TLDI 50 Stalling / Revving Up at Start Up

Hi,

I have a TLDI 50 on a tiller steer open ally boat. (Engine has done 10 hours approx.) I am having issues with the engine revving up at idle on start intermittently, and or starting then stalling. On attempting to start the engine will either not start or start / idle for 30 seconds then stall.

I have reset the TPS numerous times.

I can reset the TPS and then try to start and the engine will do the same, not start / rev / stall. Reset TPS, same issue. Can take up to 6 odd resets to get problem resolved.

Some background.

Battery is not an issue. Have a 105 amp hour / 760 cca

Battery has a isolation switch fitted / rear sounder / bilge pump and nav lights run off this battery.

I always run premium or high octane fuel ( std is 91, I will use 95 or 98 RON )

Has the standard tote tank, and between tank and engine is a fuel / water trap.

Have a 120 amp battery at front of engine connected to the rear unit via a voltage sensing relay to assist charge on front battery while underway during a fishing session.

Electric Tilt / Trim / start

On start up I turn key, wait for lights to go out / electric pump to finish cycle. Start Engine.

First time it happened was last weekend. Put boat into water and ensured throttle in idle position, start engine and engine revved to approx. 2-3000 rpm then back to idle. Interesting I thought, but it continued to run no issues. Went approx. 5 mins from ramp to set up some crab pots, engine at idle during this time, 7 minutes to my fishing spot, out of gear, / engine at idle. Stop engine. Deploy electric, fish for about 40 minutes. Get call from mate who was running late that now at launch. Lift electric.

Start Engine, Run across to pick up mate. Idle , out of gear stop engine. Load his stuff in. Start Engine, All Ok

Run towards back of dam / deploy mates pots ( 10 minutes, Idle looking around for 5 minutes, Out of gear / stop engine/ deploy electric. Fish under electric for approx. 1 hour.

Start Engine / run back past pots to far banks, Stop engine, float around for a bite to eat.

Go to start engine, rev /stall. Hmmm. Start engine idle / stall. Start engine ok, off to other side for a swim. Engine at idle / stop engine. Turn off sounder.

Swim for 30 minutes. Push off. Start engine /stall. Key to off. Start Stall/ crank /no start / key to off, isolation switch off. Isolation on / key on / lights go out / start /idle / stall. Key to off. Deployed electric and remembered that dealer said something about resetting tps if you start not in idle and it plays up. No phone reception. No Google. Continue under way via electric. Continue to cycle key / start / stall for maybe 6 times before it came good and ran.

Engine ran fine, went to other side, voltage ok 13 plus volts on sounder. Deployed electric, fished under electric for 45 minutes. Went to move off,

Start / Stall / Start / Stall. Finished day under electric, back to pots / back to ramp.

Drove home and looked up how to reset tps. Reset. Start engine / idled fine.

Engine was due for firt service. Advised dealer about starting issue. Investigated to find no faults recorded with some moisture around TPS connector plug. Fine. Good to go

To Today. Dropped in and turned on isolator, primed fuel bulb, turn on key, wait for lights and priming pump to cycle. Turn key. Starts / runs/ all good. Problem must have been water issue.

Headed off under main engine power through a 6 knot area for about 20 minutes. Engine speed about 2000 rpm. Engine running fine. Bit windy but came to cliff area where we to start our day and commenced a troll at low idle Trolled for about 10 minutes till we came across some friends. Shut down engine. Have a chat floating around for about 5-10 minutes.

Engine at idle, turn key, wait for warning lights out, start and runs fine. Excellent all seems good. Trolled with outboard at low idle / push key to second stage / then high idle and vary this procedure for 30 minutes. Came back to end of troll run and decided to go for a swim to cool down.

Motor away and open throttle to accelerate away and engine coughs, keeps running. Thought must be some oil fouling from idling for a period. Should with DI but maybe. Slowly accelerate onto the plane for 2 minutes to reach swim area. Back to idle, into shore, out of gear and stop engine.

Swim for 20 odd minutes. Get back in and push off. Throttle at idle position, turn key, wait for beeps / lights / prime and start engine. Engine races to 2-3000 rpm then stalls.

No, What has changed? Everything was running fine. Key off for 15 seconds, key on, wait for lights/ start idle stall.

