'1959 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

I've got a '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt That I want to have rebuilt/reconditioned top to bottom. Does anyone have any information on a shop or person who can take on this project?

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Maha,

You should probably let people know where you are located... what state, what country...

Thanks.

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Sorry, didn't think of that. Oregon USA. Willing to ship within the continental U.S. Maybe even Canada if that is necessary.
Thanks

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

I do those during the winter as a hobby business--but not during boating season! If you are serious, there's a few things you need to consider:

1. It's expensive! At a very minimum you're looking at new gaskets, rings, seals, decals, etc. that will run well over $200.

2. Parts need to be scrounged on eBay and etc. since many are NLA (not available)

3. Freight to to east coast and back has become very expensive--at least $250 each way.

4. The old paint has to be sandblasted off, the metal etched, then painted with a durable automotive paint (with clear coat) followed by new decals.

5. Did I mention that it's expensive!

Jeff

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

I'm definitely serious. Buying a new 45h.p. motor is expensive, so I'm still weighing the cost of a rebuild against the expense of a new motor. I haven't gotten enough information yet to tell me exactly what the cost is so that I know what I'm in for, but I haven't given into abandoning the idea because some shop says to me to buy a new one from them because it is impossible to get parts or to have it rebuilt. I've got an old "59 Dorsett runabout and this motor would be a good match. Not too heavy.
I was told the motor has a good reputation and so I'm not giving up on this without gaining some insight into what it involves. I bought it for $200. It turns over but I haven't yet checked compression or tried to start it. The previous owner said it ran for him when he last tried to start it but needed a tune up. I don't have much familiarity with outboard motors but after looking at the evinrude that came with the boat I have and looking inside this one, there appears to be a magneto and a distributor rather than internal coils and parts the evinrude had. I could be wrong but this looked like something much simpler than the evinrude and the motor looks stout without a lot of weight.

If someone would give me a good impression of what I have, what it will take or cost and what I would have after the investment I might have a better idea of what I'm getting into. I realize the new 4 stroke motors are efficient and there are better boats out there than mine, but I'd hate to devalue my old boat and what I have invested in it after pulling it out of the blackberry bushes after ten years to clean it up, put a new floor, instruments and steering into it to spend a whole lot of money to buy something I only use on an occasional basis.

Anything you can tell me about this motor will enlighten me and help me along this line of thinking so I am better informed.

I reckon a greenhorn like me becomes informed by either making mistakes and throwing away his money or at least becoming familiar with what works and what doesn't. At this point I have no regrets and besides, it's only money so far that I've spent and not what I need to spend that I will walk away from if it all falls to hell..

Seems like there would be a few shops that would do old motors like this on a semi-regular basis for those who are a bit attached to their old toys.

Thanks

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Those are a cool looking motor that would definately keep the vintage looks alive on your boat.

It was marketed as a Model 58A "Super Thunderbolt", available in both manual and electric start, with an optional alternator on the electric models.

There was also a "custom deluxe" edition that had extra chrome which really gave some style to the all white motor.

Just about all the ignition parts for this are still very much available, but as Jeff notes, it can be expensive.

The ignition uses points, condenser and a distributor. The points and condenser are cheap enough (less than 20 bucks each). It's the distributor cap ($250+) and the rotor (about $375) that can quickly add up the cost if you need to restore the ignition.

But all is available including coils and harnesses..

This is a very "restorable" motor with just about every part you could need still readily available.

Your greatest cost could well be the "shop time".

Have you considered getting a manual and doing some of the work yourself? Could be a great project. And you are correct, these are a fairly "simple" motor. If you could keep the cost of "professional help" to a minimum it could be a relatively "economical" restore...

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

I'm willing to do some of the simple stuff, but don't know if I want to pull pistons or tear down the lower end without some kind of guidance. I can certainly change a set of points cap and rotor. I'm even willing to keep the original paint if I can determine it is mechanically sound. But like I said I still don't know what it means when someone says expensive. $5,000 for a new motor sounds expensive. If someone could rebuild this one for me for $1000, I don't see that as expensive when comparing it to a new purchase, even if shipping isn't included.
I've seen ads for some rebuilders who start at $999 and offer a 3 year warranty and include shipping but so far I haven't had luck with the ones I've tried to contact. One flat out told me it was impossible to get parts for a motor this old.

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

(here's some of "my" numbers for you - actual costs will vary by area - but this should give you a starting point)

Should it need a "rebuild" you will generally get quotes between 1500-2500 dollars including parts and machine work (normally 50 bucks a cylinder to hone or bore).

That would normally include pistons, rings, gaskets, seals and bearings. Extra's would include rods and crank polishing or replacement (which could add 1000-2000 bucks to the total in a worst case - a new crank is very expensive for some models)

A rebuild does not "normally" include work on the carb(s), fuel pump, ignition system or the lower unit.

A lower unit re-seal could run a couple hundred bucks in labour plus the seal kit.

A waterpump service would run between $150 (impeller only) and $250 (complete kit) - including parts.

