1974 65 hp johnson not going into reverse

I have checked out all the el

I have checked out all the electrical and everything checks out. I have the correct oil in the low end and I cant get it to fully engage in reverse. I can hear the clicking sound form the low end of the gears slipping the prop will turn slightly but it wont fully engage. any ideas?

"Daniel.... In your other post

"Daniel.... In your other post which was entered in the I/O section, you indicated that you had an electric shift engine. I answered that post and will enter a copy of my reply here.

OMC did not make a electric or hydro electric shift engine in 1974. The last hydro electric shift engine was made in 1972. However, if you are certain that you have a hydro electric shift engine, make sure you're using "Premium Blend" lube and not "HiVis" lube. The HiVis is too thick and will not operate correctly.

If on the other hjand, you have a standard shift engine, it sounds like you have either a missajusted shift cable, wear in the shift linkage, of a badly worn shifter dog and gear.

Joe "

I am quite sure it is a hydro

I am quite sure it is a hydro-electric shift because it says it on the shifter and the wiring is I am also sure the fluid is correct perhaps the year is wrong I am not real sure. Where do I find that? The serial # is j36637331 at least thats whats on the motor title. also any idea what the part # is for the washer that goes between prop and the outer nut. The last time the reverse worked I lost a prop comming out of a ramp. I found the prop but I couldnt find the washer. My Dad used a makeshift washer and put it back together. Could this goofy repair cause the reverse problems?

"Daniel.... Look on the port &

"Daniel.... Look on the port (left) transom bracket (the bracket that bolts to the boat). There will be a plate that contains the Model Number and the Serial Number. There is also a core plug, about the size of a quarter, on the powerhead (looks like a small freeze out plug) that has those number imprinted on it. We are interested in the MODEL NUMBER only. Get that number to me so that I can pinpoint the engine. We ned to know what we're speaking of before we can figure the problem and the cure.

Joe"

" Joe could answer this better

" Joe could answer this better than I can, but with the small OMC motors, they have a reverse lock to prevent gear damage when the motor is revving too high. Is it possible that the rpms are too high and this system is engaging? I don't know if the 1974 65 HP motor even has that system. I was worried that something was wrong with my motor when that happened, but it turned out I was just revving it too high in idle and OMC's engineering was protecting the motor from being damaged. "

Joe Sorry I havent got back s

Joe Sorry I havent got back sooner I have been on the road and this is the first I have been able to respond. The Model # is 65ESL72S and the serial # is j3663733. Could the idle be too high as Jdkline suggested? Just trying not to crak the case if I dont have too. Thanks for any help you can give

"Daniel.... As I mentioned in

"Daniel.... As I mentioned in my e-mail back to you, that engine is a 1972 65hp Johnson that has a "Hydro Electric" shift setup. If it shifted okay previously and nobody has had it apart, I keep thinking that possibly it is either low on lube or has the wrong lube init. HOwever you have stated that it does have the correct lube, which would be OMC's "Premium Bled", also know as "Type C" lube. (None Other)

The washer between the prop and nut is OMC #315810, listing for about $3.00. If you can't locate one, I have it... add a buck for shipping ($4.00). There's also a thrust washer between the prop and the lower unit. Hope you didn't lose that one too. OMC part #318841, listing for around $30.00. If you need that one, you can have it for $19.00 and a couple $ shipping. Just a thought.

One other thing.... if you or someone else has drained and refilled the unit, it must (absolutely) be filled from the bottom until it comes out of the top oil level hole. If anyone attempts to fill that unit from the top hole, they will create a air pocket and oil will flow out as if the unit is full.... but it will be no where near full... and that will prevent the unit from shifting properly obviously.

The shifting setup of that 1972 65 lower unit is quite complex consisting of voltage being applied to solenoids in the lower unit which in turn change oil passages via a oil pump that supplies various pressure on a spring loaded shifter dog. The wires leading to the lower unit (at the powerhead) are "Green" and "Blue". The engine must be running or cranking over in order to shift out of forward gear. You CAN NOT use HI VIS lube in that lower unit. You MUST USE what OMC calls "Preminum Blend" lube commonly called
"Type C". (A thinner lube)

In neutral, you need 12v to the "Green" wire.

