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Redline for Chrysler 318 Inboards from a late 60's early 70's Tollycraft

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WhoIsHayley

New member
Hi everyone, I'm new here and this is my first post. It' probably going to sound a bit odd amd might even be impossible to answer.

Does anyone have any guesitmate information on the RPMs for idle, trolling, cruisng and redline for 318 Chrylsers manufactured in the late 60's early 70's?

I'm guessing the idle was about 800-900 RPM. The trolling at about 2000 RPM, cruising 3500 RPM and Redline at about 6000 RPM? But all guessing from my dads Le Baron :)

Here is the reason:

I'm in the process of converting a 30ft Tolly sport cruiser to a fully electric boat.
The motors are pulled and the electric motors are ready for fitting. I just need to confirm old RPMs to match set up the gearing ratio on the electric motors.

Thanks in advance
B
 
You're close except for the red line; more like 4,800 rpms. These are mild engines with soft valve springs that wouldn't like running at 6 grand!

Jeff
 
The term "red line" is typically not used in the Marine world.
Your OEM specs should include idle RPM and what we call a WOT RPM (WOT = wide open throttle).

WOT RPM is an engineer designed RPM for the engine's most reasonable RPM for the top of the power band, but with a direct relationship to over-all gear reduction and proper propeller selection.
In other words...... WOT RPM is used to check for the correct propeller size and pitch... but works well only if the final over-all gear reduction is correct.

If we cannot reach WOT RPM range, the engine may become over-burdened, and at any RPM.


.
 
WhoIsHayley said:
Thanks Jeff this is very helpful! I'm trying to figure out the gearing ratio for the electrics and seeing if I can match it...

If you are interested I'm blogging about it here :)

http://bluefinelectric.ca/our-next-electric-boat-the-bluefin-2/

Thanks again for the quick reply!
Click to expand...

Ayuh,.... Generally speakin', boat drivelines are set up for a Wot Rpms of 4400/ 4800 rpms....

How are you goin' to power these electric motors,..??

It'll take several Tons of batteries to even get outa the harbor,....
 
All good points...we are just doing some RnD with the Tolly.

Our fist test was a 34ft Sailboat that has 4-12V @ 235amp/hrs that weigh about 640lbs (160lbs each). She can troll along for about 5-6hrs at 4-5knots. Just like a gas motor the main power consumption is used to accelerate the boat up to the desired speed but after that the consumption drops significantly. The motor also works as a generator and charges the battery bank while under sail....all good stuff but that's a sailboat....

The Tolly however is a behemoth in comparison. Obviously the more powerful the batteries, and the more we have, the more range we'll get. For now as a baseline in our RnD phase we are going to go with 2 battery banks of 4-12V batteries...that will be about 1280lbs.

We ditched both V8's which I'm guessing totalled about 1600lbs (correct me if I'm wrong) - also removed were the two 160 gallon fuel tanks which at 6lbs/gallon is about 1920lbs. So basically we removed 3500lbs give or take.

We'll be adding back 1500lbs (both electrics come in at about 110lbs total) but even with the batteries we are still 2000lbs shy of a fully loaded Tolly Sportfisher.

We know that in 2014, we'll be working on a few different ideas for powering the motors but for now we think we'll get her trolling at about 7knots hopefully more for a few hours without issue - so at least we'll be able to fish :p
 
fastjeff said:
Boy are you gonna be shocked at how fast those batteries run down!
Click to expand...
Agreed!

WhoIsHayley said:
Thanks Jeff!
Do you have a guesstimate in your head of how long they will last? Once we get her splashed, we'll see if we can beat it ;)
Click to expand...
You may want to install a battery monitoring system that takes into account Amp Hours, not voltage alone.
Voltage is one thing, but Amp Hours will be your primary concern.

Hopefully these will be true Deep Cycle batteries.
Deep Cycle batteries will fair much better in the long haul, if you prevent them from becoming discharged greater than 50%.
The safe discharge rate for a non-deep cycle battery is less.

An AH monitoring system typically uses a 500 amp shunt resistor in the Negative return path of the bank being monitored.

With an Amp Hour monitoring system, at a glance you can what your SOC or SOD will be.

