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280 outdrive vibrates

B

bhammer

New member
"Hi everyone,
I have a 77&

"Hi everyone,
I have a 77' 280 outdrive that vibrates at certain rpms. I was reading some other posts and was thinking it was the shaft bearing except there is no growling noise. It seems to worsen when I turn but not much. Then I noticed that when on the trailer the prop cone and allen bolt in the end is not true when running in gear. It is osilating.
I have in my garage a spare 280 outdrive but it has a 1.86:1 gear ratio(or something close to that). The one on my boat is the 4 cylinder 2.15:1. The local Volvo Penta shop said they would charge me a WHOLE LOTA MONEY to swap the shafts. Is there a way around this? Can I do it myself without the special tools? If I keep using the boat the way it is will I wreck it? Any ideas would be great."
 
"I'd be looking at the Pri

"I'd be looking at the Primary Drive Shaft bearing. This will cause this shaft to wobble and eventually fail, and often taking out more than just the shaft. And yes..... this can become exaggerated while turning.
Also replace your U joint bearing crosses.

Again, unless you perform a "run-out" check on the prop shaft and find that it is bent, I'd be looking at this PDS bearing first.


If the prop shaft is out.... and if you have two of the 280 style lower units (must be like shafts), the main prop shaft can be swapped without any re-shimming IF...... and I say IF you re-use the same;
** double row thrust bearing (and do not change the direction of this bearing).
**same shims that originally set the For/Aft clearance of the "Driven" gear.
**same shaft bearing carrier.
**the same main lower unit gear case.

You can also have a machine shop attempt to straighten a prop shaft, and usually with good results.

It will appear to be more intimidating than it actually is.
Do new shaft seals while in there.

Just noticed that you are just north of me. I am in Portland, Or and I have people ship these to me for repair if that interests you. "
 
"I think your right,today I we

"I think your right,today I went to go fishing and for the first time I heard a noise I never heard before. Ended up not going.
I was reading some of your other posts and you mentioned being able to get the bearing for cheap along with the seal. Also being able to pull the bearing out the back rather than pulling the motor which sounds much better to me. I will try to do that tomorrow. Could you give me some more info on how to get a good bearing please?
Why would I have to replace the U-joint bearing crosses? Bad splines maybe? What do you think I'm looking at for cost to get all parts needed to do the job right and where would I get them? Thanks again."
 
"Once the yoke seal has been p

"Once the yoke seal has been punched and removed, you have access to the two large PDS snap rings..... remove these, and the PDS may come out the rear if no corrosion is preventing it.

The bearing is an ordinary bearing. It should be a #6206 (verify this once removed) and the seal should be a 35x62x7mm. Again, verify once you have them removed.

The U joint crosses will be a Spicer 5-1306X..... about $14 each if you know how to buy them."
 
"Ok, took everything apart yes

"Ok, took everything apart yesterday to find nothing wrong. Just to be sure, I took bell housing and upper unit with u-joints and all to the volvo shop down the road to have a tech look at them and give me an opinion. Both yokes are new along with both u-joint crosses. PDS is smooth as silk(his words)and is just fine. pilot bearing is also in good shape. So I packed as much grease as I possibly could in the PDS bearing and greased everything else and put it all back together.
I was talking to the tech about the end of my prop shaft moving around when I look at it in gear on the trailer and he said thats got to be where the vibration is coming from. 7 thousants max allowable movement. So now I'm kinda screwed. they said new shaft is $200.00 and then time to install. spare outdrive in my garage is not the same gear ratio and would have to swap out shafts which takes special tools I don't have so it will cost around $400.00 to have shop do it.Its a shame because my outdrive is solid otherwise, not any water in the oil at all."
 
"B-hammer,
You may need a sp

"B-hammer,
You may need a special puller to remove the prop shaft bearing carrier. Corrosion can make these difficult at times.
I've found that it is better to use my puller tool than to attempt the slide hammer route.
I've done both.... Puller is best!

But after that, there are no special tools needed if you can get creative yourself.
I could walk you through this with a phone call if it came down to that.

BTW, I believe that .004" is the limit on run-out......!
Not sure if I'm clear on what parts you have to use, but regardless of ratio, the shafts between "like" model lower units will interchange.

FYI: The 280 prop shaft is p/n 875524 replaced by p/n 854675
The 270/275 prop shaft is p/n 875440 replaced by p/n 854674

So you can see that these shafts are not interchangeable.


Rick"
 
"Rick,
Thanks for the help

"Rick,
Thanks for the help,I'm going to make absolute sure the shafts are the same before I go any further. I also am going to take off the prop tomorrow and get a good look at it bare with the engine running in gear to see if it moves as much as it does with the prop on. If it does wobble and the shafts are the same, I would very much like to have a chat. Took the kids out today in it to do some tubing,vibration drives me nuts. Its not in all ranges thought, only really bad around 3500-4000 rpm.
Thanks again,Dave."
 
