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propeller help AQ280

Because I like the big Solas (Amita 3+) I've addressed the interference problem...making sure to seal the resulting hole securely.
IMAG0918.jpg



So then a long hub propeller is basically a short hub propeller that has the forward spinner spacer built in to the aft end of the propeller beyond the splines?
 
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jeffnick said:
So then a long hub propeller is basically a short hub propeller that has the forward spinner spacer built in to the aft end of the propeller beyond the splines?
A long hub propeller is just that...... a propeller with a longer inner hub than that of the Standard inner hub propeller.
The long hub propeller will typically have larger blades!

The "spinner" is the nut, or "cone nut" shown as "D" below... (D = aft section of the 2 pc...... the 1 pc is not shown).

The "spacer" or "spacer/line cutter" is shown as "A" below.
250/270/275 = short spacer/line cutter regardless of which prop.
280/285/290/SP etc, = long spacer/line cutter regardless of which prop.

standardhub.gif



longhub.gif

Click to expand...
 
jeffnick said:
Ricardo - quit teasing me and post a picture of the back end of a long hub prop!
Click to expand...

The rear of a long hub propeller will look very similar to that of the rear of a standard hub propeller.
Not until it is installed will we see the differences.

First difference being that the inner hub splines will protrude further aft from the shaft splines.
Therefor the 1 pc spinner will NOT work!

I don't think that I can explain this any better or more detailed than what I've already offered here in this thread!

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Jeff, while this may look like a long hub propeller, it is a short hub propeller.

Note the large blades.
We'll see a combination of small and large blades being use on this prop.

Note the SS tab washer access slots. The SS tab washer can be used with this propeller.
1442.jpg



The long hub propeller cannot use the SS tab washer, therefor the slots cannot be used.






This would be a long hub propeller.
Note the absence of the SS tab washer slots, and note that the splines stop short of the end of the inner hub.

s-l1000.jpg




I hope that this helps.


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PatinIdaho said:
What was the reason for short and long hubs?
If either works would it not be better to just have one style.
Click to expand...

At some point Volvo Penta introduced the large diameter/large blade propeller.
This become known as the "elephant ear" prop!
I'm sure that this was the reason for increasing the hub length.
 
Y'all can tell by all my questions that I have been very confused by the long/short hub situation. Here is what I think I have learned:

If you have a long hub shaft - the one that's threaded, and a two piece cone, you can use any Aquamatic propeller - the short hub with the cone spacer, the long hub without - along with the locking bolt.

If you have the short hub shaft, any Aquamatic propeller will fit, but you'll not be able to lock on the spinner w/ bendy tabs using the long hub propeller and you'll likely end up losing the propeller.

There was a TSB that suggested threading short hub shafts to use the locking bolt instead of the bendy tabs - if yours is one of these you can use a long hub prop (sans cone spacer) with the locking bolt

If you want to fit a Solas short hub prop to your short hub shaft, you'll either need to reduce the line cutter/spacer by about 1/8" or trim the same amount off the front or back of the Solas prop to allow use of the bendy tab.

The Solas short hub prop can be used with any threaded shaft without modification if you use the cone with the spacer and the locking bolt.

I believe the long hub propeller was introduced with the advent of the threaded shaft. There was no longer a need for the bendy tab so the spacer part of the cone was added to the propeller, simplifying propeller attachment by using the locking bolt.
 
I had a big ear long hub prop on my boat. Boat just did not feel right to me.
Tried a used short hub small ear and was a big difference for the better for me.
Long hub was 15.5x17 cup Sola's ameta 3 + (new)
Short hub is 14.5x19 and way better Volvo Penta. (used slight nicks on edges)
 
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The several Solas Amita props I've used have all been cupped. The several OEM Volvo props I've used are not cupped. My (40+ y/o) old rig is rated at 30mph but seldom sees speeds above 10 mph. Also, I don't have power trim. As I understand it, both speed and trim are needed to take advantage of the cup. I had the cup taken out of my Amita 15" but I do like the 15.8 (Amita+) better for economy and slow speed control. I haven't bothered to have the cup taken off the 15.8.

More about us here:
http://tinyurl.com/nkqtmgp

 
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jeffnick said:
Y'all can tell by all my questions that I have been very confused by the long/short hub situation.
Don't feel alone! Many have trouble understanding this.

Plus Jeff, there is far too much Mis-Information out there regarding this topic.
I've even seen and read where Prop Shops refer to AQ series Short/Long shafts and don't get the spacer/line cutter info correct!


Here is what I think I have learned:

If you have a long hub shaft - the one that's threaded, and a two piece cone, you can use any Aquamatic propeller - the short hub with the cone spacer, the long hub without - along with the locking bolt.

