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3.0 started misfiring/backfiring

scubasteve215

New member
New to the forum. Ran into a problem with my 2005 Bayliner 175 with mercruiser 3.0. It was running great all day until all of a sudden while cruising about 33mph, it started running horribly. Had to tow back. Sounds like it's missfiring and its backfiring through the carb. I can start it with the muffs on but have to choke it. Spark plugs look good and gapped. Plug wires are good. Removed the dist cap and rotor. Rotor has carbon/ black residue. I don't have the special meters and testers from the service manual. Just a basic meter I bought at AutoZone. What can be causing the all of a sudden missfiring? Thanks in advance for the help.
 
I'm not sure where to start. That was first idea was the distributor. The rotor has some black residue like from sparking around the contact. Cap looks fine
 
Check your mechanical spark advance in the Distributor, grab the rotor, and see if it moves one way 1/4 turn, then springs back by itself? If not, the weights, & springs, are under the breaker plate. Check to see they're lubed, & working right.
 
It has the Delco EST ignition. So I believe it's electronic. It won't even start not. It has strong spark at the plugs. Replaced the fuel filter. Good fuel to the carb. I'm worried it's the cam sprocket.
 
I would recommend pulling fuel sample directly from fuel tank fuel line. Especially if you do not have water/fuel separating filter that can be dumped into container for sampling. I think you have water in your gas. Please let us know what you find..
 
It has the Delco EST ignition. So I believe it's electronic. It won't even start not. It has strong spark at the plugs. Replaced the fuel filter. Good fuel to the carb. I'm worried it's the cam sprocket.

I tend to agree here...sounds like a timing issue.

This motor uses timing gears that mesh together, NO timing chain. so unless you jumped or lost a tooth on the gear that should be ok but anything is possible.

A couple of questions first need to be answered.
Also the manual shows three ignitions, point, est, digital/distributorless.

1. does the rotor spin when cranking the motor over? If not the distributor gear roll pin has sheared and the dist needs to be removed.

2. in order to determine if the timing has changed (for some reason) you need to find TDC on the harmonic balancer (number 1 cyclinder must be on compression stroke) and confirm that the rotor if you have one is pointing at or very very close to number 1 spark plug wire location on cap.(need to know exactly what ignition, EST {cap and rotor} or Distributless {no large cap or rotor) system.

when you say dist wont move, do you mean you can not turn it? There is a screw and clamp that are used for this purpose (hold down on shaft base flange) and this is how base timing is achieved.


If all of the above is normal there may be a chance your ignition module failed as it controls timing........

that fact that you have spark says the coil and distributor internal parts function, correctly is not known yet. there are some tests for the internal parts.
typically if the internals go then spark is lost.

Also take the dist cap off and look at the internal parts and see if there is anything obvious that may not loook right.


Additional troubleshooting is in order
 
I am not so sure water would cause back firing thru carb..........I would cause a seriuos loss of power.

Back firing thru carb typically is very lean, back valve, bad cam lobe, timing issue.

Not saying it is not water but not thinking it it either.
He says good fuel to carb, of course we dont know if he means good fuel or just good flow
 
Unfortunately, I am at work for the next 48 hours. Won't be able to work on it til Thursday. But thanks for all the help. Here's what I've found in regards to your input.

I have good flow to the carb. I will check the quality of the fuel when I get home.

I have the Delco EST ignition. I checked the cap and rotor, look good. Ignition coil is good. Nothing obvious under the cap that is wrong. The shop manual says there is no test for the module. I did remove the distributor and the gear on it was good. I will set the motor at TDC and check rotor direction.

When I said the rotor doesn't move, I meant that when I try to turn it by hand to see if it did a 1/4 turn and spring back. I did not turn the motor over with the cap off to see if the rotor was turning with the motor, but I assume it was.

I had read that the timing gears on the crankshaft and camshaft might be made of a nylon or fiber type material that us susceptible to stripping teeth? Is this correct?

