oil until the engine comes to rest.
This ensusres that the fogging oil did not undergo combustion.

Proper fogging can take place within 10 seconds or so.

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Fogging of 4 stroke engines from my prospective is not needed.

Fogging of 2 stroke engines is.

2 stroke engines use roller bearing on the cranks and wrist pins. They are directly behind the intake manifold.

The fogging agent coats these bearings and surfaces because they are exposed to moisture when in storage.

4 stoke engines use a lead Babbitt bearing on the cranks and cam and a bushing on the wrist pin. They are not behind the intake manifold.

These do not need any fogging for short term storage as there is no metal to metal contact.


if you think that fogging a 4 stroke will some how keep the piston rings from rusting or what ever........not so. The fogging agent gets combusted.....


Anyway fogging a 4 stroke is for those who want it done for there own satisfaction and as stated for the Anitfreeze it give a warm and fuzzy feeling..........to each there own.


As I stated in my earlier posts, I have done a couple thousand winterizations over the years, I have used my method as describe, I have NOT had one failure.

So in my opinion the proof is in the results..........RV antifreeze is NONTOXIC and will not harm the environment, therefore using it does no harm to motor or anything else..........
 
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kghost said:
Fogging of 4 stroke engines from my prospective is not needed.
Properly "Fogging" a 4 stroke engine adds protection to the valves, seats, cylinder walls, and to some degree piston rings!

Fogging of 2 stroke engines is.
2 stroke engines use roller bearing on the cranks and wrist pins. They are directly behind the intake manifold.
2 stroke engines run on oil enriched gasoline.


The fogging agent coats these bearings and surfaces because they are exposed to moisture when in storage.
As are the upper area 4 stroke engine components...... no more or no less!

4 stroke engines use a lead Babbitt bearing on the cranks and cam and a bushing on the wrist pin. They are not behind the intake manifold.
Correct.... these components are within the oil laden crankcase area.

These do not need any fogging for short term storage as there is no metal to metal contact.
Agreed...... but again, these components are within the oil laden crankcase area.


if you think that fogging a 4 stroke will some how keep the piston rings from rusting or what ever........ not so. The fogging agent gets combusted.....
If done in an educated fashion, I would disagree.
This is why we want to hold a fast idle speed (1,200+ rpm or so) while the fogging oil is introduced.
The ignition will then be cut while the fogging process is continued.
The last of the fogging oil will not have undergone combustion!

Whereas when/if we allow the fogging oil to kill the engine, much of the it has undergone combustion.
2 stroke or 4 stroke........ where's the advantage of fogging, if we allow the fogging oil to combust or partially combust?



Anyway fogging a 4 stroke is for those who want it done for there own satisfaction and as stated for the Anitfreeze it gives a warm and fuzzy feeling.......... to each their own.
Agreed!
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The website is a great help, I am a do it yourselfer from Northern Va.


When I bought my first boat 6 years ago a 25 ft. Sterndrive Merc. 350 mag, I purchased a product called WinterFlush. So that I could save money and learn how to winterize my own boats for years to come. The Winterflush company had a website and videos online. It looks to be home owners part-time garage company that has gone out of business. Great solution and product, I think I paid $150. After owning the Winterflush and seeing the components and process. It is nothing more than a 5 gallon bucket cut down to fit under the stern leg and a bilge pump in the bottom of the bucket with 3/4 “ tube or garden hose to a threaded fitting that connects to Muffs. This is the supply side. The return or discharge is a fitted and sewed heavy duty plastic tarp that sits into metal structure. When assembled together its sits under the stern leg and catches the fluids coming out of the engine and drains into the bucket and recycled. The tarp and structure could be rigged up with zip ties. In short the system takes antifreeze and recycles it back thru the engine.


This is my process:


Drain as much holding water from the engine and drain plugs as possible. Do not take off the hoses, just drain plugs and engine block drain.
I replace my water/fuel filter and disconnect my main gas line to a 5 gallon portable tank that is filled with fresh gas, stabil, 2 cycle oil. (Mercruiser Mixture) to fog the engine.
I setup my Winterflush under my drive, connect my muffs and open 8 gallons of west marine green antifreeze. And get ready.
I will turn on the engine,
The water take will suck up the antifreeze from the 5 gallon bucket immediately. I will continue to add antifreeze to the process until the recycling fluid stands with 8 to 10 inches on antifreeze in the bucket.
The antifreeze in recycling from the bucket thru the engine.
I will run my engine for 30 mins. On a slow idle, The antifreeze will become hotter and hotter 140 to 160 degrees because it is running thru the engine. (You must be careful not to overheat the engine, and may have to need to shut down the engine for a period of time).
After the engine has been running for a while and the flush is ready to be finished I will throttle up the RPMS to condition plugs, and blow a heavy gray fog for a 1-2 minutes.
I shutdown the engine,
With the engine still hot, I will change the oil and filter
I have the option of draining the cooling system and engine block or not. I have done it both ways.
I can also reuse some of the green antifreeze next year.


