Engine will not go over 2000RPM

[MikDee]

Here's a link direct from the Merc manual I posted! Your Mechanic is wrong, unless you actually have a T-Bolt V Dizzy? Take it, or leave it!

 

[1marc1]

Here's a link direct from the Merc manual I posted! Your Mechanic is wrong, unless you actually have a T-Bolt V Dizzy? Take it, or leave it!

I have a TB4 HEI I was instructed, by the serial number I had given him. I was told to jump my diagnostic port A&B. I did it and my engine automatically pulled up to around 1300rpm and then adjusted my distributor to 8 degrees.

 

[MikDee]

I see, and do you have a full 24 degrees, plus 8 static for a total of 32 degrees advance now?

 

[RicardoMarine]

Marc, here's what needs to be in order:

good cylinder pressures.... I.E., compression
properly operating valves
correct valve timing.... I.E., camshaft correctly indexed to crankshaft.
properly functioning fuel delivery system
functioning ignition system
correct ignition system spark advance ..... not only during BASE mode, but throughout the RPM range

I'd strongly suggest that you find your OEM ignition advance curve (per your engine serial number), and compare your actual spark advance (the number of degrees that you see per RPM throughout the range), to the Mercruiser curve graph.

Understand the ignition advance numbers being thrown at you here are absolutely meaningless unless accompanied with an associated engine RPM!
IOW..... I could tell you that your total advance is to be 28°.....… but unless I include the RPM where you will see this 28°, it will be absolutely meaningless to you...... and perhaps even dangerous!!!!



.

 

[1marc1]

Marc, here's what needs to be in order:

good cylinder pressures.... I.E., compression
properly operating valves
correct valve timing.... I.E., camshaft correctly indexed to crankshaft.
properly functioning fuel delivery system
functioning ignition system
correct ignition system spark advance ..... not only during BASE mode, but throughout the RPM range

I'd strongly suggest that you find your OEM ignition advance curve (per your engine serial number), and compare your actual spark advance (the number of degrees that you see per RPM throughout the range), to the Mercruiser curve graph.

Understand the ignition advance numbers being thrown at you here are absolutely meaningless unless accompanied with an associated engine RPM!
IOW..... I could tell you that your total advance is to be 28°.....… but unless I include the RPM where you will see this 28°, it will be absolutely meaningless to you...... and perhaps even dangerous!!!!



.

Agreed. I cannot really find out what my full throttle timing is. But the engine is timed to 8* in base timing as it should be. I'm showing 150lbs on every hole for compression. Everything else internally I'm unsure of but seeing that this is a brand new GM marine I'm hoping and expecting everything is correct and to spec. We are testing the fuel this weekend, I'm hoping that it's just my pump thats not producing or something along those lines. We're going to manually squirt fuel into the throttle body as we're driving under load to see if we can pull up rpm that way. If that doesn't work........I think the only other thing that's left could be a bad ecm.

 

[kghost]

Abcdefg

 

[walterd]

I cannot find how to ask a questionor pos a question
Please inform me of this

 

[1marc1]

MCM (Sterndrive) Model MCM 4.3L ALPHA /BRAVO
MCM 4.3LH ALPHA / BRAVO
MCM 4.3L EFI ALPHA /BRAVO
Propshaft Horsepower
(SAV1 Rating)
190 205 (190)2 2101 (188)2
Propshaft Kilowatts (SAV1 Rating) 142 153 (142)2 1571 (146)2
Number of Cylinders V-6

Displacement 262 cid (4.3 l)

Bore / Stroke - in. (mm) 4.0 x 3.48 (101.6 x 88.4)

Compression Ratio 9.4:1 9.4:1

Compression Pressure Minimum 100 psi (690 kPa)7

Idle rpm In Neutral3 650 rpm5 600 rpm5

Maximum rpm (at WOT)3 4400-4800 rpm

Oil Pressure (at 2000 rpm) Minimum 30 psi (207 kPa)

