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1978 85 javalin Johnson

SmoketownMarty

New member
New to the boat world.:rolleyes:
Got a 76' Regal 19ft with a 78' 85 Javalin outbaord engine....auction bought, so I know nothing of the past on it.

I cant get it to start.
:eek::mad: If I prop open the throttle plate it seems to want to fire off with a spray of 50/50 blend of fresh gas and outboard Seafoam additive in a spray bottle. My process is to give it a coupe sprays down the carb and then step up to the key and turn it over and it'll burb a bit.

There is s electric prime pump which works fine , I drained some gas out with it. The gas mix smells fine but is very dark blue mix. The quick disconnect fuel line on the engine spritz fuel out when disconnected on the up stream side the engine side weeps a bit too but looks very different more gooy / sticky. Both sides stop weeping shortly after being disconnected, pretty sure that the diaphragm fuel pump on the side engine is not working or air locked. so a rebuild of the FP is in order. or is the a bleed valve on the FP

The top 2 cylinders on the have 90psi compression ( after a spray of light oil in the plug hole & recheck compression, brings them up to ~100psi...call it dry vs wet)

Looking at the rear of the boat....the lower left is at 80-85psi and no change after rechecking wet. The lower right was also just below 90psi dry and just a little less then 100psi wet.

The compression test is a lower than I would like.....with no real change on the lower left lung...is it time to just change engines? or can it be saved?? or not worth the effort

Is there reed valves in the engine? Can they be changed or are they not worth the effort??

looking for feedback....thanks

 
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Compression seems low but adequate and not likely the cause of your symptoms. New fuel pumps are available super reasonably priced on eBay. I have concerns about your old oil fuel mix and I would not suggest running that. It could be interrupting the engine trying to start. Should check spark and that will use a gap tester with a 7/16 inch minimum gap. Make sure all plugs are out with a nice fast cranking speed and you should observe a crackling white blue spark. Reed valves are quite reliable and rarely the cause of engine problems. You might observe if engine cowling insulation is breaking down and getting inhaled into the carburetors. Typically once the insulation starts to break down I remove all of it and clean every speck of debris....... Remember engine is also a vacuum cleaner.......it will get sucked inside, sometimes causing reed valve failure. Mice also add to the condition.
 
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If your compression tester is known to be good then I would remove bypass covers to inspect pistons and rings.-----Would cost you some small coins for new gaskets if needed.
 
Thanks for the reply!
I'm hoping to get this ready for a trip in 2 -1/2 weeks to take along to a Minnesota lake trip....
With plugs out, yes cranking speed is winging it around pretty well. Definitely faster than with the plugs in.
The spark does appear nice and crisp and white and blue, not sure about 7/16 jump. I did get new plugs for it.

So you think that it is worth investing in. I hesitate to invest a bunch of money in it only to learn the rest of the engine needs major work. So if I get new fuel pump and rebuild the carbs it probably worth it? No the insulation on the under side of the cowling seems intact, but will give it a closer look. ( good point)

Can outboard engines be rebuilt?? Worse case scenario and I do need to repower this. How big of a engine can this 19' boat handle?? and what about a prop, looking to for a good all around performer without being to pricey?
I have not gotten to the lower unit yet either , which I anticipate will need a water pump rebuild as well and the throttle cable is shot. The sump pumps do not seem to work or do they have a float switch and need water level to work?? UGGH.


 
tester is good. the bypass cover are just the caps where the spark plugs go in? be gental, I'm very new to boat engine & boating, but not afraid of general engine work.
 
There are 4 covers on the side of the cylinders.----Just 6 small 1/4" screws to remove each one.------Inspect the pistons and rings before spending any hard earned coins on this motor !!
 
I had a jav on the back of a 19 bertram was good engine slow to get out the hole and fell back in the hole in a following sea, put a black max 135 on it is a little heavy but is a different boat
 
more questions.....what is involved/needed to convert this old unit to auto mix the oil and gas. obviously another container for the engine 2 stroke oil & some lines. Will the carbs care or will they need some adapting /re-tuning?? Different fuel pump?? To get away from mixing fuel and oil in the fuel tank.
 
more questions.....what is involved/needed to convert this old unit to auto mix the oil and gas. obviously another container for the engine 2 stroke oil & some lines. Will the carbs care or will they need some adapting /re-tuning?? Different fuel pump?? To get away from mixing fuel and oil in the fuel tank.
Lots of money.
 
Why would you want to do that? Automatic oiling systems have certainly killed more motors than those few dummies that forgot to add oil to their gas. I know that for certain.......been overhauling 2 stroke motors since 1966. Got 3 more under the shade tree right now.
 
Ok...so I'll stick to the original .
I did add a link to my youtube channel in post #7

The other thing is I can move the piston side to side in the cylinder . Pushing on the piston skirt through the port.
I get about .02 of movement....my gut says that is excessive.
 
Clearance on that motor in the perfect world is .004 to .005......if you got .02 movement......better bring along a paddle, brother. Maybe borrow a dial indicator and recheck.
 
Better postpone that trip as motor needs serious work....most likely it that is why it was up for auction. That's the small bore V-4 and in my opinion not worth repairing, would be better to find a 115-140Hp and boat will perform better also.
 
Better postpone that trip as motor needs serious work....most likely it that is why it was up for auction. That's the small bore V-4 and in my opinion not worth repairing, would be better to find a 115-140Hp and boat will perform better also.

trip is still on, it's whether we drag a boat or not, is the question.
I have managed to get the engine to run briefly, enough to know it hitting on all cylinders....definitely a fuel delivery issue primarily. I have a fuel pump rebuild kit coming.

The boat came with a hand air pump for blowing up the tubes and what not. So I unhooked the fuel line after the fuel pump on the side of the engine. I then stabbed the nozzle of the hand pump into the line going to the carbs & gave it some gentle air pressure. I could hear the air hissing in the carbs....BUT, there is more resistance on the pump then I would have thought. I suspect that the needles and floats are not working well.

Is there a way to get fuel in the bowls without pulling the carbs?? or a plug to remove to see if the bowls have fuel in them??

I understand the engine is not very healthy...but if I can get it to at least run.

 
Better postpone that trip as motor needs serious work....most likely it that is why it was up for auction. That's the small bore V-4 and in my opinion not worth repairing, would be better to find a 115-140Hp and boat will perform better also.
So... will parts exchange from say a 140 to 85 of the same , or nearly the same vintage 77'-78' and vice-versa???
(yes still talking Johnson.) carbs..fuel pump....lower units...etc
 
You have 92cc motor and the 115/140 are 99cc motors. Has to be 1978 or later to interchange. Yes a lot of parts will interchange but block/pistons/carbs are biggest difference.
 
The 77 may have a different ( hydraulic assist shift ) lower unit than 78 models.-----Usually gears / bearings are the same for a given year 90 / 115 / 140 HP model.
 
Is there a pin that locates the piston rings and keeps them from rotating on the piston??? So that the gap won't catch the ports and break.  I was told that there is by ole fella, but he was trying to sell a engine which does run
 
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Is there a pin that locates the piston rings and keeps them from rotating on the piston???
Yep......see the pin in the ring groove..

Piston-for-a-Johnson-Evinrude-outboard-motor-433004.jpg
 
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