"Yeah, I sure wouldn't be

"Yeah, I sure wouldn't be using this....... you risk further damage to the drive or transom shield or ????
If you can see the run-out, it is severe enough to warrant replacing the shaft.

Now.... if that spare lower unit that you have (the would-be "donor" unit) is by chance a 1.61:1 over-all ratio, it could be worth $600/$700 on e-Bay.

There is a company in the Seattle area called "Use it again Marine". Contact them and see if they would have a used 280 prop shaft.

."
 
"Ricardo,
Took the prop of

"Ricardo,
Took the prop off and ran it in gear, really hard to tell by looking at it, the hole thing is vibrating from just running. But if I put my finger on the end of the shaft where the allen bolt goes, my finger does move around a little. I don't know how accurate this is.You called this run-on,how would I do this test,or how does the tech do this.
You seemed a little confused about what exactly I have, so I'll tell all.
I have an AQ140A with a 280SP,but I also have a 280SP in my garage that is for parts. The parts drive is not a 2.15:1 ratio, its a 1.89:1, so I need to take it apart to put my gears on the donor shaft,right?
So that's the deal,and I don't have a puller or even know where to get one for this application.Maybe I could make one. Do you utilize the threaded holes that hold the zinc for pulling?
Also googled use it again marine and couldn't find anything.Here in Bellingham we have a place called Pacific Marine Exchange that is like a bone yard for boats, but they didn't have just a shaft, they want you to buy the whole thing... I already have one.
I verified the shafts to be the same length also. I hate to bother you so much, but could you send a picture of your puller and let me know where to attach it? Or if you want to talk to me that would be even better. I can send pics also if need be. Maybe a trade? Maybe you have a lower unit in good shape with 2.15:1?


Dave"
 
"Dave , I frequent a few marin

"Dave , I frequent a few marine forums and help where I can with the Volvo Penta, so forgive my not remembering which drive was the donor. But knowing that the donor is the 1.89:1, I'd say it's a good candidate if you can't find a shaft by itself.

As for run-out, I guess I assumed that you would be using a dial indicator on the shaft. That is what we do..... place an indicator on the shaft and then turn the shaft slowly while we look for run-out via the reading from the indicator.

As for entire drive vibrating..... Hmmm, not sure why a little run-out w/ no prop would cause that unless you bent the vertical shaft as well.
Replacing the vertical shaft does involve set-up.

Now..... we only change one gear to the new shaft if installing a prop shaft only. The "Drive" gear on the vertical shaft remains as is.
Since the prop shaft thrust bearing makes direct contact with the "Driven" gear, nothing changes so long as you use the same bearing, same carrier and the same shims that are behind this bearing.

I will email you a photo of the puller tool for this. It utilizes the two threaded carrier bolt holes for both extracting and re-installing.

I could sell you a lower ready to go, but this involves shimming this different lower unit to your existing Intermediate housing."
 
"Rick,

Thank you for you

"Rick,

Thank you for your time, I really appreciate it. I received the photo of your puller, but I'm a little confused. how does it work if the plate slides over the shaft? And it looks like the threaded bolts from the puller go in the holes that hold the carrier to the lower unit housing. And what are those smaller screws/bolts in what looks to be wear the zinc would be held on? Other than that I know I can make that puller in my shop.

So,if I understand right, you use the shaft to pull the carrier out,right.So the shaft will stay in the outdrive and only the carrier will come out. Then the prop shaft will just come right out easily with the bearings and gear on it. I know that I just have to jump in and do it but I'm SCARED..."
 
"B-Hammer, no offense to you,

"B-Hammer, no offense to you, but if you do not understand this, you then (a) are not looking at a schematic while we are discussing this; or (b) may be intimidated or not have the skills to do this!
It is actually quite a bit easier to do than what the schematic allows us to think.




Go to D/R site and take a look at the 280 lower unit schematic!
http://dougrussell.com/partscatalog/volvo_omc/index.cfm?fuseaction=group&group=2 217&GroupList=2217


But on to your other concerns.... Quote: "So,if I understand right, you use the shaft to pull the carrier out,right. So the shaft will stay in the outdrive and only the carrier will come out. Then the prop shaft will just come right out easily with the bearings and gear on it. I know that I just have to jump in and do it but I'm SCARED..."


**Yes, the tool uses the shaft to pull the carrier out! Since it pulls on the shaft, you can bet your bippy that the shaft comes out along with the carrier.
**IOW's, you remove the shaft, carrier, gear, main bearing all together.

**The prop shaft is held into the carrier via a large washer fastened to the carrier with a series of studs/nuts.
**The thrust load is placed against a large washer.
**All of these nuts will be removed in order for the shaft assembly to come out of the bearing carrier.
**(This is where you will first see the adjusting shims.)

**The actual prop shaft bearing is held onto ths shaft with a round nut.

."
 
"Update: Spoke with Dave yeste

"Update: Spoke with Dave yesterday. Apparently a shop damaged the threaded portion of his prop shaft.... the now eccentrically spinning cone nut may have been the culpret in this vibration..... Hopefully, he'll post back with his update."
 
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