New to the Crusader. Looking for advice.

New to the site and new to Crusaders. Quick backstory. I am looking for a solid boat where I can get all of the major systems upgraded to the point where I have something that is reliable. This is not an investment as I plan to retire with the boat in another 10 years or so. As a test engineer I know to do research and pay attention to details. I've been doing mechanic work for decades and engines are just something where you need to pay attention to details and not skimp on materials. The benefit of expertise and experience of others is critical.

Below is a picture of my last rebuild which required 12 new cylinder liners and a myriad of other silly things that the Brits did with engine designs. 5.3L V12. It was a fun project.

My reason for stopping by. I've found a 1984 30'+ class boat for sale that comes with a pair of Crusader engines. The boat is in decent shape; however, the engines are in unknown condition and considered "Not running". With that in mind, the boat is aggressively priced. For the layout of the boat, it is exactly what I'm looking for. Already being out of the water is an added bonus to some degree as the prop shafts and struts can be addressed if I were to undertake this as a project.

So, it has 1984 (I am assuming) Crusader engines in it. The condition is completely unknown.
My immediate thought is that if I pull the trigger on this boat, I will have 2 engines that will be rebuilt. For my goals, that is a requirement. The rest of the driveline will also be reworked completely.
Marine rebuild kits for this engine are not out of line pricewise with what I would expect. Not quite like a Chevy 350, but marine is more demanding.

A few questions.
Are the cranks in these engines hardened? The Jag engine was hardened and was withing a few tenths of original spec.
How much can these blocks be bored from stock. Not to gain displacement, just in case there was damage to cylinders.
The heads and valves will run through the shop too.
How likely is it that the block to head facing is in decent shape? I've read threads where if the face is pitted or corroded, then the block is ruined. Is that true?
What are some of the typical issues that you run into with these engines?

I know that without a tear down or engine history these are difficult questions to answer, but people that have experience with particular engines can provide gut feelings.

I am not in a rush to get a boat back on the water rather I want to get engines rebuilt right so that when they go back into the boat, they don't need to be touched for another 15 years or more.

Thanks for any insights.

model/serial numbers would help a good bit. accumulated hours would also be good to know as is the cooling system implemented. Hopefully they are big blocks in a boat that large.

Overall, these are standard production GM engines that were marinized by Crusader.....So the 'what can you do' questions are mostly driven by the GM block in question.

Assuming they are original engines, they are over 35 years old....so, you may want to do the business case to see if a set a new engines are more cost effective given your reliability requirement...Factory reconditioned units would also be worth consideration.....

MM, thanks for the response. Yep. There are too many unknowns with it right now.
If only to have the engines on stands in my garage right about now. That would give me a good baseline to do a cost analysis.

I'm waiting to hear back from the seller with some more details. Like how long it had water sitting in it. That tells me to run away. Quickly. Very quickly.

But I am not one to back away from a challenge and this would certainly be a challenge.

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bakerjw said:

My reason for stopping by. I've found a 1984 30'+ class boat for sale that comes with a pair of Crusader engines. The boat is in decent shape; however, the engines are in unknown condition and considered "Not running".
If these have been Raw Water Cooled, I would suggest NOT using them to build your fresh engines with.
Rust/corrosion follows no predictable or pre-determined path. If they have been Raw Water Cooled, I would begin with Automotive cores that have seen Ethylene Glycol ONLY for their entire lives.

With that in mind, the boat is aggressively priced.
FYI.... boats of this age and that are not functional, are often free!
Perhaps post a few photos and what the owner is asking for it!

For the layout of the boat, it is exactly what I'm looking for. Already being out of the water is an added bonus to some degree as the prop shafts and struts can be addressed if I were to undertake this as a project.
I would suggest performing a moisture content test on the stringers, etc.

So, it has 1984 (I am assuming) Crusader engines in it. The condition is completely unknown.
My immediate thought is that if I pull the trigger on this boat, I will have 2 engines that will be rebuilt. For my goals, that is a requirement. The rest of the driveline will also be reworked completely.
Marine rebuild kits for this engine are not out of line pricewise with what I would expect. Not quite like a Chevy 350, but marine is more demanding.
Are these SBC engines?

A few questions.
Are the cranks in these engines hardened?
The bearing journal surfaces would be.

How much can these blocks be bored from stock.
.030" is common. They can go .040" safely. Keep in mind that .030" over is only .015" off of the wall.

Not to gain displacement, just in case there was damage to cylinders.
This is one reason why you DO NOT want to rebuild an engine that was previously Raw Water Cooled.

The heads and valves will run through the shop too.
The cylinder head combustion chamber volume must be a match for your piston profile selection!
Don't get the cart ahead of the horse here.

How likely is it that the block to head facing is in decent shape? I've read threads where if the face is pitted or corroded, then the block is ruined. Is that true?
The deck height dimension for the SBC is 9.025" . Your machine shop can check this.


What are some of the typical issues that you run into with these engines?
The factory and most all re-builders use the stupid, no good, ineffective, lame, GM Full Dished pistons.
You can do much better with a Q/E piston.

I know that without a tear down or engine history these are difficult questions to answer, but people that have experience with particular engines can provide gut feelings.
Again, if they have been Raw Water Cooled, your best bet is to begin with Automotive cores.

I am not in a rush to get a boat back on the water rather I want to get engines rebuilt right so that when they go back into the boat, they don't need to be touched for another 15 years or more.
Please take a few minutes and read this thread starting at post #7.

http://www.marineengine.com/boat-forum/showthread.php?394668-V6-to-V8-engine-swap

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Sage advice and I greatly appreciate you taking the time to post. Sometimes rare to find on forums.

If they are not FWC engines then I'll be walking away.

The asking price is $9,400. Local surveyors charge about $400.00 flat rate for a non mechanical survey.

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bakerjw said:

Sage advice and I greatly appreciate you taking the time to post.
You are very welcome!

If they are not FWC engines then I'll be walking away.
If these have been Raw Water cooled, keep in mind that you are only a few dollars away from good automotive cores.

The asking price is $9,400. Local surveyors charge about $400.00 flat rate for a non mechanical survey.
If the engines are no good, you might be able to negotiate the price.
If the owner is not able to sell this 1984 boat, it will represent quite an expense for him to decommission and to dispose of.

As said earlier, often boats like this are free, or at least very cheap...... especially an older 1984 boat.
Try to negotiate the price!

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