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Brand new BF5, 17 hours burning oil?

S

stepnout

Member
Hello new to this forum and new to boating. I have an Alumacraft Waterfowler 16 Main motor is a Yamaha 25/2 stroke. I just purchased a new Honda BF5 from a dealer 65 miles away. This is for slow trolling in a large large for trout. I followed the break in procedure to the letter. Slow idle warming it up, no hi rpms for extended times. 1/4 to 1/2 throttle running for the first 5 hours with the occasional brief full throttle. Then between 5-7 hours I would run between 1/2, 3/4 and full throttle for 2-5 minutes. At the 12 hour mark till now 17 hours in between trolling I have taken some 10-15 minute 3/4-full trips. The whole time This motor is what I call burning oil. My manual says the green is on the oil pressure is good. Now I say burn oil but I still have 3/4 mark on the oil dip stick.
several of the guys at work who have more experience than I with out boards say this is normal and the rings/valves have to seat they claim this may take 2 or more tanks of gas.
Now my questions is I have never had a new small 4 stroke engine do this before nor have I had any dealer tell me this type of thing. The motor seems to run fine and Idle correctly.
What do you folks think? Hope I explained this correctly.
Thanks
Wayne
 
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You didn't mention the type of oil you're using but if you have the proper spec oil in there, which I imagine you do, what you describe would be normal to me. Is it smoking??
 
Yes sir, while slow trolling I see blue haze smoke and it smells like oil burning to me. The oil is the original oil from the dealer. Manual says to replace with a good grade of any 10W30. (of the correct quality listed) at 20 hours. I now have 17 hours. Does the blue smoke seem normal?
Wayne
 
It may just be slow to break in... Check the compression. IF OK, then I'd just run it for another tank full and watch it. If still burns oil, it's back to the dealer time. Some times 4 stroke engines take more than a "normal" amount of time for the rings to seat correctly.
 
I spoke to a service tech at another dealer. He suggested if the motor was laid down on the wrong side oil would enter the breather and that could make it smoke blue. I did lay it down on the wrong side twice for just a few seconds so that may be my problem, hope so.
Wayne
 
One other thing to check for...

Make sure your motor is not tilted all the way in towards the transom. Have the motor sitting perpendicular to the horizon with the boat in the water. That will also give you the most efficient push...since you are just trolling.

If it is tilted in too far, oil will tend to find its way into the cylinders. Hence...it will smoke.

I am breaking in 5 of these motors as we speak for a local park and I am not seeing any smoke. Yes, we put the first two hours of break in time on any Honda we sell.

Mike
 
What would the compression be? I can check that as well. I will also make sure she is not tilted in too far. It may sit higher out of the water as well with another person in front. This is a pretty heavy boat but for trolling the little motor I assume is fine. I enjoy everyone's advice. I will keep you posted.
Wayne
 
Trying to push a heavy boat with too small a motor without the right prop can also tax the motor to where it is struggling to run effeciently. Putting a smaller pitch prop on may help get the rpm up a little and help it run better. It would be the same as putting your car into a lower gear when you are trying to go up hill.

Unfortunately, there is only one other prop available from Honda for the 5HP. It is one pitch less than the standard prop.

Compression is supposed to be 156 lb plus/minus 14 at 1000 rpm. Since you can not pull it at 1000 rpm, the compression will actually be lower. Be sure to take it at full throttle.

Mike
 
I'm only trying to get 3-4 kmh for trolling with this motor or be between 2-3 mph. Can you explain checking the compression check at full throttle? Sorry for my lack of experience. I have one of those compression check gauges you screw it in the plug and pull the engine over until full compression stroke. The instructions say to check it at least 5 times to see if the compression builds up.
Thanks
Wayne
 
Best to do after motor has been run enough to warm it up.

Throttle wide open (shift in forward gear) to allow a maximum of air into cylinder, you want to be sure that the ignition is off, so pull the safety laynard as well.

Pull the starter cord as fast as you can for the five pulls and your gauge will hold the maximum pressure obtained for you to read.

Usually this type of check would be to assure that there was nearly the same reading from all the cylinders, a shop would do a "Leakage Test" by applying controled, compressed air with piston held at TDC and check pressure maintained and for valve or ring blow-by.
 
OK I will try these suggestions:
Make sure the motor is perpendicular.
Compression check Throttle wide open Ignition safety switch off. I didn't think the motor would pull over while it was in Gear but I'll try it.

Can I post a video on this site?
 
Sorry that you have a problem with your motor but from my experience with any Honda product, nearly all problems stem from something the user did. They really do a good job of keeping defects down from the factories.

" I spoke to a service tech at another dealer. He suggested if the motor was laid down on the wrong side oil would enter the breather and that could make it smoke blue. I did lay it down on the wrong side twice for just a few seconds so that may be my problem, hope so."