Minimum Oil Pressure (at Idle) Minimum 4 psi (28 kPa)

Fuel Pressure (1800 rpm) 3-7 psi (21-48 kPa) 30 psi ( kPa)

Electrical System 12 V Negative (–) Ground

Alternator Rating 55 or 65 amp 8

Minimum Battery Requirements 375 cca / 475 mca / 90 Ah

Firing Order 1-6-5-4-3-2

Spark Plug Type

AC - MR43LTS

Champion - RS12YC

NGK - BPR6EFS

Spark Plug Gap .045 in. (1.1 mm)

Timing (at idle rpm)4 10° BTDC 8° BTDC

Preliminary Idle Mixture 1 1/4 Turns DNA

Thermostat 160° F (71° C)

Notes:
1 Power Rated in Accordance with NMMA (National Marine Manufacturers’ Association) rating procedures.
2 Power Rated in Accordance with SAV1 rating procedures. This rating procedure is used to certify that the
engine complies with “Stage 1” Bodensee and Swiss Regulations. Horsepower differences shown result from
differences in test rpm, allowable test tolerances, and/or installation of special kit components.
3 Measured using an accurate service tachometer with engine at normal operating temperature.
4 Timing must be set using a special procedure as outlined in the appropriate section of this manual. Timing cannot
be properly set using the conventional method.
5 A special procedure must be followed to adjust idle rpm. Consult your Authorized Mercury MerCruiser Dealer
before attempting this procedure.
6 Idle speed on EFI models is not adjustable.
7 Minimum recorded compression in any one cylinder should not be less than 70 percent of the highest recorded
cylinder.
8 Serial Number Break for 65 Amp alternator: OL619083 and above.












Setting Base Ignition Timing
1. Connect timing light (91-99379 or similar) to No. 1 spark plug wire. Connect power
supply leads, if applicable, on light to 12 volt battery.
2. Connect a shop tachometer to engine.
3. Using a jumper wire, connect the ignition system timing lead (PUR/WHT wire) to a good
engine ground (–). This locks the ignition module into the Base Timing Mode.
NOTE: Before starting engine make sure the timing tab and marks on damper are clean.
Chalk or white paint on timing marks may help visibility.
4. Start engine and run at normal idle speed. Allow engine to reach normal operating
temperature.
5. Aim timing light at timing tab, located on the timing gear cover and crankshaft torsional
damper.
6. If adjustment is required, adjust timing by loosening distributor clamp and rotating
distributor body as required until timing mark on damper or pulley lines up with the mark
on tab specified in “Specifications.” Tighten clamp and recheck location of timing mark.
7. Make sure that the distributor has been tightened. Remove the jumper wire from the
timing terminal.
8. Remove jumper wire between the timing lead (PUR/WHT wire) and ground (–).
IMPORTANT: Be sure to disconnect the jumper wire from between the ignition system
timing lead and ground (–) before attempting to resume normal operations. If the
jumper wire is left in place, the ignition module will operate in the Base Timing Mode.
This means that the additional timing advance features would not function.
9. Stop engine and remove timing light.

Model 4.3L / 4.3LH 4.3L EFI
Spark Plug Gap .045 in. (1.1 mm)
Spark Plug Type
AC-MR43LTS
NGK-BPR6EFS
Champion RS12YC

Acceleration Spark Advance
This feature is active during acceleration only. When accelerating, the ignition module may
add more spark advance to the “Base Spark Timing Curve”. The amount of spark advance
added, is totally dependant on how fast rpm increases (how fast the throttle is moved). This
feature is also active within a certain rpm range. This range may be slightly different from
one engine model to another. The approximate rpm range for this feature is 1200-4000 rpm.
Within this range, the module can add approximately 10 degrees of spark advance to the
base spark timing curve.

