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TiltTrim Problem on 1993 Johnson 120 V4

H

hogfan

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"I am currently having a tilt/

"I am currently having a tilt/trim problem, the motor will not go up or down. Previously had a problem and replaced relay which fixed it. I noticed this weekend that the tilt/trim was not working right and it eventually quit working. Thinking it was the relays, I changed both and it still doesn't work. I have three switches in the boat that run the tilt/trim and each time I use the switches you can hear the relays click. I checked the hydrolic oil and it is full. What do I check next?"
 
"There is a big two wire conne

"There is a big two wire connector (green and blue wires) on the lower port side, the wires feed out the bottom of the cowl to the T/T unit....pull that connector apart and make sure it is not corroded. Make sure it is a good connection there.
Below text is from another forum...it will be the same for your motor.

There are two wires coming to the engine from the T&T.
One is blue, the other green. They are large gauge wires, probably #12 or so, because they handle lots of current.
You must separate the connector, and apply battery power directly to the two terminals inside the connector. The trim will go up with one polarity of the power applied, and if you reverse the polarity, it will go down.

Let me say that I have only worked on 1994-2000 big V6 T&T units...Fastrack I think they are called. I believe this is what you also have on your 1990 200.

For what it's worth."
 
"Thank you Doug I will let you

"Thank you Doug I will let you know if it worked. I am going back to the lake on Friday evening and I will give it a try. I did notice when I replaced the relays, there was some corrosion."
 
"I should have added on my pos

"I should have added on my post, that powering the motor directly on the green and blue wires is a good way to test/eliminate the motor as the problem.
It takes some skill to get the power into that connector without shorting the two together...it will spark like hell if you touch 'em together. Be careful. It is power directly from the batt, and has a lot of current behind it. It will melt wires fast."
 
"I found the wires and hooked

"I found the wires and hooked up the power directly to the motor. The motor did not work, but did make a small amount of noise after a few seconds. Does this mean I need to replace motor or do I need to conduct further tests?"
 
"I have to ask...did you get a

"I have to ask...did you get a good spark from those wires as you were connecting them?
It should spark fairly strongly, because the motor draws alot of current.
You COULD (if you wanted to be sure) measure the resistance of the motor windings...put an ohmmeter across the two wires (blue and green) (no power applied at all!!) and let us know the resistance. I will go down and measure the resistance of a good motor and post it for your comparison. I'll post back in a few minutes."
 
One ohm...one and a half ohms.

One ohm...one and a half ohms....in that range. I measured two T/T motors.
Almost a dead short. If you get higher reading...motor windings likely open.
That motor likely draws 10-12 amps when running...that is why you should have seen a significant spark when making that last connection during the test.
 
"Hoping you did it right....bu

"Hoping you did it right....but assuming you did...
Measure the resistance of that motor.
No spark when hooked up straight to the battery indicates an open motor winding. Everytime I test one in this manner, it sparks big, and the motor immediately runs, either up or down depending on which polarity you have chosen when hooking up the wires.
If you power test it again, be sure to use large gauge wire. #12 will do.

By the way, blue to +12v, green to GND, trim will go UP.
Green to +12v, blue to GND, trim will go down.

A resistance test will verify."
 
"Doug,
Both wires are conside

"Doug,
Both wires are consider positive green is down and blue is up, your ground is the engine itself or in this case the tilt and trim at no point you connect both wires to the positive and one to negative! Am I missing something here ?"
 
"Yes you are.
The ground for

"Yes you are.
The ground for this T/T motor is not engine ground.
If you ground the motor body to the neg battery, and try the +12v on either the blue or the green, nothing will happen.
This is a two wire trim system, and the relays apply power as required, just reversing the polarity as required for up or down."
 
"Kyle, This is exactly what ne

"Kyle, This is exactly what needs to be done. I really hope you do have the 3 wire system if not you may have toasted the motor.
When experiencing problems with your power Trim and Tilt System, there are a few easy ways to diagnose just what the problem is. Power Trim Motors generally come in two styles. All use a 12 volt D/C reversing Motor. Some Motors have a two wire connection and some Motors have a three wire connection. All power Trim and Tilt Motors come with one blue wire and one green wire. The three wire power Trim and Tilt Motors have an additional Black wire as well. The Black wire works as a Ground on power Trim and Tilt Motors that don't ground thru the case. When the blue wire is energized it raises the Motor or drive unit up. When the green wire is energized it lowers the drive unit down.

When having a problem first you need to determine weather your problem is with the power Trim and Tilt Motor or the Hydraulic Pump Valve Body assembly. If you attempt to raise the Motor or sterndrive to the up or down position and nothing happens, first check to make sure your Battery is charged and switched on if your boat is equipped with a Battery switch. If you hear a slight clicking noise you have power coming from the switch to the solenoid. The next step is to go directly to the Motor and test it there. First, disconnect the power Trim and Tilt Motor.