Again, try thinking of this as though there is NO long hub shaft..... and think in terms of all shafts NETTING the same length of shaft and exposed splines when the correct spacer/line cutter is used.
We cannot use the incorrect spacer/line cutter because that would place the propeller differently on the shaft/splines.

Examples:
**250/270/275 with the incorrect long spacer/line cutter.... the prop will sit too far AFT.
**280/285/290 with the incorrect short spacer/line cutter..... the prop will sit too far FWD and will cause interference with the ring anode and bearing carrier.


If you have the short hub shaft, any Aquamatic propeller will fit, but you'll not be able to lock on the spinner w/ bendy tabs using the long hub propeller and you'll likely end up losing the propeller.
Again, think of this as though there is NO long hub shaft..... all shafts NET the same length of shaft and exposed splines when the correct spacer/line cutter is used.

There was a TSB that suggested threading short hub shafts to use the locking bolt instead of the bendy tabs - if yours is one of these you can use a long hub prop (sans cone spacer) with the locking bolt
If we were to drill and thread tap a non-internally threaded prop shaft, we would loose the nickel/chrome plating.

If you want to fit a Solas short hub prop to your short hub shaft, you'll either need to reduce the line cutter/spacer by about 1/8" or trim the same amount off the front or back of the Solas prop to allow use of the bendy tab.
Again... no short shaft, and under normal conditions, we do not trim any material from the spacer/line cutter.
I'd have to say that the prop is the problem..... not the shaft or spacer/line cutter!

The Solas short hub prop can be used with any threaded shaft without modification if you use the cone with the spacer and the locking bolt.
The short hub prop can be used with either style lower unit and with either the SS tab washer or the 1 pc spinner or both parts of the 2 pc spinner with the center locking bolt.

I believe the long hub propeller was introduced with the advent of the threaded shaft.
With the "internally threaded" shaft.... yes.

There was no longer a need for the bendy tab so the spacer part of the cone was added to the propeller, simplifying propeller attachment by using the locking bolt.
Actually, the spacer portion of the 2 pc spinner is omitted when the long hub prop is used.
IOW, only the AFT portion of the 2 pc spinner (along with the center locking bolt) is used for this prop.
Click to expand...

Study hard....... we test on Monday! :cool::D


And by the way..... you have a nice looking family and family pooch......, and it looks like every one is having a great time. :D




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Thanks for the comments Ricardo. It's the 'thinking' (Again, try thinking) part that confuses this old fart. I just need to know what works. I bought a complete working 280 so I'd get the threaded shaft and could use either long or short hub propellers, but with what you've taught me and what I've learned there's no reason for me to do the swap.

I agree the Solas short hub is not as advertised for the un-threaded shaft...but reducing the line cutter allows it to work...over and over - and I go through props regularly.

AND - my education continues. This surfaced in rummaging through the spare parts bin.
IMAG0932.jpg


A single piece cone without a locking bolt hole - just like would have been used when the 250's first came out and no-one would have thought a threaded shaft was to follow.
 
jeffnick said:
http://tinyurl.com/o9j4sfu
Click to expand...

Finnally! A forum thread that actually goes to the bottom of "short hub/long hub" problems with 280 drives etc.

Sorry for replying to an old thread but I have the opposite problem described in the link above. I have a 280 drive but a short prop with the 1 pc spinner (the long one, threaded and locked with a bolt). I get a gap of about 1 cm between cone and prop. The owner before me seems to have done what's being done in the link above.
20160402_101850_small.jpg
My question: Can I just have a friend make me the short spacer that is being cut away in the link above and just place it after my "short" line cutter or does this spacer need to be welded in place on the line cutter to not damage anything?

Also, could someone confirm the correct length of the long line cutter?


Thanks in advance.

Regards, Olle from Sweden
 
If the propeller shaft is indeed a 280 shaft......
and if the spacer/line cutter is the correct OEM "LONG" spacer/line cutter.......
and if the propeller is an OEM Volvo Penta prop........
and if the SS locking tab washer (or the white plastic washer) is an OEM Volvo Penta part ......
and if the spinner is an OEM spinner (aka cone nut) .......,

then all should fit and work as per how Volvo Penta intended!


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RicardoMarine said:
If the propeller shaft is indeed a 280 shaft......
and if the spacer/line cutter is the correct OEM "LONG" spacer/line cutter.......
and if the propeller is an OEM Volvo Penta prop........
and if the SS locking tab washer (or the white plastic washer) is an OEM Volvo Penta part ......
and if the spinner is an OEM spinner (aka cone nut) .......,

then all should fit and work as per how Volvo Penta intended!


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Click to expand...

Thanks!

That's a lot of "if's" but I think I can answer every single one with a Yes. Could you perhaps confirm the length of the long line cutter?
 