Mean-Best-Timing (MBT) Spark Advance
During light load cruising, the ignition module searches for the optimal ignition timing. This
is also accomplished by small changes to the spark advance. At a given rpm, the module
will try to add a small amount of advance and wait to see if there is an rpm change. If rpm
increases, it will try to increase timing more. The module will continue to advance timing until
it no longer gets an increase in rpm. Conversely, if it senses an rpm drop, it will start to retard
some of the spark timing. The approximate rpm range for this feature is 1200-4000 rpm.
Within this range, the ignition module can add approximately 10-15 degrees of spark
advance to the base spark timing curve.
NOTE: The Audio Warning System is also connected into the ignition module circuit. If the
audio warning system becomes activated by the closing of one of the audio warning system
switches, the MBT feature is deactivated.

Over-Speed Control
The ignition module will prevent the engine speed from exceeding a preset limit by stopping
the spark. This feature has an rpm range that varies from model to model. The over-speed
limit for a particular engine is set slightly higher than the top end of the rpm range for that
model. For example, if the recommended range is 4600-5000 rpm, the over-speed limit
would be set at 5100 rpm. When rpm reaches this limit, spark is turned-off until engine rpm
drops down to a “Reset rpm”, which would be approximately 4750 rpm for this example. At
this point, spark comes back on.

Knock Retard Spark Control
The knock control feature helps provide protection from harmful detonation. Knock control
is handled by the Knock Control Module. This module receives a signal from a sensor that
is mounted on the engine block. The knock control module works in conjunction with the
ignition module to retard the timing if spark knock is present.

IMPORTANT: The graph below shows the typical advance ranges for a Thunderbolt
V ignition control module. The numbers plotted on the graph are not representative
of any particular model. It is only presented to provide an understanding of how the
system functions.


Based on the timing graph in the manual with a base timing of 0 you should reach max timing 25 degrees before top dead center +/- 10 degrees by 1800 rpms.

The + is (Acceleration advance range) and ( MTB mean best timing)

The - would be (knock control spark range) meaning if a knock is sensed by the knock sensor the timing will retard up to 10 degrees or so.

so if base is set to 8 BTDC then max should be 33 btdc at or by 1800 rpms if no knock is detected.




= Base Timing Advance Curve
= Idle Speed Advance Range
= Knock Retard Range
= Acceleration Advance Range
= MBT Advance Range

It says there that the ignition module may supply more spark advance. But in my circumstance isn't it my ecm that controls my spark advance? So if my ecm isn't working or working properly it's not going to adjust for the spark advance.

 

[kghost]

I was away for a while..........what exactly do you have..

4.3 tbi

or 4.3 efi

 

[kghost]

Your serial number says efi

SO YES YOUR ecm CONTROLS timing

What year is it........my manuals dont list by serial number but by year.........

FOR FUTURE REFERENCE WHEN POSTING

POST ABSOLUTLEY ALL THE INFO YOU CAN SO WE DONT HAVE TO WORK AS HARD FINDING ANSWERS...............

 

[1marc1]

Your serial number says efi

SO YES YOUR ecm CONTROLS timing

What year is it........my manuals dont list by serial number but by year.........

FOR FUTURE REFERENCE WHEN POSTING

POST ABSOLUTLEY ALL THE INFO YOU CAN SO WE DONT HAVE TO WORK AS HARD FINDING ANSWERS...............

Yes it's a TBI. And it's a 2003.

 

[RicardoMarine]

Me in blue text.

Agreed. I cannot really find out what my full throttle timing is.
We're not after full throttle ignition timing!

You'll want to be looking at the progressive advance, and the advance at the prescribed "full-in" RPM.
The correct ignition advance curve graph will show you this.


But the engine is timed to 8* in base timing as it should be.
Yes..... but this does not guarantee that the module is offering the correct progressive and/or TA.

I'm showing 150lbs on every hole for compression.
OK!