Using a jumper wire, apply 12 volts directly to the blue wire if your engine or drive unit is in the down position. It should raise up at this time. If it is in the up position, apply power to the green wire reversing the Motor and lowering the unit. If the Motor runs, you may have a problem with a solenoid or lack of voltage coming from the power Trim and Tilt switch to the solenoid."
 
"Doug, thats a quote directly

"Doug, thats a quote directly from my Evinrude manual hopefully it helps"
 
"Nope. I do this every day.

"Nope. I do this every day. This is a two wire T/T motor. Test as I said in my post of 4:22pm today.
Just to verify, i looked up his T/T motor P/N (434496), and it is the exact same P/N that I use on my 1996 and 1998 motors.
This has also been covered on IBoats.com and verified to be the proper operation."
 
Inside the motor there is a by

Inside the motor there is a bymetal switch which cuts the continuity on the power if there is a short in the electric motor. Remove the motor and pull it apart you will probely find its had water in it or shorted out
 
"Hey guy's, other than a r

"Hey guy's, other than a relay I have had no trouble with mine,which simply means I never had to check wiring, and Iam still in storage till this SAT. I do have a manual for a 125 hp 1991, I'll peek through it and see if I can be of some help. and just to make ya chuckle, the authors, are very, very adement that we should not perform any of these tests while the BOAT IS UNDER POWER, well thanks for pointing that out.
will post back shortly.
Mike"
 
"Nearest I can see is neg is a

"Nearest I can see is neg is at engine mounting assy which would simply mean the other 2 wires are pos feed, 1 up 1 down, I have in the past worked on many many small motors similar to this,
just not in this application, and found that the brushes & brush holder are quite small, often times the carbon dust created during operation will cause the brush to hang up in the holder there by preventing solid contact with comuntator, not saying that is the issue but certainly somthing to consider, I think Jamie has the best overall plan,remove the motor, put in a vise (gently), bench test, you may give it a slight tap with a small hammer to see if it frees up, if it does, dismantle clean up with good electric spray and you should install a new set of brushes.
Hope this is some help.
Michael"
 
"Nope...don't agree. I st

"Nope...don't agree. I stand exactly by my previous posts.

Two wire T/T. No "GND" prvided by frame or "engine".

Powered directly at the blue and green wires, reversing polarity to drive up or down as desired.

Am I the ONLY one that has ever seen the two wire T/T?"
 
"doug is exacty correct.... g

"doug is exacty correct.... grnd one,..pwr the other...prior to mid 80's or so.they were 3 wire."
 
"Doug, was not in disagreement

"Doug, was not in disagreement, just pointing out what my manual stated and trying to be of some help, did you chuckle at the advise, and do you think the rest of my post has some validity?
Mike"
 
"and,if the prob is found to b

"and,if the prob is found to be w/the elect motor,the proper fix,..is to repl w/new...if u,....'patch' it,it will break down again,and the worst time.....when its raining,at dark,at the boat ramp........those units are around 200.00.
cheeeeeeeeap......for yrs of use."
 
I will post a video shortly of

I will post a video shortly of me actually doing this. I follow the instructions from my manual as stated previously. I am not sure at this point how mine works ?
 
"I just thought I was going nu

"I just thought I was going nuts.
I am sure he uses the two wire T/T system, and you guys are thinking three wire system.
For three wire system, you are exactly right.

Back to the problem...Measure the resistance across the two wires, blue and green, and post.
Should be 1-1.5 ohms.

10-4 on the advice to replace the whole motor.

Sierra P/N 18-6780. Look it up on Sierra's website. Note what engines it fits."
 
"well enough sitting back, is

"well enough sitting back, is it pretolite, bosh,or,showa, motor? 3 differnt diameters.
Just thought I would ask the experts."
 
"It is a two wire system. To

"It is a two wire system. To replace the t&t motor I would have to have the ability to lift the motor off the boat, which I don't. I am taking it to a mechanic on Tuesday to get the work done. I will let everyone know what was wrong and what he had to do to fix it. I really appreciate all the advise."
 
"I bet you guys are using a Cl

"I bet you guys are using a Clymer or Seloc....

LOL, (just joking)

Mike, the motor bodies are different diameters, but where it mounts to the T/T unit is the same across all three brands. They are interchangeable. Sierra is selling ARCO motors.

You don't have to lift the motor off the boat, but you do need to be able to get it trimmed fully up and have the trailer lock set.
Use the manual release to do that and lift it up (two guys).

It is a kinda big job. I hate that you are gonna take it in..."
 
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