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86 omc shift problems need help

I

irieman1

Member
I have a 86 beechcraft 192s my stringer 800 will engage in reverse but not in forward the motor is a v8 5.0 chevy 305 I removed flat cable to drive pulled into reverse but won't move enough to engage in forward is this cable bad
 
Was the shift cable removed at any point? They get adjusted with a special tool at install. If it was removed, you it may need to be re-adjusted. Disconnect the shift cable and see if you can manually push the selector into forward and reverse gears. If the propeller shaft is not engaged when the gear selector is pushed into forward position then you likely need a forward gear and new dog clutch, which requires removal and full disassembly of the outdrive. Keep in mind that you may need to rotate things slightly when using the gear selector so the dog clutch can index properly.
 
I put new throttle cable new shifter and new cable that goes from shifter to a thing where transom cable goes in can I just drop lower unit
 
irieman1 said:
I put new throttle cable new shifter and new cable that goes from shifter to a thing where transom cable goes in can I just drop lower unit
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Unfortunately you can't simply remove the lower unit. The whole outdrive needs to come off in order to detach upper from lower, or you will damage the shifting rod. You might not really need to do anything on the top unit unless it is also time to change your water pump impeller. I recommend you get the repair manual first so you know what you are in for before you start the journey. Special tools are involved, and you need basic mechanic skills & tools so its nice to read through the process and decide if you think you are capable with your tools and skill set before you start. Expect the process to take you a month if it is your first time as you will be waiting on tools and parts most of the time, and then if you are like me you decide to put a fresh coat paint as well.

If you do go through with it you need a bottom seal kit and a transom seal kit. Lots of O rings and gaskets in there you can replace as long as you have it open, and way better deal than ordering seals and gaskets piece by piece.

When you put the new one on did you adjust it anything/ check it? Here is a video I think you should watch if you have not already done so. I think it might clear some things up for you on where to start.


irieman1 said:
Selector is the unit all cables go to except throttle cable
Click to expand...
correct. By the way I forgot to mention that you do this with the engine off.
 
I'm in idaho one question if I go to merc I only need to glass transom hole then does merc conversion come with a template for new hole I probably gonna make this project boat so conversion is way to go easier part to get and ppl work on them
 
Very cool irieman, I have family in Idaho.

With regards to a template. If you get it new it should come with a paper template and an install manual. It will tell you where exactly the hole should be placed with regards to waterline etc. If you get a rebuilt unit you may need to hunt down that information online.

I am in agreement that you may be better off looking for a new outdrive than to try to breathe new life into this 800. If it were a cobra, I'd say just rebuild it though many people on these forums advise against cobra.

I am sorry to tell you that its not as simple as glass it and cut a new hole. Consider that there is most likely a wooden core inside of your transom. I could be wrong with regards to your particular model but there is usually some sort of backing inside the fiberglass or aluminum hull to offer rigidity and support for the outdrive. In the case of my aluminum boat I have a single thick sheet of aluminum on the outside and two 1" thick pieces of marine plywood which were glued together before install to provide 2" of marine plywood backing at the transom. If I am not mistaken the install manual will even outline a minimum and maximum thickness for the transom. My two cents are that if you are replacing any of that transom wood to reshape the hole you pretty much need to replace all of the transom wood, not just the area around the hole. If you replace only a small piece it won't have the same payload that the engineers calculated for. Depending on how the boat was put together it could be a lot of work or it could be not that much work at all. In my case all I have to do is unbolt the engine and move it forward a foot with an engine crane to gain access to the transom wood. In my book that's easy. If you end up needing to cut out a bunch of fiberglass on the inside to gain access to the transom wood, the fiberglass mess and then re-glassing is kind of a pain, and fiberglass can be difficult to make look nice if you haven't done it. I am sure that if you search these forums hard enough you will find someone who has done it before on your model and you can get an idea what the whole project would look like.

As you look into changing your outdrive remember that there are options, and a lot of opinions on here where you can really get stuck in the weeds. Not that you are on the fence between Merc and a Penta, but just in case you get stuck on the decision here are a couple of big picture thoughts that I found helpful.

On one hand, if you have money to burn, by all means get something from the modern era with cone clutch, so there is no more dog clutch. Everyone seems to like them, just a little spendy.

On the other hand, if you go with something like a merc the parts are more affordable, and with proper maintenance they can last a long time, and you can find a rebuilt unit much more easily.