Am I good!


John
Fairfax, Va.
 
What about the fuel in the gas tank??? That needs to be stabilized......................

There are many methods............like I said for me, mine works, Cost under $10.00.

Fluids, filters done in the spring..........(Spring Service)
 
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3-legged-dog said:
This is my process:


Drain as much holding water from the engine and drain plugs as possible.
Great idea and should be protocol!
Many do not take the time to do this and end up with residual water that may dilute the AF.

Do not take off the hoses, just drain plugs and engine block drain.
We should at least remove the circulating pump suction hose and drain down the circ pump.

I replace my water/fuel filter and disconnect my main gas line to a 5 gallon portable tank that is filled with fresh gas, stabil, 2 cycle oil. (Mercruiser Mixture) to fog the engine.
I'm not suggesting that we NOT do this, nor that it's a bad idea........, but please understand that this is NOT "fogging" an engine! This is introducing an oil enriched fuel mixture into the fuel delivery system.
Fogging is performed on carbureted engines, and in some cases via a special port on FI systems.



I setup my Winterflush under my drive, connect my muffs and open 8 gallons of west marine green antifreeze. And get ready.
I will turn on the engine,
The water take will suck up the antifreeze from the 5 gallon bucket immediately. I will continue to add antifreeze to the process until the recycling fluid stands with 8 to 10 inches on antifreeze in the bucket.
The antifreeze in recycling from the bucket thru the engine.
I will run my engine for 30 mins. On a slow idle, The antifreeze will become hotter and hotter 140 to 160 degrees because it is running thru the engine. (You must be careful not to overheat the engine, and may have to need to shut down the engine for a period of time).
After the engine has been running for a while and the flush is ready to be finished I will throttle up the RPMS to condition plugs, and blow a heavy gray fog for a 1-2 minutes.
I shutdown the engine,
With the engine still hot, I will change the oil and filter
The time to change the oil and oil filter would be prior to all of this... not afterwards!

I have the option of draining the cooling system and engine block or not. I have done it both ways.
I can also reuse some of the green antifreeze next year.
Once again.... please read this write up regarding these so called winterizing kits.
In the wrong hands...... they can be dangerous.

http://www.amazon.com/review/R3BD7X6QC3KCFR/ref=cm_cr_pr_viewpnt#R3BD7X6QC3KCFR
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Continued Boat Winterization on the other systems,


Freshwater system, gravity/pump drain the system including the water heater and holding tanks as much as possible, close the system and fill holding tank with pink antifreeze to top run pumps.
Open and run each faucet at a time, Running both hot and cold systems. Close when both show pink for a period of time. Each faucet/run at 1 time. make to open every system including your hand held shower faucet, deck shower wash down and I will pour pink antifreeze down my shower drain to prime my front bilge pump. Again pour pink for a period of time until you hear discharge from the system.


AC, and water intake pipe, open the water inlet valve to drain any water standing in the pipe. Then Close the valve. My AC system also has a threaded ¾” fitting in-line of the piping system. I attach a hose and a container of green antifreeze and turn on the ac system. Green antifreeze will run thru the system. Stop after a period of time when you see green antifreeze being discharged thru the drain outside the boat. Disconnect the system. Open water intake pipe valve to discharge any free standing green antifreeze in the system. And make sure to close the water take valve so you don’t forget in the spring and sink your boat.


70 gallon Fuel Tank, in my last post I spoke about making a 5 gallon mixture of what mercury calls a fogging recipe. I don’t know if it works or not from some of the comments here. Mercury says to and I found other really good posts related to the process. So I do it and my engine starts every season like a champ. I will fill my fuel tank almost full, add more than I should of sta-bil, and pour 3 gallons of my left over mix into the boats gas tank. I keep a gallon and fill my gas power tools for the winter. After filling your tools, fire the tool up to prime the system and shutdown. Every starts right up again in the spring.


Batteries come out, and our stored off the concrete floor in the garage. I empty the boat of personal items hit the boat with a pressure washer, clean the seats, if the head was used a lot I have its gets sucked out, if not I pour some green down the toilet.


Finally I take the props off, sterndrive off and store in the garage, I run grease and lube on the moving parts indicated in the maintenance manuals. And read this website and others.


Am I good, what would you add.


John,
Fairfax, VA.
03 25’ Crownline CCR,
 
John, if I may....., I have a few obersvations to share with you.

3-legged-dog said:
Continued Boat Winterization on the other systems,


Freshwater system, gravity/pump drain the system including the water heater and holding tanks as much as possible, close the system and fill holding tank with pink antifreeze to top run pumps.
"Holding Tank" generally refers to the waste tank. Did you mean potable water tank?

