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BF225 Intermittent Beep

SHTF

New member
Ok so went to take the boat out after it was recently serviced and no problems encoutered, my BF225 started and ran fine but on the second outing with intermittent beeping at idle after about 5 minutes, (about 5 or 6 times, then pause for about 10 seconds, and repeat). I noticed that this doesn't happen when the engine is running over 1,000 RPM, but i have to turn key off, start engine, and get to 1k rpm before the beeping starts (about a 30 second window after it's warmed up)... drop it back to idle and beeping begins within about 30 seconds. No warning lights show on the panel, green light is on, engine runs great at idle and speed.

Needless to say the dealer that serviced it, no names mentioned, has ignored my requests repeatedly to fix the issue and I'm very unhappy about that, they said it tested fine and won't come to the dock at the house to correct the problem (and they are a very long trek on the water away, not to mention I have to take a day off to do this and they are ignoring me).

Anyone have any clue on the beeping? I've used the boat about 6 times for short trips with no lack in performance, just have to stay away from idle and haven't been running it hard.

side note: for the first time today, i trimmed the engine up when i got back and there was a little fuel draining out of the cowling that i maybe didn't notice on other trips (definately not running it till i figure this one out). upon further inspection i found a tube near the front block of the motor it was coming out of... from digging online i believe this is the tube for the vapor separator (on honda's site). Supposedly there is a screw to tighten maybe since i guess the vapor separator can be drained? could this be an indication of another probem, or maybe have to do with the beeping?

Much thanks to anyone that can help me out here! Also any reccomendations to a "dockside service" dealer in Miami, FL would be greatly appreciated

-DM
 
Most likely, the beeping is water in your water separator. It is telling you that you have water in your fuel. It should be a clear plastic cylinder about 2 inches in diameter near your dip stick. You have to pull the separator off and empty it out. Check out pp 31, 73 & 74 of this Honda Owner's manual at the Honda web site http://marine.honda.com/pdf/manuals/00X31ZY26100.pdf

It tells you how to empty it.

If you have your owner's manual, it is in there too, but it may be on different pages.

If you have an external water separating fuel filter, you should check it, drain it or change it...depending on what kind you have.

If you do not have one, I would highly recommend adding one to your fuel system.

As for the fuel leak...follow the tube...it will lead to the screw on the vapor separator. Check out p 80 in the owner's manual that I referenced above. It has a couple of pictures, although not the best. You will need a flashlight and a long skinny flat head screwdriver.

I don't think the two situations are related...but I have been wrong before.

I do not know anything of the Miami area. Hopefully, someone else can jump in and help you with that question.
 
It's definately a pain to get to the water separator while the boats in the water and moving around, i do have external racors and have checked, replaced, and drained them, just haven't had a calm enough day to try (without losing any parts) checking the one on the engine... that side did pick up a lot of water out of the tank in the racor.. from what i can see it didn't look like there was any water in the one on the engine wihtout taking it apart but it is hard to see. Any other causes of that kinf of beep or that should be it? also do you know what the reset instructions are for the system, it's the kill switch 5 times with the key off and hold on the 5th right? do i need to do this after

thanks a ton for the help! i was thinking all i might need to do is tighten the screw for the vapor separator but always better to be safe on a second opinion of why there was fuel flowing out of it...
 
Hondadude is right on target with the diagnosis, but a caution. Be very careful about loosening the screw to purge the VST - open it just enough for the fuel (and any water) to start flowing through the tube into a clear glass or plastic quart bottle. If you open it too far, it can come out and then you must take apart the lower end of the engine to get it.

I assume you have the fuel-water separator with the sensor on the bottom - you'll see the sensor on the bottom with two wires coming out and going to the ECM. It is possible that the sensor float is sticking. The procedure for removing and checking that kind of filter and sensor is on pages 3-14 to 3-14 in the shop manual. Follow them very closely. It's probably in the owner's manual, also.
 
Hondadude is right on target with the diagnosis, but a caution. Be very careful about loosening the screw to purge the VST - open it just enough for the fuel (and any water) to start flowing through the tube into a clear glass or plastic quart bottle. If you open it too far, it can come out and then you must take apart the lower end of the engine to get it.