A majority of people on here advised me to upgrade to the Volvo outdrive; however, after crunching a bunch of numbers I came to the conclusion that I would rather rebuild my cobra than spend the 3K - 4K for an upgrade to a Merc, or the 15K to upgrade to a Volvo. I am able to get a small four stroke outboard for trolling/ emergencies, and still pay less than the upgrade to a Merc. This seemed like a way better idea for me as I'd prefer to have a spare engine when I'm out on the deep blue waters of the Pacific Ocean. You can come to your own conclusions, just make sure to do a little thinking for yourself and your personal situation. Everyone's budget and needs are different.

Whatever you do, be patient and enjoy the journey.

Cool Runnings!
 
Forgot to mention. If the new outdrive is larger than the current hole in all dimensions, then you don't need to re-glass or change the transom wood, you just need to make the hole larger assuming the wood in the transom is in good shape. That said, I feel like the 800 has a round shape, not sure if there is anything that would cover that hole but just thought I'd put it out there.
 
I'm using on lakes and can I use metal for transom I'm a fabricator wielder but I found new merc conversion for 3400 total for everything if I can use metal it would be faster and neater but I got manual coming I see what it says
 
Irieman! If you are a welder/fabricator you are potentially holding pocket aces here brother! Just in case you had not considered it here is another idea to muddy the waters for you!

You can do a conversion to turn this boat into an outboard setup. They make brackets for the conversion that are not crazy expensive; however, you could potentially make your own if you have the skills and equipment. You just need to use aluminum and make sure to overbuild it and make it extra beefy. Although that said, if you buy one rather than fabricating it you will get the peace of mind that it was engineered/ built perfectly. Here is a picture of a conversion below.

1720711762600.png


As you can see it would cover the old transom hole as well.

They make different models that are more or less pricey depending on the size engine and style bracket you need. Just search for "outboard engine conversion bracket" on ebay and you will see dozens of options.

Are you using this for fishing or water sports like tubing? If this is for water sports you can get the model that has a swim deck on it as well. If this is going to be used for fishing you can get one that has an extra mount for a low horse power trolling/ emergency backup motor.

If you only plan to use this for fishing the outboard bracket would enable you to get a smaller more affordable outboard motor.

The other advantages that you can consider with this option are:
1.getting rid of the engine block from the inboard outboard frees up a great deal of deck space. You can put a bench seat or a live well where the engine is currently.
2.No more running the blower before startup.
3.If/ when it is time for replacement that is much easier.
4.Most people now would prefer to have an outboard setup. Things were different when your boat was built, inboard outboards provided more power and reliability than outboards in the 80s. Now outboards have gotten bigger and better, and because they are easier to swap out people just seem prefer them. So if you intend to sell this boat some day when you are ready to move onto something bigger or newer you will have increased the value of the boat somewhat.
5. because it is so much easier to change motors you can get an old one on craigslist and upgrade it in a couple years when it makes more sense. If you get the bracket that has the extra space for a trolling/ emergency motor then you can get an older engine without fear of being stranded on the lake since the backup/ trolling motor will get you back to the launch ramp.

I am currently working on a restoration as well. My outdrive was in good shape and just needed a rebuild with couple of fresh gears since that was the most affordable option for me I went that route. However, if my outdrive had been toast I would have most likely gone with a bracket conversion. Should my current motor or outdrive fail I will be switching to a bracket.

If the current motor is in good shape you can pull it and sell it as is on craigs list to recover some of the cost of bracket conversion. Not sure if anyone wants parts for the 800 anymore but you could also throw that on Ebay as well to see if anyone is interested.

One advantage of sticking with the I/O is that in general they are more affordable. Especially if you are looking at the cost of newer 4 stroke outboards. If you decide to do a conversion make sure to start by securing your outboard motor first.

Also, Just because you mentioned in the beginning that you are new to boats I just thought I would mention that you should double check that the wood inside the hull is still in good shape. I had a fiberglass hull previously that got a few small cracks that leaked and rotted out a bunch of the sub deck wood. It's just a good idea to make sure the hull is completely sound before you start buying motor stuff.

BTW, my family is in Eagle.
 