I will take all the suggestions and try them Thursday.
 
I believe that MikeDEE was orignially thinking you had a point ignition.

With a point ignition the dist shaft will rotate a bit and it should kick the counterwieghts under the point plate outwards. If not NO timing advance.

Yours in controled by timing module.

Yes NO test for that. Process of elimination........

Typically but not always when timing module malfunctions you would loose advance, or erratic timing causing crappy running.

Saying that,

there is a timing proceedure so if you have a manual try following it.

there are two wires hanging off the dist. hey need to be jumped to set base timing. It says to jump them when engine is running.

Considering you cant get it to run maybe if you jump the two wires prior to trying to start that should bypass the timing module.

If this is so ( not sure as i have never tried this) and the motor starts and idles fine then you will know it is the timing module.
 
You nailed it kghost! I'm glad you're around to follow up with more detailed, & complete information, Thanks ;)
 
Thanks for the help. I'll look into the fuel. Then follow the directions for dist install if engine was moved. Check the dist direction. Try the timing setup.

Do either of you know about the possibility of the timing gears not being metal?
 
So I'm back to it. The rotor does turn when I crank over the engine. I set the harmonic balancer at TDC and the rotor point close to #1 sparg plug wire on dist cap. I tried jumping the wires that set base timing and starting but no luck. Still won't start. At this point, it's sounding like it's the electronic module. I ordered one along with a camshaft gear to be safe. I should have the module tomorrow. I also know the distributor hold down bracket didn't come lose because it was still set at the notch that they set it at from factory.

I appreciate the help. Let me know if there is anything else I should check. I'll update when I get that module.

Does anyone know if that module is the same as any other gm HEI motor? Maybe I can get one at AutoZone.
 
I don't believe there is any four cylinder motors like these in automotive. the motor used for marine is unique. Many many years ago it was used but no longer.

To determine if the cam gear is good or bad I would think you could hook up a timing light to number one wire as normal, jump the two dist wires and crank the engine over and watch the light. According to the manual it should be around 1 degree BTDC. If it hits the same spot every time I would think the cam gear is OK...........

Also see what the timing light shows without the jumper in place..........
 
Before you spend money on parts, check your main connector on the right side of the engine. These can start to separate and create the issues you describe.
Disconnect, clean and use some dielectric grease to protect. Ensure you have a tight fit.
Betcha you might save some cash.
 
So no difference with a new electronic module. I happened to seize my starter too while trying to start it. I decided to pull my valve cover. What do you know, just about every valve was loose and the #3 cylinder exhaust valve rocker was broken in half. How does that happen? Bad part I guess. Oh well, rocker, starter and valve cover gasket on order. Now I have an extra electronic module and cam gear spare.
 
So no difference with a new electronic module. I happened to seize my starter too while trying to start it. I decided to pull my valve cover. What do you know, just about every valve was loose and the #3 cylinder exhaust valve rocker was broken in half. How does that happen? Bad part I guess. Oh well, rocker, starter and valve cover gasket on order. Now I have an extra electronic module and cam gear spare.

Wow! Poor lubrication to allow the valve to stick, breaking the rocker? Strange after on the lake for so long.

I know I had a problem with my 4.3 after sitting for months. The valve rocker stud pulled out of the head due to a stuck valve.

I now start it regularly, getting up to operating heat, if not using on the lake for a bit.

I now only use synthetics as my marine lubricants.
 
All it needed was a rocker arm. Running great now. Just in time for the 4th! Thanks everyone for the help.
All it needed was a rocker arm. Running great now. Just in time for the 4th! Thanks everyone for the help.
Is this a joke? A rocker arm broke, really? The camshaft would break before a rocker arm. Besides, I say the push rod would have gotten mangled if such an impossible thing could happen. I’d apologize if you provided a picture of this impossible occurrence of the rocker arm?
 
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