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Chrysler 440M intake maniflod advice needed

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captain_ed

Regular Contributor
Hello,
I am considering putting an Edelbroch performer (2191) aluminum intake on my chrysler 440M (year 1976). I have the single sided raw water pump on the engine. I beleive it is called a half system. Antifreeze runs through the block and raw water through the exhaust manifolds.

Is this a good choice? What are advantages of aluminum intake vs. stock? Is there such a thing as a Edelbroch marine intake manifold?

My boat is a 1977 40 ft. jersey Dawn sportfish ( very heavy 32,000lbs.) I have purchased a edelbroch 1410 marine carbs for the engines also. I am looking for economy an torgue at around 3200 r.p.m.


Thanks for any advice.

Ed
 
Hello Ed,

I'm very old school, from the period I call the nineteen hundreds. I have owned 383's, 413's, 426's, and 440's, the 413's being a favorite of mine, all of them stock, with AFB carbs. I think they are a great gas engine for ocean use, heavy and tough, always get you home, but get pretty thirsty when pushing a load.

So, let me ask, what reduction are you running, and what size wheels do you turn? At 3200 are you making 16-18 knots with that hull?
 
Reverend Bob said:
Hello Ed,

I'm very old school, from the period I call the nineteen hundreds. I have owned 383's, 413's, 426's, and 440's, the 413's being a favorite of mine, all of them stock, with AFB carbs. I think they are a great gas engine for ocean use, heavy and tough, always get you home, but get pretty thirsty when pushing a load.

So, let me ask, what reduction are you running, and what size wheels do you turn? At 3200 are you making 16-18 knots with that hull?
Click to expand...

I have velvet drive 2.57:1 gear reductions (unusual/ but stock)turning 23 x 23" 3 bladed props. Yes, about 17 M.P.H. on GPS.
I found that my brother in law bought this manifold for me for Christmas. I had no plans to change from the stock manifold and was wondering if there are advantages. Weight really isn't much concern in a boat this big.

Thanks for any advice.
 
Just be sure the manifold you select is designed for low speed torque, not high rpm torque, and it will be fine. You'll probably have to play with wedges to get the carb level.

Jeff
 
captain_ed said:
Hello,
I am considering putting an Edelbroch performer (2191) aluminum intake on my chrysler 440M (year 1976). I have the single sided raw water pump on the engine. I beleive it is called a half system. Antifreeze runs through the block and raw water through the exhaust manifolds.

Is this a good choice? What are advantages of aluminum intake vs. stock? Is there such a thing as a Edelbroch marine intake manifold?

My boat is a 1977 40 ft. jersey Dawn sportfish ( very heavy 32,000lbs.) I have purchased a edelbroch 1410 marine carbs for the engines also. I am looking for economy an torgue at around 3200 r.p.m.
Thanks for any advice.

Ed
Click to expand...
!?!?! No water/coolant runs through a 440 intake. The Edelbrock 7193 is a better choice, no EGR and choke stove. I put one and a BG Sea Demon 750 on my 73 440. The boat picked up ~200-300 Rpms at WOT and seems to run a bit smother.
 

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The Edelbroch Performer 2191 manifold is made for low to mid-range torque.

Do you guys think there is an advantage to this intake vs. the factory intake???? I won't be putting in the edelbroch cam because of one reverse rotation motor.

Opinions?
 
You'll never get back the money you spent on it IF your goal is better fuel mileage. Should perform a bit better, but it takes a huge power increase to gain a tiny bit of speed, so...

Jeff
 
Hi Guys,
Parts just keep coming.....evidently my brother in-law ordered many parts for these engines. Problem is....whoever is advising him does not fully understand that marine engines are different. I am no expert either, but know that there are important differences. I really get lost when it comes to ignition systems.

Currently I have the original 1976 Prestolite distributors the have been converted to electronic ignition (no points). They are wired into a double ballast resistor? There are 4 tabs that accept wires and two springs. I think that they drop voltage? I don't get the differences between singl/double ballast resistor and why you would want to drop voltage?

My brother in-law bought me Mallory #29216 universal 12 volt high output coils. Are there such a thing as a marine coil? I don't know if these coils will work with what I have? I am told that a standard rotation marine distributor has been ordered....I'll have to see what that is. Suppossedly this company makes reverse rotation distributors also? Is 12 volt vs. 9 volt ignition better?