Just some stuff to be aware of if you start checking out prices on outboards. I'm not sure what the laws or regulations are in Idaho but in some places you are not allowed to run 2 stroke engines on lakes or rivers. Personally, even if a 2 stroke were an option I would prefer a 4 stroke. Also, don't consider anything with less than 2 cylinders; they have a tendency to vibrate a lot. I would also avoid the cheap Chinese knockoffs. I'd go with an older used outboard from a quality name brand rather than an unknown foreign motor that is new.

Also another advantage of the outboard is that if you do splurge on it and get something new then you can always move that motor to your next boat if/ when you upgrade boats. You generally would not do that with an inboard outboard as an I/O hull is virtually impossible to sell or get rid of without a motor. Out here in California you can find I/O hulls without motors that people can't seem to give away for free.
 

came across this video today. I wondered if this was your boat? I doubt this is your boat but I am actually curious if this is the problem you were seeing.

Happy Friday!
 
theydrewa31 said:
Irieman! If you are a welder/fabricator you are potentially holding pocket aces here brother! Just in case you had not considered it here is another idea to muddy the waters for you!

You can do a conversion to turn this boat into an outboard setup. They make brackets for the conversion that are not crazy expensive; however, you could potentially make your own if you have the skills and equipment. You just need to use aluminum and make sure to overbuild it and make it extra beefy. Although that said, if you buy one rather than fabricating it you will get the peace of mind that it was engineered/ built perfectly. Here is a picture of a conversion below.

View attachment 33129

As you can see it would cover the old transom hole as well.

They make different models that are more or less pricey depending on the size engine and style bracket you need. Just search for "outboard engine conversion bracket" on ebay and you will see dozens of options.

Are you using this for fishing or water sports like tubing? If this is for water sports you can get the model that has a swim deck on it as well. If this is going to be used for fishing you can get one that has an extra mount for a low horse power trolling/ emergency backup motor.

If you only plan to use this for fishing the outboard bracket would enable you to get a smaller more affordable outboard motor.

The other advantages that you can consider with this option are:
1.getting rid of the engine block from the inboard outboard frees up a great deal of deck space. You can put a bench seat or a live well where the engine is currently.
2.No more running the blower before startup.
3.If/ when it is time for replacement that is much easier.
4.Most people now would prefer to have an outboard setup. Things were different when your boat was built, inboard outboards provided more power and reliability than outboards in the 80s. Now outboards have gotten bigger and better, and because they are easier to swap out people just seem prefer them. So if you intend to sell this boat some day when you are ready to move onto something bigger or newer you will have increased the value of the boat somewhat.
5. because it is so much easier to change motors you can get an old one on craigslist and upgrade it in a couple years when it makes more sense. If you get the bracket that has the extra space for a trolling/ emergency motor then you can get an older engine without fear of being stranded on the lake since the backup/ trolling motor will get you back to the launch ramp.

I am currently working on a restoration as well. My outdrive was in good shape and just needed a rebuild with couple of fresh gears since that was the most affordable option for me I went that route. However, if my outdrive had been toast I would have most likely gone with a bracket conversion. Should my current motor or outdrive fail I will be switching to a bracket.

If the current motor is in good shape you can pull it and sell it as is on craigs list to recover some of the cost of bracket conversion. Not sure if anyone wants parts for the 800 anymore but you could also throw that on Ebay as well to see if anyone is interested.

One advantage of sticking with the I/O is that in general they are more affordable. Especially if you are looking at the cost of newer 4 stroke outboards. If you decide to do a conversion make sure to start by securing your outboard motor first.

Also, Just because you mentioned in the beginning that you are new to boats I just thought I would mention that you should double check that the wood inside the hull is still in good shape. I had a fiberglass hull previously that got a few small cracks that leaked and rotted out a bunch of the sub deck wood. It's just a good idea to make sure the hull is completely sound before you start buying motor stuff.

BTW, my family is in Eagle.
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Nice I live I Nampa wife want an inboard so I'm gonna do conversion can I use 1/4 in aluminum plate on inside and glass rest or can I use 2in traffic rated carbon fiber grate to get my 2 1/8 thickness or does it have to be wood
 
So this goes for pretty much everywhere on the boat. You want to avoid different types of metal touching each other (galvanic corrosion). Just a nice rule to keep in mind for yourself.

I am interested to know what this traffic rated grate material is. Can you post picture or link?