If so, there is no need to fill a potable water tank with the pink RV antifreeze. 2 or 3 gallons should be more than enough to purge the entire Hot and Cold system.
The potabale water side of the WH will be completely drained and the plumbing will be placed into "by-pass" mode, so filling the WH with AF becomes unnecessary.

water%20heater%20bypass.jpg

Once in "by-pass" mode, the 2 to 3 gallons of RV antifreeze will then be pumped through both Hot and Cold lines and Hot and Cold fixtures.



Open and run each faucet at a time, Running both hot and cold systems. Close when both show pink for a period of time. Each faucet/run at 1 time. make to open every system including your hand held shower faucet, deck shower wash down and I will pour pink antifreeze down my shower drain to prime my front bilge pump. Again pour pink for a period of time until you hear discharge from the system.
Agreed!





70 gallon Fuel Tank, in my last post I spoke about making a 5 gallon mixture of what mercury calls a fogging recipe.
While Merc may call this a fogging recipe.... IMO, fogging is an entirely difference process from that of running an oil enriched mixture into the system.


Batteries come out, and our stored off the concrete floor in the garage. I empty the boat of personal items hit the boat with a pressure washer, clean the seats, if the head was used a lot I have its gets sucked out, if not I pour some green down the toilet.
Green AF is typically E/G coolant, and is not environmently friendly.
As you know, it should be captured when finished with it, and then properly disposed of.




John,
Fairfax, VA.
03 25’ Crownline CCR,
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Ricardo, no worries, always interested in info. My boat has a potable water tank and a waste holding tank. My potable tank doesn't have any bypasses. I have at the back of the boat a cover that unscrews and I fill with water from a hose. This drains into the tank. Then a water pump pushes that water into the faucets and water heater. Etc. Turn the pump on open the faucet, you get water.
To winterize that system, I drain the potable water tank by running the pump draining thru the faucet. Fill the tank again, run the pump until I get pink at the faucet.


Here is another issue, potable water tank holding water beings to smell really bad after a while. Definitely not drinkable. Used only for flushing toilet thru shower handhold sprayer.
How do you control the smell of potable water?

John
 
Nobody seems to mention changing the outdrive lube. If you live in an area that freezes this is important. If you had a seal go bad there could be water in the lower.

Just my humble suggestion, I have winterized a boat or two and it seems that every year I find at least one with milky oil/water in the lower.
 
jakedaawg said:
Nobody seems to mention changing the outdrive lube. If you live in an area that freezes this is important. If you had a seal go bad there could be water in the lower.

Just my humble suggestion, I have winterized a boat or two and it seems that every year I find at least one with milky oil/water in the lower.
Click to expand...

Ayuh,.... Many of Us change the fluids comin' outa the water, rather than when goin' into the water,....

I want fresh clean oil in everything, sittin' through Winter,....
Also shortens the "To Do" list in the Spring,...

Did I mention in here,..?? Air don't freeze,....
 
After I have done everything else except remove the batteries (very last) I remove my stern drive and store in my garage.
While I am changing my motor oil waiting for the drip drip drip to end. I open the both screw plugs on the drive (lower then upper and then take the cover off of the Lube reservoir near the engine) and drain the entire system thru gravity out the bottom of the drive. Looking and hoping not to find milky lube.

Check gaskets on the drain screws, they are easy to loose. Replace as necessary.


I remove all old zinc’s, remove props, pressure wash the drive again and store for the winter.
Always, remove your drive/s so that it doesn’t walk away on its own like my trailer did this summer from a secured lot. Explained to me by the marina owner or maybe I let somebody borrowed it.
 
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3-legged-dog said:
Ricardo, no worries, always interested in info. My boat has a potable water tank and a waste holding tank. My potable tank doesn't have any bypasses.
John, the by-pass valving will be at the water heater.... (not at/near the potable water tank).

The by-pass valving allows us to switch the Water Heater's incoming cold supply, and loop it back to both Hot and Cold lines.
This allows us to completely drain the Water Heater and leave it drained for the lay-up duration.
(many of these Water Heaters will hold between 6 and 12 gallons)

Spending 6 or 12 gallons + of RV antifreeze for WH protection is not required when the WH has been drained.
(air will not freeze expand and damage the WH).

By-passing a drained WH also prevents the possibility of RV Antifreeze "dilution" within the WH, of which would deminish the RV antifreeze's protection value.

Like said...... 2 or 3 gallons of RV antifreeze in the potable water tank shoule be enough to properly purge Hot and Cold lines and Hot and Cold fixtures.

We can build or own, or purchase a by-pass valving system.

water%20heater%20bypass.jpg
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