You said "just a few seconds". From my experience any four stroke tipped on its wrong side for any seconds will burn oil from breather and cause trouble. I highly suspect that is the root of your problem and would be no matter what brand 4 stroke outboard you did it to.
 
Great. I hope that's the problem. I'll keep my fingers crossed. I really appreciate all the advice from everyone, it helps to understand where I have little so experience.

Wayne
 
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Well, after seeing that video, I would say that the smoke is excessive. If it is from lying it down incorrectly, it should clear up with a bit of run time. If not, I suggest a visit to the dealer to sort it out.

While I generally agree that Honda strives for great quality control, I also know that thier processes are not completely infallible. I have encountered more that a couple of "factory foul-ups" on the fleet I work on so don't tear up that warranty card just yet.

If you ever find that you need to store the motor in the horizontal position, I recommend pulling the spark plugs and giving it a few pulls to clear any oil that may have found it's way into the cylinders before attempting to start.
 
It does appear that your motor is tilted in.

Be sure that the oil is at the proper level, measured between the two marks as the motor is held vertical. If the oil is measured at the proper level when the motor is tilted in, it may turn out to be too high when level.

Recheck before you take it back to the dealer.

If it is too high, run it at pretty high rpm for a while and that should clear it up. If it does not, do as jgmo says, take it back to the dealer. If they can not figure it out themselves, they will get Honda involved to solve the problem.

Mike
 
Update! I am cautiously happy as I ran the motor tonight for 2.5 hours with no smoke or smell of burning oil.
I changed the oil at the 17 hour mark
took several pieces of advice made sure the motor was level when on the boat, I had to use the 4th trim whole to make the motor perpendicular as it was tilted in.
I used high test fuel (don't know if that does anything)
I ran the motor full throttle for a 15-20 min. trip up the lake and then trolled for the rest of the 2.5 hours. I stopped several times after trolling at slow speed put her in neutral and throttled her up no smoke or smell.
Oh yes I haven't laid it on it's wrong side since Friday!
I am hopeful all your advice and guidance has paid off.
If things work out I will have to apologize for my stupidity.
I'll take her out a few more times this week and keep you all posted.
Thanks
Wayne
 
Well here is a disappointing result. She starting burning oil again or maybe I just wanted to think it stopped. The Dealer has it now and they ordered rings, valves, head gasket and God knows what else. They have no idea what went wrong. I will be talking to Honda and asking for a totally new Outboard. I really do not know if this sounds reasonable but that is going to be my going in point. As everyone at the dealer said they have never seen such a thing. I am not a happy camper but hopefully Honda can help me out of this bad situation.
The dealer has told me this motor was ordered for someone else and they realized it was a long shaft and they did not take it. They also said someone else tried to purchase it and did not. I WONDER IF THIS MOTOR WAS USED BEFORE I PICKED IT UP?
 
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And you have a long shaft on your boat why??? Normally only used on sailboats...

Using a long shaft where a regular short shaft is warranted may possibly cause problems since if the exhaust port is underwater on this engine, there will be additional back pressure on the engine due to the addition depth underwater.
 
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Well the reason for the long shaft is my boat has a 21 inch transom, Waterfowler 16 by alumacraft. You can see the specs on the Alumacraft site. I'll keep you posted.
 
Well here is the update. The dealer rebuilt the engine. New Valves, seals and rings. I was able to inspect the parts myself. The top of the piston, head, and exhaust valve was as black and shiny with what i suspect as burnt oil. The plug was black as well. after the rebuild the engine still smoked in the tank. The dealer feels the smoke was from a carb problem and not an oil problem. Well I can not agree.
I argued (politely but firmly) with Honda Canada that I was not satisfied with a motor that I believe was burning oil from the first time I started it. I feel the dealer should have picked that up at time of PDI. To my disappointment Honda Canada refused to replace the motor and I refused to take it back. I took my Video of the motor burning oil(blue smoke) to the dealer and had them send it to Honda Canada to help my case. Honda Canada refused to replace the motor. stating their policy was to repair only.
As a last resort I told Honda Canada I was going to put my video on you tube to help with Honda Canada advertising. As a last effort on my part to settle this issue I made a proposal to the dealer that if he acquired a 9.9 long shaft at the sale price and allowed me the total price I paid for the 5 hp against the 9.9 I would find this an acceptable solution and an end to this issue. The dealer agreed and now I am happy with the dealer but not Honda Canada. As I have settled this matter I have removed the video from this site. The 9.9 has 2.5 hours on it as of tonight. I have followed the break in exactly as the manual states and will continue asper. Hmm that's how I tried to break in the 5hp just as the manual stated.
The 9.9 so far runs great as far as I can tell.
Thanks everyone for the comments
 
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