As far as what to use I'll give you my two cents after I see that material you are talking about but also I would recommend scouring the internet for these forums to figure out what the options are. Lots of people have posted information on the subject of repowering, transom repair, fiberglass, etc. and many have posted their entire builds on other forums so you can learn from others who have done it.

Here is a short summary coming mostly from other threads here about what many people recommend:
Most use two pieces of plywood. Marine grade for extra points. Exterior grade wood which is pressure treated has chemicals that will eat any aluminum it touches, I would just avoid anything pressure treated. Auraco is a good choice as it has less voids in the ply which is important. Just get the nicest not pressure treated wood you can afford. If you don't use marine ply just make sure to seal the wood extremely well.

Epoxy: Essential for the wood. Most guys glue wood together with titebond III but you can use Epoxy instead but remember that Epoxy is over $100 a gallon now. Wood glue is cheaper. I spoke with the guys from one of the epoxy companies, they recommend bonding only one layer at a time. So say you are working inside the boat, they recommend to epoxy the first ply to the glass, dry, then bond the next layer of ply to the first layer, continuing layers after that in the same fashion. You can do your own shopping but the best price/ product I found is US Composites. The site looks like it's as old as the space jam website, but I promise they are a real company. Link below, but you can just google them as well. Be aware that if you want to use Epoxy to bond layers you have to buy an additional powder that gets added to the mix. The powder is not expensive but the epoxy is, and if you are using on fiberglass I hear you need a lot of it. If you have questions you can call US Composites. They can let you know the best materials for your application.

Fiberglass , Epoxy , Composites, Carbon Fiber - U.S. Composites, Inc.

America's leading distributor of composite materials. We combine superior products and the industries' lowest prices with fast and accurate service.
www.uscomposites.com www.uscomposites.com

As far as what materials to use things to consider. Take a look at what it came with. Thicknesses, material types, number of layers and order thereof. All of those things were designed and rated to provide enough payload for the thrust of the powerplant. If you deviate from what was done by the engineers then you are possibly changing the payload of that transom. So If I were making changes I would only do so if I were certain that I would be increasing the payload of the transom. Big thing to consider you need that fresh material to cover all the way across and top to bottom of your transom or it won't distribute the force. I saw a guy try to replace a small amount of wood just around the outdrive where it had rotted. The thrust from the outdrive ripped a pair of 4" slits in the aluminum that had to be welded up. A cheap fix on a transom can end up being expensive in the end.
 
I appreciate you thanks for all the advice and knowledge I'll keep u posted I had shift cable out it had big kink and 2 inches of it was exposed in water could this have been problem
 
irieman1 said:
I appreciate you thanks for all the advice and knowledge I'll keep u posted I had shift cable out it had big kink and 2 inches of it was exposed in water could this have been problem
Click to expand...
Does that mean you will be able to get your current unit back up and running? If so, great news man!

I understand your concern with the safety. But here are a couple of ideas just in case you hadn't considered them.

Out here in all of the major sailing ports there are a ton of RIBs (Rigid Inflatable Boats, AKA Dinghies), and the docks that are used to come ashore from larger boats can get extremely congested with parked boats, and in a many ports the wake forces the RIBs to rub against each other and bump into each other or the dock. To protect the motor from getting damaged in these ports many people put a cage around their outboard. If you have the welding skills you might be able to make one. If you really wanted to you could actually probably make one for an inboard as well if it gives you peace of mind. A picture of one of these outboard guards is below.

outboard guard.png
 
Also, if safety is your primary concern a couple of things to consider. The rule on our boats has always been that the engine is OFF when a skier or tuber is boarding from the water. Not in neutral or idle, but OFF. And the skiers are reminded of this rule at the beginning of the day and we let everyone know that they should wait to approach the boat until the engine is off. It's the only way we can think of to keep people 100% safe.

Also, with the bracket that has the swim platform would provide a nice entry point on the side and in front of the propeller which in my humble opinion feels like a pretty safe spot to board from. You can also put a little swim ladder off the side of the swim platform to make it easier for the kids to get back in. Here is a picture of one with the swim platform.

outboard bracket with swim platform.png


Also if you are cringing at the price of used outboards, or lack of availability on craigslist, or facebook marketplace at the moment, just remember that it is summertime so everything gets snatched up quick. Wait until fall or winter and you likely see more used motors out there. All of that said The math only works in favor of the outboard if you can get a used one at an affordable price and since you will need a lot more horsepower for tubing and skiing sticking inboard will give you plenty of horsepower for the money.
 
