Volvo engine removal

"I am trying to get my AQ171c

"I am trying to get my AQ171c engine out of my boat so i can install another one. The motor refuses to come out of the boat. I removed all the bolts from the engine to the bell housing but was unable to get the shaft to come out of the flywheel. I removed the outdrive and took the 6 bolts out of the sealing ring (Broke 3 of them off because they are impossibly salt corroded in). Can't remove the sealing ring.

Short of using a saw and cutting the transom off the boat how do you get the dam engine out. Do I need to get a torch and cut the sealing ring off. I can't be the only one to have problems removing this poorly designed ring. I can't believe no one has ever invented a better method. It is impossible to get any penetrating fluid into the threads of these bolts. Are you supposed to just replace the Adapter every time you need to pull the motor. The book makes it sound pretty simple, remove the wires, remove the bolts pull the engine. They forgot to mention the hammering prying cussing for 24 hours trying to get it to break loose after you do that."

"If You have gotten most of th

"If You have gotten most of the bolts out of the rear clamp ring, remove the SST tab plates that locks the bolts. Under You will find another set of holes. Use the bolts You took out that are still in one piece, insert them into the holes and tighten - voila' - the ring will hopefully get out!
PS:
Use some grease on the bolts!"

"Brian, the book makes it look

"Brian, the book makes it look prety simple and it is normally pretty simple. For what I see, you tried to remove the engine by leaving the bellhousing in place, but that is not the best method: either the dowel pins will be seized, the pilot bearing will refuse to be separated fromt he primary shaft, or (more often than not) the splines in the primary shaft have become seized to the flywheel vibration damper. All these factors willl make the engine removal virtually impossible.

The best way to remove the engine is to remove first all engine wiring and fuel connectors, exhaust hose, etc, but leaving the bellhousing attached to the engine. Then either removing the upper gear assembly from the outdrive or the whole outdrive so that the u-joint yoke is disconnected from the primary shaft, then remove the 6 bolts (70) so that you can remove the spacer ring (69) (if the spacer ring does not come out, use Morten's suggestion to remove it), then rig the engine with a sling to an engine hoist, remove the engine front mounts, and pull the engine.

http://www.volvopentastore.com/CONNECTING_COMPONENTS_AQ_DRIVE_UNIT_SP_A/dm/cart_ id.033702254--session_id.885371921--store_id.366--view_id.323875

Occasionally, the bolts attaching the spacer ring to the bellhousing may become seized, and sometimes corrosion may take place between the transom shield, bellhouing and spacer ring, seizing all components together. All these situations will make the engine removal more difficult. However, contrary to your opinion, I suggest those situations are not a consequence of a poor design, but rather of poor installation techniques and poor maintenance. It would appear that whoever installed the engine last time did never coat all 6 bolts (thread and shank) with Never-Seize, Perfect Seal or similar compound, for otherwise those bolts could have been removed 30 years later as easy as if they had been installed one or two days ago. Also, if the surfaces in the bellhousing, transom shield and spacer ring that touch the two rubber rings had been coated with Perfect Seal or another type of non-hardening sealant, I suggest that the removal would have been like a breeze."

"This is the 3rd engine I have

"This is the 3rd engine I have removed and I have had the same problem with them all. The bolts are always salt corroded in. None of the engines appeared to have ever been removed before, All were mid 80's engines so I guess they never coated them at the factory with any grease or the grease doesn't last 30 years. I have broken the bolts on every one. It is so frustrating to have to drill the bolts and work so many extra hours to remove a blot that should only take a few seconds with a wrench to remove. If either the dowel pins will be seized, the pilot bearing will refuse to be separated from the primary shaft, or (more often than not)the splines in the primary shaft have become seized to the flywheel vibration damper then how will it be possible to remove the bell housing once the engine is removed. Am I going to have to hammer, pry, cut, or break this off to remove it?"

"Brian, once the engine is rem

"Brian, once the engine is removed from the boat, the removal of the bellhousing should be much easier, as you have far more space to use whatever tools you may need. I don't think you will have to use excessive brute force, but again it all depends on how the components were assembled time ago.

Grease may work, but I was shown long time ago that compounds like Perfect Seal amd many non-hardening sealants work better than grease on bolts (shank and threads) and aluminum surfaces.