Everything else internally I'm unsure of but seeing that this is a brand new GM marine I'm hoping and expecting everything is correct and to spec. W
Agreed.
MichiganMotors generally ensures that the cam followers are set to specs!
We will assume that the camshaft indexing is also correct!
If not....... it too may explain the poor performance!

We are testing the fuel this weekend, I'm hoping that it's just my pump thats not producing or something along those lines.
Good! That will become part of your P of E.

We're going to manually squirt fuel into the throttle body as we're driving under load to see if we can pull up rpm that way. If that doesn't work........
Be very careful if using this rather unorthodox procedure!


I think the only other thing that's left could be a bad ecm.
And this is exactly why I have been suggesting that you look at the progressive ignition advance..... and at the Full-In total advance.... and the RPM where this Full-In advance occurs!

Then compare your numbers to that of the OEM specs!

NOTE: the following is an example only...... see your OEM specs as per your engine model.


Open up this PDF file.......

http://www.boatfix.com/merc/Techbk/95/95HGB4.PDF

..... and go to PDF page #12 under this heading below.

MCM V-6 262 CID (4.3L) with Thunderbolt IV

The vertical colum to the left represents the ignition advance provided by the module.

NOTE: "BASE" or "Initial" advance are not included in the vertical scale.

The horizontal scale represents engine RPM.

The line graph will show you where the spark lead is at an array of RPM.

Note the increase in ignition advance from the low RPM BASE mode! This is the progressive advance.
A progressive advance is necessary because the fuel/air mixture does not combust instantaneously. It requires a "lead" as the rotating assembly's speed increases....... I.E., an advance! This advance must correlate wtih engine RPM.

Note that the increase in progressive advance levels off at about 2,500 rpm. At 2,500 rpm, the advance is "full-in".

Using this graph..... and if we add a BASE or Initial advance of 8* to the module's advance of 14*, the advance that the engine sees @ 2,500 rpm is only 22*! A far cry from 30*!!!!

As you can see, if you were to change the BASE of 8* to 10*, the progressive and TA will also change by that same 2*.


Again... the above PDF file is an example only!
See your OEM specs as per your engine model.



Now... assuming that all else is OK and is up to snuff:

..... If by chance your ignition module is NOT offering the correct degrees of advance (not enough)...... your performance will suffer!

.... Conversely.... if your ignition module is offering too much advance.... or advance too early..... you'll risk engine damage.






.

 

[1marc1]

Me in blue text.



NOTE: the following is an example only...... see your OEM specs as per your engine model.


Open up this PDF file.......

http://www.boatfix.com/merc/Techbk/95/95HGB4.PDF

..... and go to PDF page #12 under this heading below.

MCM V-6 262 CID (4.3L) with Thunderbolt IV

The vertical colum to the left represents the ignition advance provided by the module.

NOTE: "BASE" or "Initial" advance are not included in the vertical scale.

The horizontal scale represents engine RPM.

The line graph will show you where the spark lead is at an array of RPM.

Note the increase in ignition advance from the low RPM BASE mode! This is the progressive advance.
A progressive advance is necessary because the fuel/air mixture does not combust instantaneously. It requires a "lead" as the rotating assembly's speed increases....... I.E., an advance! This advance must correlate wtih engine RPM.

Note that the increase in progressive advance levels off at about 2,500 rpm. At 2,500 rpm, the advance is "full-in".

Using this graph..... and if we add a BASE or Initial advance of 8* to the module's advance of 14*, the advance that the engine sees @ 2,500 rpm is only 22*! A far cry from 30*!!!!

As you can see, if you were to change the BASE of 8* to 10*, the progressive and TA will also change by that same 2*.


Again... the above PDF file is an example only!
See your OEM specs as per your engine model.



Now... assuming that all else is OK and is up to snuff:

..... If by chance your ignition module is NOT offering the correct degrees of advance (not enough)...... your performance will suffer!

.... Conversely.... if your ignition module is offering too much advance.... or advance too early..... you'll risk engine damage.






.