A lower unit rebuild can easily cost 1000 bucks (parts and labour) provided that the bearing carrier is not seized into the case.

Carbs are often 200 bucks for the first carb then 150 each for additional carb (including kits).

Ignition work can run you 100 bucks an hour (troubleshooting and install time) plus the cost of parts. Depending on the complexity it could take anywhere from two to five hours to track down and correct an ignition problem.

So, before you make any decisions you need to determine what/how much is wrong with this.

One further note - if you do decide to rebuild this (or any) motor you get a "like new" powerhead. You have to compare that against the cost of another "used" option or the cost of "brand new".

The brand new will have a modern ignition, be more fuel efficient and produce more horsepower (yours is rated in BHP so by today's SHP measurement it's about the equivalent of a 40 horse) and will have a warranty.

So only you will be able to decide if it's say "worth" putting 3K into a "classic" motor to maintain the "look" or if perhaps a nice 40 horse DFI 2 stroke Tohatsu ($4950 retail) would be the more economical (long term) solution.

Hey, there may not be that much wrong with the motor - have a look....

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

As soon as I can, I will get to it and have a look. I'm out of the country on business until June 1st

Thank you

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

One more question. Should I be looking for a specific kind of repair manual to get the best information on this motor?

Anybody familiar with this one? http://www.ioffer.com/i/144853545

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Maha,

I do that work in the winter time, it is not a cheap process. I did a 59 last year that won best motor at the acbs manotick ON Canada boat show. It was a 4700$ CDN job with all the polishing and rechrome of those parts.

I strip the motor completely and each part is beaded and properly painted with the right colors then reassembled with all new bolts etc. I rebuild the igntion, carb, fuel pump(s) new lines, repair replace the harnesses and rebuild the starter as well.

This winter i have a long list of motors Merc Mark 20-h, Mark 55H, 1958 Mark 58 sunset and tan, Mark 75H, Merc 650XS and 1500XS. currently I am doing a Mark 20H and Mark 55H for a customer in Windsor, Canada.

Doug Kay in the US is another great option, he is unbelievable with the work he does, I am not sure on his schedule he has been working for a couple of brothers with a HUGE racing collection and restoring for them non-stop for the last couple years.

here are couple shots of the one I did last year.

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Nice except for the red shocks! What ere you thinking?

Jeff

PS: The 44 cube four cylinder--made from the late '40s 'til 2000--was the best damn motor Carl Kiekhaefer ever built! Period. Seeing a new 40-50 hp outboard costs a fortune, why the heck not rebuild an older one, especially a 44? Makes sense to me, that's why I have a couple. They also weigh at least 50 POUNDS less!

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Yes, totally agree - I love these motors.

They almost never turn up in the used market and a "toasted" one still commands more money than I'm willing to pay - at least for now...

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Jeff,

The customer wanted the shocks that colour and they were an option in those years I have a 57-58-59 catalog and also shows in my DR owners manuals that the shocks came matched to the cowls.

Yep these motors are the best ever built for sure. I have alot of 4 and 6 cylinders from 56 to 68 including racing engine versions. I have a 30H-1 and a 55H-1 as well. The 55H-1 is fully restored awaiting a choke rod for the KA7A's, The only 4 bangers I do not have are a KG9, MK40 and MK50. but I will.

My favourite motors in my collection are my twin blue Mark 55 Manual start motors that came off the same boat. Someday I will find another boat to rig them both on. The only issue is they are manual start motors. I also have the 55H Twin Blue motor to go with those.

Here is the twin blue 55h and a silent six that a did a while back.

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Nice, you guys are giving me inspiration to bring out the full potential of this motor. I was thinking of changing the color from white to black. would this be outside of the norm in regards to restoration?

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Please do NOT go with black! Many people have done that to make their motors look more "modern" and it's looks just pitiful!

AM I right, Dave?

Jeff

PS: Nice collection, by the way.

Re: '59 45hp Kiekhaefer Murcury Thunderbolt restoration/rebuild

Well that would be up to you, but alot of followers would say no as the motors did not come black until later, you can find lots of early black 50's The silver anniversary motor is a good one. I would NOT do it in black; Alot of racers did that with there 55h motors in the day and now if they still have them they are putting them back to oem colours. The value as a restoration would be much less as well, not that you would ever get out what you put it, that is why this is a lbr of love, I have over 75 hours in that motor in the pics and probably over 100 in each of my racing motor restorations, but I did them for me.

Same with the Mark58 I am doing this winter, The customer's father who has passed bought this motor brand new in Ottawa in late 57 for 58 and had it on a peterborough and the customer is currently restoring the boat for the motor and all this as a tribute to his father. Pretty cool stories in some of these motors. Ironically this person was looking for two years to find someone to perform the restoration and when he found me it turns out he live 15 minutes from my shop.

I actually had a run of custom pistons made for these motors in .020 and 040 oversize with Wiseco a couple years back alot of racers snapped them up quick I had 50 sets of each and I am currently doing the same with 40 Cu IN pistons. If there was enough interests I would do another run of the 44 CI versions as well.