Just for fun you could post a picture of the work for us! I'm interested to see how it came out, I am sure some of the other fellas are curious as well.

I am listing the questions below so you can copy and paste, then type your reply after each question.

  • I am assuming you are staying with the I/O as you had mentioned previously?
  • Are you keeping the same engine?
    • I know you have the 305, but do you have the model number?
    • What work needs done on the engine?
      • Now is a good time to replace any gaskets etc. while it is already disconnected from the outdrive. Focus mainly on the stuff that you cannot get to easily. For instance you can always get to the carb easily so you could skip that but the oil pan gasket requires the outdrive to be removed and the engine lifted. That engine is heavy, so don't try to do it by hand. You will need a crane. Also, just my two cents but I am not a fan of the idea of lifting the engine by the intake bolts. If its not leaking at all you can let a sleeping dog lie. At the very least, if the engine has been leaking you should remove any oily, greasy buildup from the engine bay. Grease buildup is a fire hazard, get it clean if you are going to have your family on the boat.
  • You will need to find an outdrive that will mate with your engine, and provide the correct gear ratio. I assume you are looking to get a used outdrive, not a new one? Is there anything you have been considering so far?
 
I'll post pics when I get back home I don't know what I'll need for sei 116 alpha the stringer trim was electric and wad gear driven so I'll need rams that r electric or hydro don't know
 
So, you need everything then. Transom shield, rams etc. in addition to the outdrive? You are going to need something like this then (link below). Not sure but I think you will need the hydraulic pump as well. I don't think this particular item includes that, though maybe there is a kit out there does include that.

www.michiganmotorz.com

Bravo Transom Assembly (SEI)

BRAND NEW complete Bravo transom assembly. AFTERMARKET replacement for Mercruiser Bravo Magnum Transom. This will work with all MerCruiser Bravo One, Two & Three outdrives. Replaces: MerCruiser Part # 6311002NZ THREE Y
www.michiganmotorz.com www.michiganmotorz.com

As you can see it is pricey. You may want to consider hunting down a wrecked vessel and pulling off what you need. There are tons of I/O boats out there that have a cracked fiberglass hull or blown outdrive, and people don't want to put money into them so you can get them for extremely cheap. Sometimes you can even find them for free. You can also sometimes get lucky and get a bunch of other stuff that is useful, (cleats, fenders, rope, steering wheel, seats, old tackle boxes). You also get the advantage of getting a complete system. No additional pumps, lines or wires to buy; assuming they are in ok condition you just need some fresh gaskets and o rings. The main goal is to save some money on the transom shield you might get lucky and get an outdrive in the deal as well. Clearly a new SEI would be nice, but if you got an OMC and rebuilt it that would be just fine, and with good maintenance would last a very long time. If you get a scrapper you would also get that hydraulic pump which you are going to need. If you find one with a blown outdrive you can drop it off a marine mechanic for a rebuild, or some will offer a core exchange (you send them your old outdrive, and they sell you a rebuilt outdrive at reduced cost, just like how milk bottles were years ago). If there aren't any marine mechanics nearby you can ship it. You can rebuild an outdrive yourself if you have mechanics tools such as a 12 ton shop press, but it will take $400-800 in specialty tools depending on the model. Honestly most people don't have the stomach for it so they just have it rebuilt. I can give you more info on the subject if you decide to rebuild one, but don't want to type a novel unless you need the information, so let me know.

The SEI is a clone of merc. So you need to figure out which transom shields fit which outdrives, and which outdrive works with your engine size. Generally one transom shield will service many sizes of outdrive. So you would be looking for a scrap boat with a merc outdrive on it, that is the correct generation to interface with your desired outdrive. If the outdrive on the scrap boat is the wrong gear ratio for your boat you can sell it on ebay and use the money to buy one that is the right size. Just my two cents, make sure you get your transom shield before the outdrive if you are hunting for a used one.

Just doing by best to save you some coin, and perhaps some headaches. This stuff gets spendy quick!
 
I'm in the same exact boat right now pun intended. It's crazy how much you can't see when you are looking at the surface of the boat. So many details. So many rabbit holes to go down. I just started a thread with some questions about welds. I know you said you are a welder so thought I would ask if you have any input for me. I am going to message you a link to the post if you have the time to take a look and post back on the thread if you have any thoughts or advice.
 
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