Some of what you say I can understand, other stuff you definitely need to dumb it down for me........I'm mechanically inclined, but only to a point. When you mention graphs, and ta's, and progressive advance etc.......I start to go cross eyed.

 

[1marc1]

Some of what you say I can understand, other stuff you definitely need to dumb it down for me........I'm mechanically inclined, but only to a point. When you mention graphs, and ta's, and progressive advance etc.......I start to go cross eyed.

Ok after re reading that......it makes sense now. And we can perhaps look in this further once we do our fuel test. Thanks!!

 

[kghost]

I agree.

Simply put inorder for a motor to achive wide open throttle under load the timing must advance.
So with a base of 8 and the timing control adding ~ 22 more you should see about 30 total degrees advance (btdc).
This should occur by 2000 rpms if the timing spec is the same as prior year v6 motors.

So if you are not getting any advance either there is a ecm issue or a sensor it telling the ecm to retard the timing.
Did you reinstall the knock sensor? If all the wiring connected to the correct places?
Thats my best guess

 

[1marc1]

I agree.

Simply put inorder for a motor to achive wide open throttle under load the timing must advance.
So with a base of 8 and the timing control adding ~ 22 more you should see about 30 total degrees advance (btdc).
This should occur by 2000 rpms if the timing spec is the same as prior year v6 motors.

So if you are not getting any advance either there is a ecm issue or a sensor it telling the ecm to retard the timing.
Did you reinstall the knock sensor? If all the wiring connected to the correct places?
Thats my best guess

Yup the knock sensor is re installed from old engine to the new one. Not sure if it'scommon for them to fail but i know for sure it's on there and plugged in. Everything else electrical all pretty basic and all hooked up. The only thing that is incorrectly hooked up right now is the hose from my fuel regulator. I have that going to my valve cover but have been told it should be ran to my throttle body unit.

 

[RicardoMarine]

Marc, go here..... and scroll down to "how the 4 stroke engine works".
http://www.carbibles.com/fuel_engine_bible.html

At the end of this 4 second gif file, compression has occurred!

Just prior to TDC (top dead center) the spark ignites the fuel/air mixture causing combustion.
This is lead time is known as ignition spark advance and is measured as crankshaft angle (degrees).

As RPM increase, the spark is required to occur earlier. This is the progressive advance.

When the spark is no longer required to continue advancing.... this is the
Full-In.

I agree.

Simply put inorder for a motor to achive wide open throttle under load the timing must advance.
So with a base of 8 and the timing control adding ~ 22 more
1..... you should see about 30 total degrees advance (btdc).
This should occur by 2000 rpms if the timing spec is the same as prior year v6 motors.

1... I'm not sure if this 4.3L SBC Marine engine will handle 30 advacne @ 2k rpm.
For a SBC V-8 Marine engine....... that would be a recipe for major detonation.


Again.... this is an example ONLY.

 

[RicardoMarine]

Correction to my last post, lines 4 and 5:

Just prior to TDC (top dead center) the spark ignites the fuel/air mixture causing combustion.
This "lead time" (comomonly known as ignition spark advance) is measured as crankshaft angle (degrees).

 

[1marc1]

Correction to my last post, lines 4 and 5:

Just prior to TDC (top dead center) the spark ignites the fuel/air mixture causing combustion.
This "lead time" (comomonly known as ignition spark advance) is measured as crankshaft angle (degrees).

Ok. Thanks for all the info! So after we try the fuel test and if that does not work, are you suggesting I go back and increase my advance. Try it at 9* or 10*?? Because if timing is going to be this finicky or difficult I'm better off just taking it into a Marine shop.

 

[Docksidemarineservices]

The timing is finicky but not that Finicky. If you are a few degrees off you will not loose 2600 rpm's. Just check for total timing. If close to 28 degrees you need to look at other things.

 

[1BIGALF]

I also just had this probem. I thought it was bad fuel but I just changed the Throttle Position Sensor and the Idle air control Valve on the throttle body and got my boat running great.
Let me know if you do this and the results.