When you put everything together again, I suggest you apply a generous coat of grease between the primary shaft splines and the vibration damper (absorber) and a light coat between primary shaft and the pilot bearing. Then, the bolts will benefit from being coated with Perfect Seal or similar."

"Well, I too would have left t

"Well, I too would have left the Flywheel Cover attached to the transom shield and separated the engine from the Flywheel Cover. However, sounds like that is not working. So you now must remove the F/C as well due to the broken Tap Bolts.

The "Jack Threads" that Morten mentions should separate the clamping collar from the F/C if the remaining portion of the broken bolts allow for this!
You indicate "corrosion"..... so if not, you must sacrifice the collar by drilling a series of holes in it as to weaken it, then split it into sections for removal.
Don't worry..... these clamping collars/rings are a dime-a-dozen in the used market.

The broken tap bolts may be a trick to remove. Often we resort to EDM for removal as the threads in the F/C are an "insert" type thread.
Luckily, these F/C's for that engine are also not expensive in the used market (supply/demand thing).

NOTE: when going back together, I'd recommend that at least one of the large rubber sealing rings be new..... and I always make this the Inboard ring as this is the one that does the "Sealing".

I fully agree with Mr. El P re; the F/C separation once the engine is out. It will be much easier once out!

Be sure to replace the F/C PDS bearing while you are in this far. It's a shot in the foot if you do not! IMO.

Brian, I don't blame you for being frustrated.... however, there is nothing all that poorly designed about this engine/drive! If the proper maintenance is performed, the book instructions are accurate.... these are very easy to remove!
Consider yourself lucky that this IS a Volvo Penta! (Of course this is IMO here!)
I would also ask myself why are we getting so much salt water on this engine?
Hatch not sealing? Something in a bait well leaking? Etc?

IMO, You have a great system. You will never have the issues posed by M/C or OMC of this same vintage. NEVER! Trsut me on that!

."

"Regarding Perfect Seal - Does

"Regarding Perfect Seal - Does it affect torque measurements in any way when used on threads?
Thanks,
Jay"

"Jay, if taken to an extreme m

"Jay, if taken to an extreme measure, and for some applications, you will find engineering torque specs for both "dry" and "oil wet" threads of a particular pitch/size! This would include any sealants, but again.... in an extremely critical scenario.
I highly doubt that any of these mounting bolts require the need to deviate ..... other than possibly cylinder head fasteners.
Obviously, a wet thread will reach true tension with less force than if dry."

"Jay, Perfect Seal is used in

"Jay, Perfect Seal is used in threads of fasterners where torquing to a spec is not as critical as preventing corrosion or seizure. Nevertheless, I always use (when available) the specs in Seloc or Clymer, as they refer to lubricated threads. And more often than not, I do not use a torque wrench for some of the fasteners we are discussing like the bolts for the spacer ring (those are secured with lock tabs anyway).

And talking about torque wrenches, keep in mind that it is not always possible to ensure their accuracy, especially if they have not been calibrated lately or if the spring has been left inadvertedly under tension for a long period of time. What you will for sure get with a torque wrench is a number of fasteners evenly torqued, but not necessarily at the specified torque. "

"jay, i swear by what they sa

"jay, i swear by what they say on this site, they have saved me $$$$$$ of dollars because of their many years of experience
thanks
ted"

Ted - you don't have to co

Ted - you don't have to convince me. You are preaching to the converted. Ricardo E. has just rebuilt the transmission and lower unit on my 1979 280 outdrive.

El Pesc - Good info about torque wrenches. Who the heck gets theirs calibrated? One assumes it is good for life.

"Well i got it out, managed to

"Well i got it out, managed to thread 3 screws in and as per the manual apply excessive force necessary for removal. The ring eventually snaped into 2 pieces (using 4 ton ram from transom to engine block). Now i just need to find one of these easy to find SEALNG RINGS in one piece.
part # 67 http://www.volvopentastore.com/CONNECTING_COMPONENTS_AQ_DRIVE_UNIT_SP_A/dm/cart_ id.033702254--session_id.885371921--store_id.366--view_id.323875

I searched here, craigslist, ebay. Where do i find one of these easy to locate parts?"

"Brian, your link just leads t

"Brian, your link just leads to a home page. Be more specific as to which parts you need. I have lots of these items in my shop.
Shoot me an email (click on my user name... it will show you) and we can talk from there.