Xantrex seems to work well.
Their LINK 20 or 2000 will monitor two battery banks (two shunt resistors).

link20_01.jpg


This is the BM-1 by Nasa.
The BM-1 does one bank..... the BM-2 does two banks (two shunt resistors).

Clipper_BM-13-274x274.jpg



This is the Victron Energy unit.

BAM-001-004-000.jpg




.
 
WhoIsHayley said:
Thanks Jeff!
Do you have a guesstimate in your head of how long they will last? Once we get her splashed, we'll see if we can beat it ;)
Click to expand...

Ayuh,... A Sailboat hull is rather efficient, the Tolly is a displacement hull, it Won't glide on little power like the sailboat did,...

I don't see ya gettin' several Hours out of it, at 7 knots,...
 
bondo said:
Ayuh,... A Sailboat hull is rather efficient, the Tolly is a displacement hull, it Won't glide on little power like the sailboat did,...

I don't see ya gettin' several Hours out of it, at 7 knots,...
Click to expand...


Yes - range is indeed the question for the batteries on the Tolly. But we just need to know.

Our sailboat has a 7KW motor on a 48V system - and yes we understand the difference in the hull efficiency. And now that we've actually re-powered the sailboat with an electric drive - it's kind of a no brainer. There are many benefits since it can regen the batteries while sailing plus make use of some solar panels and a wind drive. One very noticeable thing about the electric motor on the sailboat was the torque. It's instant power - no RPM build up. She just goes - it's a very different feeling.

Enter the Tolly....we didn't pay a lot for this boat (almost nothing). Both Chryslers were toast so it seemed like a perfect RnD boat for the some electric motors. Because the Tolly is a displacement hull with twin screws we have two motors 9KW motors. Each motor will act as an independent system. Separate battery banks, separate motor controllers, separate chargers, separate battery monitors etc etc. It's quite possible we go with a genny back up but for now we just want to get her moving and take it from there.

Trust me, we know we will never replace 400HP with electrics but the cost on fuel (in Canada) on a boat like this is simply ridiculous no matter how you cut it. Because of this, most Tolly people we talk to here just putter along with a 20 HP kicker. She's a cool cruiser and to be honest we just have to try. She's cleaned up, ready for new hull paint and gelcoat in the bilge.

Some people experiment in the kitchen, others their garage, others in the lab,...we experiment in the boat yard - we are Canadian - we are nutty by nature :D

Anyone ever see "Project Grizzly"? about the guy who made a "grizzly bear proof" suit? lol....well, he's Canadian

http://vimeo.com/28326299

...need I said more?
 
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I have two deep discharge batteries powering my inverter. After running the lights at night (on the hook), the TV, and a bit of refrigerator operation, there's rarely enough juice left to make coffee in the morning. Simply put, there's damn little energy in a storage battery--as e-car owners have discovered to their angst.

Jeff
 
I think that you're in for a long road of discovery and trial and error process.
Sooner or later, those batteries will need to be recharged, and the sooner the better if you care about battery longevity.
What takes it's tole on batteries, is the number of cycles, how deep the cycles were, and the time period that the batteries remain in a SOD prior to receiving a full charge.

Have you considered a small diesel engine?

.
 
Everything is going to come down to the type of battery, the amp hrs and the draw on the batteries. With a claim of 90% mechanical efficiency I'm eager to see what kind of draw these electric motors will claim.
AGM batteries need to get used and recharged immediately to avoid sulfate crystals. It's part of the maintenance required. We also will enable a solar bed to trickle in a charge as well while we are cruising along.
 
WhoIsHayley said:
Everything is going to come down to the type of battery, the amp hrs and the draw on the batteries. With a claim of 90% mechanical efficiency I'm eager to see what kind of draw these electric motors will claim.
AGM batteries need to get used and recharged immediately to avoid sulfate crystals. It's part of the maintenance required. We also will enable a solar bed to trickle in a charge as well while we are cruising along.
Click to expand...

Ayuh,.... The power storage is the downfall of 'bout All electric vehicles,...

These lithium polymer batteries make get a days cruise,....
 
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