 

[RicardoMarine]

So after we try the fuel test and if that does not work,
1.... are you suggesting I go back and increase my advance. Try it at 9* or 10*??

2.... Because if timing is going to be this finicky or difficult I'm better off just taking it into a Marine shop.

1.... NO!
I've been suggesting that you look at what your advance is doing NOW in the event that your module is faulty!

2.... Unfortunately, most Marine shops are going to do what you've been doing..... looking at BASE ONLY!
All too often we set BASE only.... and send the customer out the door!
BASE advance is BASE advance all day long. We fire up on BASE, and we operate at low/idle speed at BASE advance.

Other than the Progressive building on top of BASE (as you can see from the curve graph), BASE does ZERO for anything above idle RPM.


Example... and according to the example graph that I posted:
At 2,500 rpm, the piston must be at or near 24* before top dead center when the spark fires.
Conversely, while at only 800 rpm, the piston will be @ 8* before top dead center when the spark fires.

If you threw 24* at it at 800 rpm, the spark would fire too early, and would tend to push the piston down in the reverse direction.


Correct spark timing is extremely critical for the Marine gasoline engine.
Not enough, and/or too late..... and we leave power on the table.
Too much, and/or too early..... and we risk detonation damage.
No offense to you..... but if this is over your head, you'll want to have a pro do this for you.

 

[RicardoMarine]

Marc, how is your harmonic balancer marked?
Is it marked in one location only.... or is it additionally marked off like this one is?

The long line here represents TDC.
Each degree marking CW of TDC represents degrees BTDC. These are the markings used for checking the progressive advance.

If it's not marked off, then you'll use a digitally advancing style timing light.


Minus any knock sensor influence, this test or check can be done while in neutral.

Look at the example curve graph that I posted.
Minus the specs being quite different....., we would use the same procedure for an auto engine!


TPS was mentioned. TPS = throttle position sensor.
If this sensor could prevent ignition advance.... then I suppose it could be suspect.



.

 

[1marc1]

No its marked on the balancer with a sticker with my timing marks. It's pretty easy to time. But Ok I will check out the graph. Will probably look more into the timing thing once we rule out lack of fuel first, because that will be quickest and easiest thing to check.

 

[RicardoMarine]

Marc, I hate to keep telling you what to do, or what's wrong with your understanding.... so please forgive me if I am sounding rather authoritive! That is not my intention!

No its marked on the balancer with a sticker with my timing marks. It's pretty easy to time. But Ok I will check out the graph.
Just an FYI..... GM has used several diameter harmonic balancers over the years. When the "decals" are used (such as the Mr. Gasket decals), the decal must be correct for the balancer diameter.
IOW... you cannot use a 6-3/4" decal on a 7" or a 8" balancer..... or visa-versa.

If this decal is not correct...... the separation angle (between markings) will be OFF, and your timing attempts will also be OFF.


Will probably look more into the timing thing once we rule out lack of fuel first, because that will be quickest and easiest thing to check.
IMO.... while it's never a bad idea......, the quickest and easiest things to check are not always going to lead us to the issue.

 

[1marc1]

Marc, I hate to keep telling you what to do, or what's wrong with your understanding.... so please forgive me if I am sounding rather authoritive! That is not my intention!

Yeah I'm a scaffolder by trade, not a mechanic so my understanding of boats and or engines is pretty limited. I would assume that this sticker is correctly placed because it's a new GM marine engine......not a rebuilt. So I would hope they would correctly place that.

And I know the quickest and easiest things are not always going to lead me to the answer I'm looking for.......but mechanically I'm more capable of spraying a bit a fuel down my throttle body while driving to see if there is a sign of life or an improvement in performance that way, rather than going through the debacle of timing, checking graphs, advance timing etc. I also understand that if my timing isnt correct the extra fuel isn't going to help any either.......but it's just one thing we want to do and try first before going back to timing or looking at other things.