I assume you have the fuel-water separator with the sensor on the bottom - you'll see the sensor on the bottom with two wires coming out and going to the ECM. It is possible that the sensor float is sticking. The procedure for removing and checking that kind of filter and sensor is on pages 3-14 to 3-14 in the shop manual. Follow them very closely. It's probably in the owner's manual, also.
 
Once you clear the trouble, that will clear the alarm. To do the reset that you are referring, requires either an HDS or the Service Plug Installed at the time you do it. It really only applies to major codes.

I hope there are calm seas in your future...I generally drop things in the water even when everything is perfectly still.
 
I have to disagree with the above diagnosis. It is obvious that your oxygen sensor has failed. Classic O2 failure symptoms are: alarm does not come on for 1 - 2 minutes after starting the engine if you keep the engine in idle, and it will keep beeping even if you rev up the engine. however, if you turn the engine off (resets the computer), start up the engine and immediately give it gas and start cruising, the beep does not come on. $100 says it's your O2 sensor.
 
BTW, the other honda dude is an imposter, I have been Honda dude on many forums for over four years!

OK so I followed the first thread and tightened the VST (needless to say the "dealer" left it loose and it was spilling fuel into the engine :eek: :mad:)

Second note: Drained the water fuel separator on the engine (even though I have a RACOR before it in the line)

Third note: I'm thinking you are right "Honda_Dude" lol, both those scenarios did not fix the problem... well besides the gushing fuel into the cowling :eek:

How hard is it to replace the O2 sensor? I've worked on a lot of engines, outboards (primarily 2 stroke), etc... but every one is different, where is it located and where can I buy one, second thought; is it worth the price of the O2 sensor to "hope" it fixes it or should I just get someone out here to take care of it before spending money on replacing things one by one :confused:... the boat is in the water and I don't have a trailer, keep that in mind when talking about replacing the O2

Thanks man!
DM
 
I have to disagree with the above diagnosis. It is obvious that your oxygen sensor has failed. Classic O2 failure symptoms are: alarm does not come on for 1 - 2 minutes after starting the engine if you keep the engine in idle, and it will keep beeping even if you rev up the engine. however, if you turn the engine off (resets the computer), start up the engine and immediately give it gas and start cruising, the beep does not come on. $100 says it's your O2 sensor.

FYI "hondadude" I think you owe "honda_dude" $100.00 :cool:

Thank you for the help and suggestions "hondadude" I appreciate all the input, plus it didn't cost anything :D
 
It appears that I have ruffled some feathers. I did not know there was a honda_dude when I typed in a username 447 posts ago. Sorry about that, honda_dude. I have been going by my first name until they changed the web site, after that, only hondadude appeared. If there is a way to easily change it, I will be happy to do so. I have e mailed the webmaster.

Anyway...it is not really hard to change the oxygen sensor but is costs almost $200.

Going back to the water in the fuel issue.. If the alarm is .3 seconds on and .3 seconds off and no warning lights other than the oil light is on, it is water in the onboard water separator or it is a stuck float or wiring harness issue. If the alarm was 1 second on and 1 second off, then it is a PGM issue (which could be the oxigen sensor), but normally there is a mil light (red light) on at the time. I guess there is always an esception to the rule. Most of my customers have reported seeing a red light. I just put the HDS on it and normally find a stored code.

The draining of the vst, that c_hawk suggested, was not to make the alarm go away, it was to make sure that there was no water in your system.

You indicated that only the oil pressure light was on.

Do all your indicator lights come on for two seconds then go out, when you start your engine?

The following is a summary of alarms and light situations that chawk_man put together. That should show you where we were coming from.


View attachment BF_225_Alarms-335066.pdf

As to your question about having someone check it out. It might be worth the money. Not only can they watch what is going on, they can check your indicator lights too. You may want to mention, that you think it may be the oxygen sensor so they can bring one with them on the visit. I do not know if they charge for return visits.