In reverse, you need 12v to both wires, the "Green" one and the "Blue" one.

In forward, there should be no voltage to either wire. (The spring loaded shifter dog forces the unit into forward gear)

To check the lower unit for proper shifting to make sure you have no trouble there, remove the spark plugs to avoid problems and to allow a higher cranking speed.

This next step eliminates the actual shift switch in case problems may exist there.... Disconnect the blue & green wires at the knife connectors (the rubber insulated boots) leading to the lower unit at the powerhead, then using jumpers, take voltage direct from the starter solenoid to apply voltage to the "Green" wire for neutral, then both wires 'Green" & "Blue" for reverse (Remember the engine must be cranking over in order to shift). With no voltage applied, the unit should be in forward. No need for a ground jumper... the lower unit's already grounded. You may crank the engine with the key switch or by energizing the starter solenoid with a jumper wire.

Joe"

Thanks Joe I will give it a s

Thanks Joe I will give it a shot. I double checked the oil we put in to the unit it is the type C premium blend lube. We filled it from the bottom with a pump and I have checked the voltages and they are right at 11 volts is this too low? Otherwise I am going to jumper them later. I keep run ning out of daylight. Thanks for your help and patience I really appreciate it.

"Daniel.... Yes, eleven (1

"Daniel.... Yes, eleven (11) volts would be too low. With the knife connectors still coupled at the engine which lead to the lower unit, and with the key on (but engine not running), you should be able to obtain a full (at least) 12 volts (in neutral or reverse) at either (still connected) knife connector.

Do this test..... Disconnect those two knife connectors and with the engine running, (or at cranking apeed with the s/plugs out), CAREFULLY apply a known perfect 12 volts or higher (a perfect battery might read approx 14.5 volts) to the wires leading to the lower unit. The "Green" wire for neutral, and both the "Green & Blue" wire for reverse. If the shifting is now as it should be, either the previous battery is faulty, the shift switch is creating a voltage drop, or you have a wiring problem somewhere.

NOTE.... That engine demands at least a good 70amp hour battery. Any less will cause damage to the Battery Capacitance Discharge type powerpack.

Joe (30+ Years With OMC)"

Joe Hey we might have figured

Joe Hey we might have figured it out I checked it out as you specified above and the unit shifted firmly as it should. Do you know the part # for the switch in the shifter? the wiring is all original and no splices or anything. I check the wires and havent found any resitance so I think it is possibly the shift select switch. Would a 3 way similar to a headlight switch work? (we did that on a previous boat we had with a hydro-elec shift.) Again thanks for you help.

"Daniel.... Okay, if the engin

"Daniel.... Okay, if the engine shifted normally wnen you applied voltages directly to the wires lesding to the lower unit, go to the next step.

Disconnect the wires from the shift switch and do the voltage application at that area. If the shifting is still okay, then it would seem pretty clear that you have a faulty shift switch.

Now, there are two switches for the Hydro Electric Shift unit.... a Johnson toggle switch that sits in the lower front section of the control box.... and a Evinrude push button switch that sits on the top rear section of a control box. Which do you have?

For Your Information: (Hydro Electric)

Johnson - Toggle ------ #383620 or #384007 - $134.00 ( NA 1983 )

Evinrude - Push Button - #279090 --> #279458 - $129.00 ( NA 1995 )

I have one (1) Evinrude (new) push button switch left in stock and will discount it to $60.00 if you need it.

Joe"

Joe its definately a Johnson

Joe its definately a Johnson toggle. one other question. Parts are becomming harder and harder to find what about that power pack on those old motors? I know they where hard to find. Do you have any of these? Again I really appreciate all your help. I will let you know how the switch turns out. Thanks
Daniel

"Daniel.... I think we should

"Daniel.... I think we should insert here a correction that the engine is a 1972 65hp, not a 1974. Don't want to confuse anyone.

Although that engine has some years on it, the powerpack is readily available even from many third party outfits. The original number was #384997 and was superceeded up to 581726. It has a list price of about $115.00. I checked my remaining stock.... don't have it.

Joe"