 

[kghost]

Marc, I hate to keep telling you what to do, or what's wrong with your understanding.... so please forgive me if I am sounding rather authoritive! That is not my intention!

Most of that does not matter....................

1. does he have a fuel issue as he suspects......

2. does the timing advance? Who cares at this point how much and if his marking is accurate........

With the simplest of timing lights all he has to do is confirm it advances. if the 8 initial is at 2-3 oclock when viewing it from the front of motor if it advances it will be at least at 1:00 maybe 12:00 when full advance is in. If not then a timing problem

even if total advance was not being made completely the boat would get higher than 2000 rpms..............period.

therefore the continued explanation of all this technical jargon is falling on deaf ears and only overly explained and repeated.


We understand your "thorough" understanding of a four stroke engine operation including your "expertise" of timing.

Lets keep it simple.................KISS

Loose the acronyms, loose the over explanation.................geeeeeeze!

It makes one DIZZY trying to read all of it............over and over and over again!

nough said!

 

[RicardoMarine]

............ therefore the continued explanation of all this technical jargon is falling on deaf ears and only overly explained and repeated.

We understand your "thorough" understanding of a four stroke engine operation including your "expertise" of timing.

Lets keep it simple................. KISS

Loose the acronyms, loose the over explanation................. geeeeeeze!

It makes one DIZZY trying to read all of it............over and over and over again!

nough said!

With all due respect...... what's your suggestion when the OP is having trouble understanding what he's about to under-take?
Do we explain in the simplest of terms, and risk causing further lack of understanding?

If you are getting DIZZY.... I'd suggest that you stop reading!



.

 

[1marc1]

Its not that i don't completely understand. I get it. If my sticker is incorrectly placed my timing will be incorrectly set. If my timing doesn't advance my ecm could be pooched. If there is something wrong with my knock sensor or tps, it could be throwing my engine into a safe mode or something. But long story short everything we transferred from my old engine worked before at WOT and should be working now. My fuel pump is new and was replaced when i was having issues with my first engine, the marine shop did zero trouble shooting and replaced my entire fuel system when the real culprit was zero compression on 2 cylinders. So the pump thats on my engine even tho is new.....its still untested and it sat for 2 years which is why we just want to try this fuel test out. I would run a gauge but i do not have a guage to see if the pump is producing the correct psi. I Already spent 7000 dollars in parts or unwanted and useless labour in the repair of this boat, and im done trying to spend any more money than i have to now on test guages or anything else for that matter.

But I get that my timing could be the main culprit......but we just want to try to throw some fuel down the throttle body........just to see what that does. If it does nothing, we'll run a light while giving it throttle to see if my timing is advancing. I get the basics of everything here to find out how to find the answers i need and i thank you guys for that! But it gets to a point to where youre sending me graphs and attempting to make me understand very techinal things i don't have the knowledge for.......and it is falling on deaf ears. But i appreciate your help none the less, the more information i can get is only going to help me more. I tip my hat to everyone who took that time to help me with this issue so far! Im hoping to have some kind of concrete asnwer to what is happening thursday night once we try again. I will keep you all posted.

 

[kghost]

With all due respect...... what's your suggestion when the OP is having trouble understanding what he's about to under-take?
Do we explain in the simplest of terms, and risk causing further lack of understanding?

If you are getting DIZZY.... I'd suggest that you stop reading!
.

What he is not understanding is your explanation. He said it at least once earlier on.

You are beating a dead horse with your chronic and full of acronym pages of technical explanations.

We are not dealing with engine builders or engine tuners here. We are dealing with average Joe's asking simple sometimes difficult questions but are looking for


SIMPLE ANSWERS, SHORT AND BRIEF, EASY TO READ AND UNDERSTAND, FULL WORDS AND NOT FULL OF ACRONYMS AND TECHNICAL JARGON