V-Drive Issues - Warning and Fluid...

1) Issue 1 - port motor has a V-drive warning and I can't seem to clear it. Interested in determining how to clear the code (engine scanner doesn't show anything), and if possible, how to jump out the warning so it goes away, even artificially. I've read some conflicting information, that the waring is related to fluid level, and some that say that it's related to fluid temperature.

I've read that the proper way to clear the code is to drive at 1,500rpm, and the warning will go away. Did that yesterday, and it didn't work. The warning seems to be messing with the operation of the boat. That motor falls on its face right at 2k RPM. Is that correct? Seems to go in a "safe mode," right at 2k RPM.

2) Boat sat for a few years before I bought it, in Michigan heating and cooling cycles, and ended up getting some condensation in the V-Drives. V-drives have noticeable water in it, but it gets better every fluid change, and level never increases (I don't believe the case is cracked, allowing more water in). The manual says it's supposed to take straight 30W. I tried flushing it, to no avail. I ran new oil into it, until clear oil came out, but there's so much fluid stuck to the gears and walls, that when I put new fluid in it, it still looks cloudy.

I considered filling it with diesel fuel, letting it sit for 24 hours, and draining the diesel fuel. I also considered putting slightly heavier fluid in the V-Drives (40 or 50 wt), running that for a while, then draining that fluid, or putting the old oil from my truck (which is pretty black) in the V-Drive, cruising around the marina at idle speed, and draining that out. I could probably do that 2-3 times per drive, if I changed the oil in both cars and the truck.

What is the best option to get the condensation out of the drive?

Is it better to run traditional oil or synthetic oil in the V-drive?

How do I clear that damn code?

not much to go on there, wrt the V drive...do you have a DTC? if so, specific number? who'd drive and which engine?

Condensation 'inside a boat' doesn't occur to the extent most people believe due to lack of air changes...that said, the best way to remove the water is to bring the item up to normal operating temperature for a while...

My preference has been synthetic oils for decades...they work very well with no breakdown if chosen properly....

makomark said:

not much to go on there, wrt the V drive...do you have a DTC? if so, specific number? who'd drive and which engine?

Condensation 'inside a boat' doesn't occur to the extent most people believe due to lack of air changes...that said, the best way to remove the water is to bring the item up to normal operating temperature for a while...

My preference has been synthetic oils for decades...they work very well with no breakdown if chosen properly....

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Drives are Walter V Drives, RV-40 I believe (RV-10 - RV-50 recommend SAE 30). Given the water slightly diluting the oil, (it's just a little cloudy at this point), would you recommend running a higher viscosity, (SAE 40/50?) until the condensation is completely gone? I'm considering filling them "over full" (past the dipstick line), idling around the marina, and draining the oil. Should help get more water out that way.

Any advice as to how to clear the warning code, where the sensor is at, and what it's measuring? I'd like to jump it out, or unplug the damn thing, at least temporarily to test the switch, and/or correct the issue.

I'd go with the recommended oil and NOT overfilling it...that will only lead to making a mess in the bilge...

what exactly are you referring to as a 'warning code" and how are you seeing it?

The typical Walters install has a warning light and they are known to flicker at low RPM...

Thanks Mako

The "warning light" is on the dash. The panel description of the warning says that it comes on due to a "low oil" condition, I've heard that there is no level sensor, and that it's actually a temp sensor, but I cannot find any electronic sensor on the V-drive at all. The v-drive is an RV-40.

The method for clearing the code is to allegedly run the boat at 1500+ RPM for 15 minutes. I did that, but the code won't clear. Could be a bad sending unit, but I have no idea where to look. I cannot find any electronics or sensor on either of my V drives.

(On a side note... What is under neath the snout that sticks out in the front, under the red tag?... And, are there any bearings that are recommended to replace, or easy to replace, without removing the drive... or any other maintenance that I should be doing, other than fluid changes?)

I believe your V-drive's oil pump is the protrusion under the red tag...

The 'idiot light' is normal driven by a pressure switch. it should be under the water fitting (on the side) same side as the oil level gage...which should the the RH side of you last picture. I've seen both one and two terminal switches installed. The factory data I have states its a 2 PSI NC switch...so, removing the wire should eliminate the LED's illumination, if its controlled directly by the switch.

Again, I have no insight into the "code" you mentioned again. Running the engine @ 1500 in neutral won't build any significant oil pressure within the gear....having it in fwd may...

makomark said:

I believe your V-drive's oil pump is the protrusion under the red tag...

The 'idiot light' is normal driven by a pressure switch. it should be under the water fitting (on the side) same side as the oil level gage...which should the the RH side of you last picture. I've seen both one and two terminal switches installed. The factory data I have states its a 2 PSI NC switch...so, removing the wire should eliminate the LED's illumination, if its controlled directly by the switch.

Again, I have no insight into the "code" you mentioned again. Running the engine @ 1500 in neutral won't build any significant oil pressure within the gear....having it in fwd may...

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Thanks Mako, I found the V-drive low oil pressure sending unit. I'm planning on disconnecting it, and removing it, to inspect behind the switch, to make sure that there isn't air or something plugged up back there.

