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Honda BF 130 - Have been Debugging Issue for weeks and need some help

I have a Twin BF 130 2000 Outboards.
The Port Engine has been giving me issue for the past 3 weeks and I I have been working to resolve the issue for weeks.

It starts fine and I get underway and once on plane a tone goes off and the engine stalls out as if it is fuel starved.

I have tried opening the Fuel intake to rule out a Vent issue did not make a difference so Vent should be fine.
I emptied the water separator into a clear container and let it sit over night and not one drop of viable water.
I replaced the Water Separator filter with a new one.
I had original 2000 Fuel lines so I replaced all the hose from the Tank to Water Separator and then From Water Separator to Engine with a New Primer bulb as it was looking really soft and it was time.

Since I have twins with 2 separate fuel tanks and water separators I re plumbed the engine to run off the Starboard tank since that engine was running perfect to try to rule out any issues with the Tank or Water Separator.

Working my way into the engine I disconnected all of the little hosed and filters in between the primer bulb and the Low Pressure fuel pump. All the clear and no restrictions.

I installed a new Thermostat as the one I had was 3-4 years old.

The Low Pressure fuel pump on the back of the engine was original so I installed a new pump. No improvement.
I dissembled the VST Clean inside, had fuel in it and the Float was not stuck. I took the High Pressure pump out and tested it with a 12v source and it powered up and sounded fine. I reassembled all and installed a new High Pressure Filter & Reinstalled on boat.

I placed the engine into Fault Code debug to check the codes and only one code showed up 3 Flasshes which according to the chart I found online was a MAP Sensor Fault Code. I was able get this part at the local parts store so I swapped out the Maps Sensor.

I replaced the Plugs which where about 2 years old and they where heavy Black as you can see in this photo:
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0GkAlZXTc4zHNmuA5U92y3JDQ

Top 4 are Port engine with issue.
Bottom 4 are Starboard Engine that is running great.
All 8 plugs where changed prior to the this weekend failure.

So I tried again on the water this weekend and never left the dock still had Tones but this time it was a surging issue.
I started the engine and put the engine neutral and brought the engine up to 3500 RPM and it keep alarming and surging and then would die.

Video of RMP, Alarms, and Engine showing the issue:
https://share.icloud.com/photos/0yDcm63vtQjYkXYL3FXxZolXQ#Tomkins_Cove


There are not many parts left from the VSP forward. Fuel Rail, Injectors, and pressure regulator.
Obviously computer and plug wires.

I am going to head to Autozone and see if they have a Fuel Pressure gauge in their rental tool fleet so I can attach it to the High Pressure nut on the side of the HP Filter to try and see if the Fuel Flow is stead or floats up and down to ensure that thru the VST everything looks good.

I also am trying to get the Fault Codes to reset but have not figured that procedure out yet as I tried the undoing of the kill switch 5 times and shut the key off will in Jumped Debug mode after installing the VST and it would not clear. Any idea on how to get the codes to clear?

Really could use some help as fall run is here and I need to get to Montauk :)

Troy
 
Code will not clear unless fault is fixed. You will need a manual and a multimeter to does some electrical troubleshooting of the map sensor circuit. It does sound like a map fault given that it's running so rich.
 
So I replaced the Map Sensor with a brand new unit. Looking at the wiring it just looks like it attached to the Computer Module and the wires look cleanly connected so I would of expected the Code to clear. If some one can confirm the procedure to rest the Fault Codes on a 2000 BF130A model and if there is any actual signal back that the process is completed like a tone or change in the lights briefly.
 
Bridge the two terminals in the red diagnostic plug, turn the ignition on with lanyard connected, then activate kill switch at one second intervals until a long beep is heard indicating codes are clear. As mentioned before, if there is still an active fault it will not clear.
 
So I took the time today to Do a Cylinder Pressure Test and Leak Down test and I think I am narrowing in on the issue:

Compression Check looked good:
Top Cylinder 1 150 PSI
Top/Middle Cylinder 2 149 PSI
Bottom/Middle Cylinder 3 148 PSI
Bottom Cylinder 4 148 PSI

Leak Down did not go as well Cylinder Dead Top and using 100 PSI input:
Top Cylinder 1 100/88 PSI Loss of 12%
Top/Middle Cylinder 2 100/83 PSI Loss of 17%
Bottom/Middle Cylinder 3 100/28 PSI - Loss of 72% - Obviously a Failed Leaking Cylinder
Bottom Cylinder 4 100/93 PSI- Loss of 7%

My assumption is an Internal Head gasket or Cylinder Ring Leak either way not sure if it is worth fixing a 2000 Honda BF 130 with 850 Hrs on them and a lot of Steering Arm corrosion.

I am reading this data and coming to the correct assumptions?

I am going to run the same 2 tests on the other engine tomorrow to compare notes.

Troy
 
Before condemning the motor I would be checking valve clearance, if they are tight they can still give reasonable compression but fail the leak down test.
 
So would having one of the 4 Cylinder make the engine surge up and down and shout down, or is this a secondary issue I found while debuging :)

I pulled the new Plugs and after only running the 20 mins at the Doc at 3,000 RPM they where fouled black from running rich.
I was looking around more today and I found some other threads with similar symptoms that pointed to the Pressure Regulator on the Fuel Rail as the issue as it had failed and was not maintaining a steady pressure.

I have a Fuel Pressure Testing kit but of course Honda choose to not include a shrader value for testing kits and you need there 6 mm adapter :(

I have a fully working 2nd motor I was thinking of swapping the VST and Pressure valve to the broken engine and seeing if the issue goes away.

I guess the question becomes is the engine usable with the leaking the 3rd Cylinder. How does this Cylinder issue impact the running of the motor?
In what way will the issue negatively impact the engine operation?

Troy
 
So I did the leak down test again making sure the Cylinder TdC arrows where aligned and I got the following:

engine cold, throttle wide open, sip stick out and oil spout open:

100/88 or 12% loss
100/68 or 32% loss
100/61 or 39% loss
100/96 or 4% loss


i also checked for good flow at the High Pressure Strew where you attach the tester and it had read solid pressure.

i also test the well running engine and got the following:
100/90 or 10% loss
100/68 or 32% loss
100/61 or 39% loss
100/96 or 4% loss

Since the plugs are getting saturated/rich and it is surging up and down I am thinking the Pressure Regulator is probably bad.

I am going to move the Pressure Regulator From the good engine to the bad and see if it solves the issue and then I will post an update.

is there an additive in could add to the oil to help with compression?

thoughts on the Leak down Numbers?
 
A faulty MAP sensor will also cause this issue but do the fuel pressure test anyway
Have you checked valve clearances yet?
 
Something isn't right with your leak down testing in my opinion. The results for BOTH engines is nearly identical! Too much of a coincidence if you ask me.

Anyway, to begin with, your initial compression test doesn't indicate that there should be such a huge discrepancy between the cylinders.

Are you positive that you have the engine locked down and the pistons aren't moving during the test?

Where do you detect the leakage coming from? With compression that low across the board I assume it's mostly to the crankcase?

Have you verified that the valve timing is correct? Hopefully you're working with THE shop manual and not a knock off like Seloc.

At any rate, I would take Ian's advice and check valve lash on the misbehaving engine and follow through with your plan to swap the pressure regulator to see what happens.

Good luck.
 
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