I really appreciate the time you guys take to help me understand this stuff!
 
..."My brother in-law bought me Mallory #29216 universal 12 volt high output coils. Are there such a thing as a marine coil?"

Yeah; they're the same thing but cost more!

..."I don't know if these coils will work with what I have? I am told that a standard rotation marine distributor has been ordered....I'll have to see what that is."

The reverse rotation motors need a special distributor that has thrust bearings to cope with the upforce loads.

..."Suppossedly this company makes reverse rotation distributors also?"

Yes.

..."Is 12 volt vs. 9 volt ignition better?"

Yes, but ballast resistors have still been included with a 12 volt setup to provide some protection if the ignition is accidentally left on. (Ah-hem! Do it once a year, minimum.) This setup requires a high performance coil (45,000 volts) and produces an excellent spark.

Jeff
 
Jeff, you forgot to turn your ignition off...noooo. I never do that (ya right!) Your next mission Jeff, should you decide to accept it, is to design a system whereby when the ignition switch is left on without engine running, the ignition circuit is shut down (maybe through pressure switch). As always, should you blow something up and your mission fails, the forum will disavow any knowledge of your actions. Good luck Jeff.

Hey, we might be on to something here!
 
captain_ed said:
I am looking for economy an torgue at around 3200 r.p.m.


Thanks for any advice.

Ed
Click to expand...

Getting back to Ed's original question, feeding more fuel to the iron horses will make them wind up quicker in a heavy foot sort of way, but the dollars and time spent will do little for fuel economy, in my humble obsolete way of thinking.

If this were a government operation, with an unlimited budget to experiment with, I would be more inclined to change the dynamics of the running gear. At this point, Ed's 440's are running 2570 rpm to get 1000 rpm's from the props.

So, if the reduction were stepped down, allowing the engines to cruise at a less demanding rpm, to say 1.5:1, turning smaller wheels at a higher rate. I hesitate to suggest a size, but let's say a pair of 19 x 19's as a baseline. Any thoughts along these lines?
 
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fastjeff said:
..."My brother in-law bought me Mallory #29216 universal 12 volt high output coils. Are there such a thing as a marine coil?"

Yeah; they're the same thing but cost more!

..."I don't know if these coils will work with what I have? I am told that a standard rotation marine distributor has been ordered....I'll have to see what that is."

The reverse rotation motors need a special distributor that has thrust bearings to cope with the upforce loads.


Jeff
Click to expand...

Not on a Chrysler. They use a drop in collar that applies down force to the distributor/oil pump drive.
 
O.K.
Should I get the original distributors re-conditioned or should I make it a 12 volt system?(My understanding is that the 4 wire ballast resistor drops the voltage to 9 volts?)

If I make it a 12 volt system, do I change the 4 post ballast resistor? Does this effect the ECU (5-pin plug)?

I am not sure if what I have is 9 volt or 12 volt......

I am looking for reliability and possibly better economy. My boat is not built for speed. (I have to start my starboard motor with starting fluid...I think the choke is wired open,so I am putting on the edelbroch 1410)

It sounds like this might just be throwing away money? Thoughts?
 
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That 4 wire ballast resistor is a wierd deal, for most of the installations don't use half the circuits! Mopar's over-engineered plan was to:

1. Jump the resistor to start on 12 volts to the coil,

2. Run at certain conditions (Lord knows what) on about 6 or 7 volts, and,

3. Run most of the time on 9 volts.

Now, the ECMs (ignition modules) come to two 'flavors': the 4 pin and the 5 pin. Either works the same but--guess what?--the 4 pin boxes don't use that other circuit in the 4 pin ballast resistors! Wierd squared.

On mine, I use an aftermarket ballast resistor with screwed on terminals after having that chinzy connect fall off on me (resulting in a hours of carb rebuilding since the motor wouldn't stay running. The resistor is by-passed for starting, so it fired right up, then died when the key was released.)

The bottom line is this: ONE circuit in the resistor is all you need. And if you want really good spark, replace the stock coil with a hot rod, 12 volt coil
(45,000 volt) coil and a screwed on resistor. This setup has been field tested by my buddy John on his Marinette, which never ran better since the conversion. The ballast resistors were retained to provide "Oh crap! I left the ignition ON again!" protection.

Note: Marinettes have a toggle switch deal that's easy to miss being left on. (Do it at least once a year.)

Jeff
 
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