I noticed on the V-Drive tag that the oil recommend is "SAE 30, or Exon Spartan EP-68 gear oil, or AGP-80 gear oil." Do you know where I can find more info on the latter two choices? I tried to find info on the EP-68, and it's clear as mud. I did read about Sunoco SUNEP 68, which is supposed to be an equivalent, and I liked what it had to say; the description was for "reduced bearing wear under heavy load." That sounds like a perfect application for a gear box on a 21,000lb boat. That said, I can't find it locally, can't find any info on it, and cannot find a quart of anything similar locally. I also figured that it may help with the low oil pressure warning.

Then I found some information on an online forum that suggested that EP-68 would be the equivalent to SAE 20. That seems counter-intuitive to say the least. Do you have any knowledge of the gear lubes, the compatible fluids, or a reputable source? I also hear that a lot of people are using Merc Quicksilver 75w, but I don't trust that info. Merc slappies (I have nothing against Mercruiser, but slappies are slappies) will only use their fluid in every application, and think their's some Merc magic in their fluids - I don't share the same beliefs. Just looking for the right fluid for the job.

APG-80 gear oil is a Lubriplate product if I remember correctly...so you can check with them for a local dealer...Exxon and Mobil merged a while back and hard to say which brand name they kept...I'd say look for Spartan.

You can always call Walters and get their current recommendation....personally, I'd use a full synthetic product....

makomark said:

APG-80 gear oil is a Lubriplate product if I remember correctly...so you can check with them for a local dealer...Exxon and Mobil merged a while back and hard to say which brand name they kept...I'd say look for Spartan.

You can always call Walters and get their current recommendation....personally, I'd use a full synthetic product....

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Thanks Mako.

I confirmed with Lubriplate's website that APG - 80, is just 80W gear oil. Has some military specs, etc., but is there any reason that I can't just use a quality synthetic 80W gear oil? There are no known Lubriplate distributors near me.

Based on a quick glance at the lubriplate data sheet, I'd say you would be ok with a synthetic based oil that meets the GL-5 and the ISO viscosity grade of 68....again, I'd say Walters is the best source of substitutes....I'd stay away from any 'salesman's opinion'....

makomark said:

Based on a quick glance at the lubriplate data sheet, I'd say you would be ok with a synthetic based oil that meets the GL-5 and the ISO viscosity grade of 68....again, I'd say Walters is the best source of substitutes....I'd stay away from any 'salesman's opinion'....

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I did some research on Lucas 80W90, and I think that's what I'm going to go with. It's served me well in the past, and I considered adding some "lucas climbing" additive regardless, and they already put it in their 80W90. A high performance mechanic swears by adding a cap full of Lucas additive in all of his Bravo outdrive rebuilds, and runs it in his personal equipment.

The Lucas lube meets or exceeds all of the MIL specs, and other specs of the Lubriplate APG-90 (and then some).

I did notice upon draining that despite the fact that the dipstick was full to the -H line, it only had 1.5Q in it. I believe the recommended quantity is 2Q. I know the drive capacity will change a bit based on the angle of the drive, but I'm going to try putting 2Q in it, and hope it doesn't belch out in my bilge somewhere.

I ended up flushing the drive with Diesel and I'm glad I did. It got a lot of moisture and crappy oil out of the drive.

To flush it I just added 2Q of diesel per side, started the boat, bumped both motors in reverse to get the props moving (and gear box spinning) a bit, and grabbed a dock pole to pull boat back forward. Seemed to do wonders for what was in the drive.

FWIW, Kerosene was recommended and it was said that Kerosene "attracts water." Further research indicated that was untrue, and kerosene does not mix with water, but diesel does. That prompted the change for my flush fluid.

I'll update the results of my low oil pressure situation.

If I still have an issue after clearing the code, swapping the sending unit, etc., would you recommend looking into the oil pump on the drive? Do they go bad? I looked at the schematic from Walter, but again, clear as mud... Looks like it's just a spring, gasket, and some sort of metal spinning disk to circulate the oil. I can't see how that would go bad, unless the gasket failed.

The directions from Walter also suggest to "lubricate the flex joint," but it's tough to see what they're talking about. The .pdf is poor quality. Is the "flex joint" just the U-Joint, and is it simply lubricated with std or marine grease?

Overall, that should be fine. I would NOT overfill it....I'd start with the gear oil going up to the low mark and then spinning it and check it....and then fill it but not above the full line.

The 'flex joints' will only be there is you have the short jack shaft and the reference is to the 'U-joints' - nothing magic there. the drawing I have shows zerk fittings on the joints (cant tell if its on the caps or the cross)...

on the pump, the document I have has a troubleshooting procedure....and I'd suggest doing some of those steps when you go to put in the new oil...if you dont have the walter's manual, I can email you what I have...just send me you email via the PM system...

Water in a Walter vee-drive can also come from a leak in the top cover gasket. When installing these gaskets, always use Permatex, especially around the dipstick hole. Water will eventually cause internal failure (been there). FYI, if anything fails on a Walter, don't bring it to your local ship. Have it pulled and ship it back to Walter. They have on hand any part they might find to be needed. They also will do a complete rebuild---I sent my unit back and told them to replace anything that could wear. Would have bought a new one but they are an inch longer than mine & won't fit. On advice of the owner some 40 years ago, I've been using 85-90 gear oil.