My 280 line cutter is about 1 3/8". I'm thinking that my 250 is shorter but it's on the boat.

I would put the shims between the line cutter and prop if the blade on the cutter is in the proper place.


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Would someone mind explaining to me why we would not want to use the correct OEM parts ??????? :eek: :confused:

With the AQ series stern drives (up through the SP drive), there are only two lengths for these prop shafts, and only two lengths found with the spacer/line cutter.

When the correct spacer/line cutter is used for the shaft..........., all shafts NET the same length of prop hub splines.


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RicardoMarine said:
Would someone mind explaining to me why we would not want to use the correct OEM parts ??????? :eek: :confused:
First, the OEM parts are extremely expensive compared to aftermarket.
Second, we may have OEM parts, but because our rigs are 40 years old we don't know whether we have the correct OEM parts or not.
Third, we often don't know which parts are correct because of the interchangeability of the Aquamatic drives.

With the AQ series stern drives (up through the SP drive), there are only two lengths for these prop shafts, and only two lengths found with the spacer/line cutter.

When the correct spacer/line cutter is used for the shaft..........., all shafts NET the same length of prop hub splines.
The above information is not relevant to anyone trying to fit a propeller on an Aquamatic drive. If it fit's I wouldn't be asking, if it doesn't fit, tell me if there's any way I can make it work.


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Click to expand...

So here's my take...
If your cone leaves a gap when you fit your prop, you probably are using a 250 line cutter instead of the longer 280. If you don't want to invest in the OEM 280 line cutter, you can shim the shorter one between the cutter and prop.
 
jeffnick said:
So here's my take...
If your cone leaves a gap when you fit your prop, you probably are using a 250 line cutter instead of the longer 280. If you don't want to invest in the OEM 280 line cutter, you can shim the shorter one between the cutter and prop.
Click to expand...

That's correct for me anyway + it's easier since I don't have a Penta dealer nearby.
 
olleman said:
That's correct for me anyway + it's easier since I don't have a Penta dealer nearby.
Click to expand...
So I reread this thread from the beginning and at one point I did measure/post both the 250 and the 280 line cutter measurements.
The 250 measures .625
The 280 measures 1.375

And when I used the Solas prop with the 250 line cutter (on the 250 drive), I needed to make the 250 line cutter 1/8" shorter so the bendy tab could grab the splines.

If your propeller shaft isn't tapped for the locking bolt, don't be afraid to drill/tap it. It's not all that difficult. I'll even lend you the drill guide if you need one.

http://tinyurl.com/h5wcgor
 
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jeffnick said:
So I reread this thread from the beginning and at one point I did measure/post both the 250 and the 280 line cutter measurements.
The 250 measures .625
The 280 measures 1.375


And when I used the Solas prop with the 250 line cutter (on the 250 drive), I needed to make the 250 line cutter 1/8" shorter so the bendy tab could grab the splines.

If your propeller shaft isn't tapped for the locking bolt, don't be afraid to drill/tap it. It's not all that difficult. I'll even lend you the drill guide if you need one.
These are carbon steel propeller shafts with a chrome/nickel finish from the seal surface on towards AFT.
If you drill and tap this shaft for the 5/16" NC internal threads, you will cut through the plating and into carbon steel.
Carbon Steel will rust up.
Click to expand...
 
RicardoMarine said:
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Click to expand...
Yes, I've heard that about he rust, but so far, no rust for me even after after my first trip in salt water. As recommended, I use locktite on the end of the locking bolt, and then permatex#2 toward the head. I'm thinking my 'newly cut' threads are pretty well isolated from the environment..but time will tell. 'Sure gives me a lot of flexibility in prop selection, not to mention the savings in not using an OEM prop.
 
jeffnick said:
So I reread this thread from the beginning and at one point I did measure/post both the 250 and the 280 line cutter measurements.
The 250 measures .625
The 280 measures 1.375

And when I used the Solas prop with the 250 line cutter (on the 250 drive), I needed to make the 250 line cutter 1/8" shorter so the bendy tab could grab the splines.

If your propeller shaft isn't tapped for the locking bolt, don't be afraid to drill/tap it. It's not all that difficult. I'll even lend you the drill guide if you need one.

http://tinyurl.com/h5wcgor
Click to expand...

Thanks, this was more or less exactly the length me and a college arrived at after some discussion and meassurments. I've now got a 7mm spacer made with the help from my collegue who's quite skilled at those things (he actually made me a new bushing from scratch last autumn for the seawater pump)

My shaft is threaded and I use the locking bolt already so no need for more work on the drive shaft. Even though it's a very nice gesture to lend me the drill guide, I think we would have some practical difficulties since I'm on another continent :)

,Olle
 
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