Mike
 
Ok, not quite sure with the .pdf, I have no lights on warning me of anything, but here is the key panel I have (look at 3rd page down, one on the left)
36452-ZW7-110AH
BF75/90 and BF115-BF225
Single Engine Key Switch
Panel with PGM-FI Lights–
Analog or Digital Gauge​
Ready
http://marine.honda.com/pdf/accessories/ml.rerap45a.MAC_Key_Switch.pdf

When i first turn the key on, the water temp and oil light turn on for 2 seconds and go off, nothing from the battery or check engine light. when i start the motor the oil light is on green, no blinking.

As for the VST, the dealer left it open :mad::mad:.. i'm sure that it has drained any water out of the system multiple times since it was spilling fuel into the cowling! I'm at a loss here, time to find another dealer, that's for sure :confused:
 
All four of your lights should come on for two seconds, then go out...except for the battery light, when you turn your key switch to on and do not proceed to start your engine. Once the engine starts, battery light should go out and the green light should come on (good oil pressure).

That is why we went down the path of water in separator. It is the only pulsating alarm with no lights but the oil light on.

It could very well be the Oxygen sensor, but it could be something going on with your charging circuit too. It will hard to narrow it down without the lights. And then, it will only tell you there is a pgm or a charge failure. That is why it may be wise to have a Honda dealer to check it out. Make sure they have an HDS to do the testing.

As for the lights...you could do some checking yourself...

The first thing to check are the fuses...especially fuse number 5. It is probably ok, but it is responsible for power to Alternator, Oxygen sensor, Mil/alternator light (yours do not work), as well as a few other things. It is a long shot since some of the other items may affect runability. The power to the oil and overheat lights are provided from the key switch panel.

If it is not the fuse, you could just have a bad connection like a connector loose or not connected. On the back of your key switch panel, there should be a three wire cable with a narrow connector about 1 inch long and, 1/3 inches wide and about an inch long. Look at the connector on the end of the PGM panel (32340-ZW7-000AH)
on page one of the accessory page http://marine.honda.com/pdf/accessories/ml.rerap45a.MAC_Key_Switch.pdf

you just referred too. It plugs into the main wiring harness with a similar size plug.

If that is connected, you may want to pull it apart and reseat it, making sure the pins are not corroded.

If that is good, then you should go to the engine. Remove the hood and remove the black plastic cover on the lower front of the engine. That is where most of the cables are plugged together.

There is probably one cable with a bunch of wires (17) about as big around as your middle fingergoing into the front of the engine (along with shift cables and hoses). As it goes into your motor, it splits into two cables...one 14 wire with a big round connector and one three wire going to a retangular connector (or plug...I can not remember which). Follow the small cable and make sure it is plugged in and the connection is good. That is about all you can do without a manual and elecrical troubleshooting ability.

By this time, if you still have the problem, you are probably ready to throw up your hands and call a Honda dealer. It would probably be wise to do so unless you have unlimited time, curiousity, and patience.
 
I have to disagree with the above diagnosis. It is obvious that your oxygen sensor has failed. Classic O2 failure symptoms are: alarm does not come on for 1 - 2 minutes after starting the engine if you keep the engine in idle, and it will keep beeping even if you rev up the engine. however, if you turn the engine off (resets the computer), start up the engine and immediately give it gas and start cruising, the beep does not come on. $100 says it's your O2 sensor.

Hallo,
I live in Italy, Sicily. Syracuse. Google translator help me to write this post.

I know this thread is old but I have read your description of the O2 fault and consider it to be concise and perfect. My problem is exactly how you described it.

I have a BF 250 with oxygen sensor 35655-ZY3-C01(like 225 AK1 2007 and later) .

In my outboard O2 sensor has been replaced (by warranty) 4 times between about 20 and160 hours of operation .
After the sensor replacement the alarms finish, but after a more or less long time returns
Now at 360 hours the check engine light went on again like I know very well.

On my BF250 contacts, plugs, sockets as like new, the spark plugs and the coils are OK, the motor runs well and it does not lose strokes, but it has the symptoms you described.

Do you know if someone has definitively solved the 35655-ZY3-C01 failure?
 
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