Rick"

"Part 67 is the aluminum clamp

"Part 67 is the aluminum clamping ring, which is attached with 6 bolts to the bellhousing. I'm sure Ricardo has a few of those. If you were located in Canada, I could probably get you one (I must have two or three somewhere in my shop)."

Ok so now the motor is out of

Ok so now the motor is out of the boat and I have 3 broken bolts in the Flywheel cover and I still cant get the Flywheel cover off. I am wedging Chisels and splitting mauls in there and hammering with a 5lb hammer. The flywheel cover is loose but the spline will not come out of the flywheel. Short of using explosives to remove it does anyone have any ideas. I am thinking I am going to have to cut it off or buy a new one. I am really getting pissed off at the thing and about ready to use some of my 22 years of military explosive training on the thing just to vent my frustration before i begin my quest to find another one.

"Brian you really cracked me u

"Brian you really cracked me up with your last post. Hopefully someone here will be able to help you. Is there a way to hammer on the primary drive shaft from the aft end, to loosen it up? If you do go the explosive route please video and put it on Youtube. Hang in there."

"Hold your dynamite for now un

"Hold your dynamite for now until you have tried Morten's suggestions in this thread!!!

http://www.marineengine.com/discus/messages/12487/149116.shtml

After you have removed it, you will see by yourself why it was stuck and how a generous amount of grease applied to the splines during the previous assembly would have saved you all the frustration you are going through now."

"Ditto El P's suggestion r

"Ditto El P's suggestion re; what Morten suggested... that should work!
Fortunately, the Flywheel Covers (bell housing), PDS's and the Drive Couplers are cheap for these. Remember the Supply/Demand for this stuff!
The OHC stuff just doesn't wear out... so the used market is soft on these parts, even while NEW parts are yet expensive.
And the only NEW parts are still on the shelf somewhere (don't be afraid of good used parts for these).

If you need any of these parts, give a hollar to me. I'm in AQ series Volvo Penta country where I am.

And a BIG HUGE "YES" to grease on these splines and the pilot tip of the PDS.

."

"On a serious note, supposing

"On a serious note, supposing a wooden dowel or brass drift of the appropriate diameter was used (with a hammer) to rap on the aft end of the primary drive shaft? Wouldn't it maybe be helpful in loosening the rust on the spline? Could any damage be done?"

"Jay, that thought crossed my

"Jay, that thought crossed my mind earlier. I do not think that you'd damage anything other than the centering bearing in the crankshaft..... and I'll take this one step further... I'll bet you that it is this bearing that is the culpret in the first place.
Sacrifice this bearing if you must. I don't think that with a large brass hammer/punch that you will damage the PDS at all.

BTW, this is not a working ball bearing in the sense of rolling friction reduction.... the bearing is a centering device only in this application.
PDS, Drive Coupler and bearing all rotate as one!

."

"...centering bearing in t

"...centering bearing in the crankshaft "

Do you mean center bearing in the PDS?

"Jay, on the Volvo Penta 4 and

"Jay, on the Volvo Penta 4 and 6 cylinder engines, the PDS (primary drive shaft) has only one ball bearing supporting it.
The PDS also has a fwd "pilot" point to it much like an older standard car/truck transmission does.
Where the PDS penetrates the Borg Warner (or Volvo Penta) drive coupler, there is a bearing in the end of the crankshaft just a head of the drive coupler.

This pds "pilot" point is "Centered" in this ball bearing as apposed to a bronze bushing of the old days.

Some of the older AQ series drives with SBF engines used the same idea, but with the bronze bushing.

."

"So how about driving some ste

"So how about driving some steel wedges between the block and the fwh, to put a stress on the frozen site, then strike the shaft with a drift? It just might break free. If there seems to be some rearward motion of the shaft, advance the wedges deeper and repeat."

Brian - any luck yet?

Brian - any luck yet?

"The weather here has been pre

"The weather here has been pretty bad in Seattle the last few days, and I have been really busy. I have been squirting my special rust breaking fluid on it daily in hopes that when i make my next attempt at separation it will slide right off."

Ok so it is not possible to re

Ok so it is not possible to remove the shaft and the flywheel cover from the engine. I am going to have to find another one. I found one but it is not the same the drive shaft spline is course not fine and there is no cutout at the top for the sensor that is on my motor. Anyone know where i can find one i am tired of beating and prying on this one. Even if i drill holes in it and remove the flywheel I am afraid that I have already put so much force on it that the shaft may be bent.