OK lets reset TPS. Reset TPS. Key off 30 seconds. Key on, wait lights/ prime, start engine, stalls. Key off for 15 seconds, restart. Stall.

Deploy electric , move off bank, hit Ipilot anchor. Reset TPS. Key off. Attempt to start / stall or high rev. This continued for 3 more times. Remove cowl, check tps for any moisture. None. Blow on connector and tps. Reset TPS. Start, stall / start / stall.

Reset TPS maybe 3-4 more times before it ran ok and idled. Sometimes it would high idle after reset and stall. Sometimes idle for a minute before it would stall. Eventually stayed running and went for a bit of a accelerated run to see how the engine reacted. Got to half throttle, engine stalls.

Keep moving under IPilot and go through TPS reset procedure maybe 6-8 times ( feels like 6-8000 ties btw) before it would run.

Elected to head back to ramp and went to accelerate away and took along time to come onto the plane. Kept engine at about 4000 rpm and cleared the idle time. Back to idle, accelerate out of hole all ok. Engine running fine. Wide open throttle ever so slight miss but cleared and dropped revs back to 4000 and came to ramp bay area and elected to keep fishing. Stopped / started engine. All OK.

Deploy Ipilot and run along cliff area. Fished for 40-50 minutes under electric. Key on ( volts on sounder 12.8 ) wait for lights, throttle at idle position, start…stall. Start Stall. Reset TPS about 4 times before it came good. Sometimes it would idle for 30 seconds and you put it in gear and stall.

Eventually started and accelerated fine, back to ramp. Onto trailer and call dealer for ideas tomorrow.

Anyone have any, or had similar?

Hmm.
Definitely would go to diag mode and check the ECU memories for clues as to what errors the motor may have logged.
Would also check plug condition.
Would also confirm tank venting OK.
Also visually inspect all air and fuel lines, etc... general visual check to see if anything is blatantly amiss under the cowl.
Assuming you are running DFI type oil.

Thanks for the reply.

Removed 1 plug and no noticable or excessive fouling. There was some normal grease on the plug which has made contact with the top of the plug and recepticale. I cleaned that off as I think that it is not necessary.

Tank is venting Ok. Was one of the first things I checked. It in some ways sems like a fuel problem but all looks ok. Fuel lines look ok and as the boat is new ( 2 months ) they should be. Was thinking of running a new line from tank to outboard to eliminate fuel filter.

Every thing under cowl looks ok.

I am running the Optimax / Merc DFI oil.

Will speak with dealer oday to see if he has any ideas.

I think he had problems originally when he fitted engine and had eror codes / start isues because battery was too small.

Could thiis have screwed the ecu or tps?

Thanks for your reply

OK

Bit more google work. Looked up how to error codes etc

So when I interpret the first set after the sweep to 5000 rpm, tacho settles on 1800 rpm ( with abttery warning light on) I would assume that is 18 hours

Hit Key for 1 second to get error codes

- Battery light on / tacho 5400
hit key one second again
- Battery light on / tacho 7000
hit key again
- Battery light on / tacho 5200
hit key again
- lights out no tacho reading
hit key again
- Back to start and get all three again

Do not have a manual, what are these error codes.

I have requested a manual from my dealer so I can purchase and have this info.

The chart is extensive, and I don't have a manual here at home; I don't expect to be at the office for a few days, due to extreme weather in western NY state (USA), so go with the manual you get from your dealer. In all fairness, your dealer should be your best resource to correct this issue... under warranty.

Thanks Paul

bit more google work found for me that two codes refer to the TPS and one for Fuel Feed Pump. Think the tips could be causing the other.

Anyway off off to the dealer today and boat will be left with them. Hour drive each way but that's life.

one thing I noticed with the TPS is that it is rubber mounted. Obviously to take some of the engine vibration away from the vr sender. However seems quite loose. Will take that up with the dealer.

had a look at the cables / links to see what may be happening in case sender is not getting a true idle validation and causing an issue. Does the TPS have an inbuilt idle validation or just uses throttle position % as input got that?

i know when we install units on vehicles we tend to hold one way wen installing and then tighten screws to secure.

i work for cummins engine company (29 years) and have some understanding obviously on how all system should work.

Thanks for for your input.

I believe that the idle position is a straight % of total TPS range (that's the reason for resetting initial TPS calibration), but not 100% sure.