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How to test the tiltlift relays for a b79 AQ 140A280

F

followingsea

Regular Contributor
"Still doing some fine tuning

"Still doing some fine tuning before sea-trials. I tested my lift unit motor by jumping directly to the battery via the black and brown wires straight to battery + -, then - +). Works fine in both directions. Then connected everything up like a factory job.

When I activate the up/down switch on the dash the shaft runs all the way UP (shortest shaft position) and shuts off.

I'll get the "click" sound if I continue to flip the switch. So far that should be normal. The limiter switch shuts off the motor to prevent it from going any higher.

When I flip the switch in the opposite direction to RAISE the outdrive (extend the shaft on the lift unit) there's no sound, no click--nothing. I'm guessing it's a faulty UP relay.

When I open the control box and pull that relay, how do I test it with a multimeter?"
 
There are a number of possibil

There are a number of possibilities... the limit switch in that control box being the first thing I'd check. I'm going to assume that you removed that box in the process of checking the motor. The limit switch sits in a recess in that box and the plunger sticks thru a hole in the motor assembly at the top. You will really need to get a manual and go over the wiring diagram... but I'd check the switch first in any event. You may have a broken or loose wire or a bad switch.
 
"Robert,

No, I haven't

"Robert,

No, I haven't removed or opened the control box on top of the tilt unit. I'll open it up in the next 1/2 hour. I can't find step-by-step troubleshooting or }testing methods for the tilt unit in my SELOC manual.


How do I test the limit switch?"
 
"I just reread your first post

"I just reread your first post and I am now assuming that the motor is a 2 wire motor and not a 4 wire one?
IFSO.. the limit switch cannot cause this problem. If it was a four wire one, it could...
HOWEVER....
1) disconnect the wires from the motor and tag them.
2) remove the box and open it
3) Put meter on DC mode.
4) put black probe on ground somewhere (motor case)
5) measure the voltage on the dark blue wire on the relay.. it should read more or less 12 volts when the up switch is depressed and the relay should click. If there is no 12 volts, you have a updown switch or wiring problem.
6) IF there +12 is and the relay does not click, make sure that the other coil terminal on the relay goes to ground. My SELOC manual has an error and shows no wire on the other up relay coil connection at all.... it should go to ground.
7) If there is plus 12 at one relay coil terminal and ground on the other and the realy does no click.....
7a)...turn ignition switch off
7b) disconnect dark blue wire from relay coil
7c) put meter on ohms scale and measure the relay coil... should read between 12 and 120 ohms... i.e., not a short and not open. No reading.... relay bad.
If you can't get wire off because relay is plugged in a socket (sorry, its been awhile) pull relay out of socket...check for bad contact in socket or loose wire... check meter coil reading.

That should get you started on your way..."
 
"Robert,
I just dropped in t

"Robert,
I just dropped in to check the mail. Yes, it's a 2 wire motor.
I'll go out and run through your trouble-shooting list and get back before long. Thankfully, I've got a box of used tilt unit parts including the relays.

Your check list is going to stay in my SELCO manual paper-clipped to the right chapter."
 
"Robert,

Here's the upd

"Robert,

Here's the update:
I went out to remove the control box and found one of the long screw-bolts missing (1 of 2 holding it down). I took the box off the top of the tilt housing. When I opened it, it looked like new in there.

I also had one of the wires off the little warning light up on the dash. I plugged that back in and it glowed orange.

I tested the lift--to see if anything had changed--by moving the switch up and down. With the control box off, it went up and down! I think maybe the control box being loose was the problem.

I put it all back together with TWO bolts this time and it's snug. Using the switch it moves up and down nicely, EXCEPT ONE problem.

All the way down it locks and the light goes out. Trying to raise it all the way UP it was grunting right at the top and the light was still on. I stopped and checked the outdrive. It was up against the rubber block on the transom mount--couldn't go any further.

So, it sounds like I've got to adjust something to get it to shut off at the limit switch before it gets that high.
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I've got the SELOC manual. I think there might be a section on adjusting it.

Other than that, it's all working fine."
 
"Good job Dennis. Not sure if

"Good job Dennis. Not sure if the 270 is different than the 280 in this respect, but my 270 does not auto stop when it gets to the top of the lift and I don't think it was ever meant to auto stop like it does when you lower it. But like I say, maybe the 280 is different. I have just learned over the years to recognize the sound the motor makes when the drive cannot lift any more and then I back off the switch and visually check to be sure the drive is all the way up."
 
"I don't think the 280 is

"I don't think the 280 is much different--if at all--when it comes to the lift/tilt mechanism.

After thinking about it, I'd say you are right about no "auto-stop" on the lift (UP) cycle. I thought about it and realized that when the shaft is going downward (to lift the sterndrive)--it is moving down and further away from that limit switch above.

I'll follow your method and call it good.
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"
 
"Here's PART TWO:

I tho

"Here's PART TWO:

I thought I had this fixed but when I tried to raise the outdrive, I've still got a problem.

I've got it NARROWED DOWN.

Here is exactly what's happening:
When the black control box on top of the Tilt unit is bolted on and the Outdrive is lowered all the way down (It clicks into the locked down/running position)--the Light on the dash goes OUT. When the light is out and I toggle the switch to raise it-- it will not raise, not click, no motor sound, nada.

Next, I remove the Control box and the dash light comes back on. THEN, the Tilt unit works perfectly UP AND DOWN smooth and consistant.

Next, I put the cover back on--Run the outdrive UP AND DOWN without going all the way down to the lock position. Works great.

But when I let it go all the way down again, to the lock position, the dash LIGHT goes out and I've got no UP. I try to RAISE the outdrive and NADA. No click, no motor sound, nothing.

I remove the control box again. Light goes on and everything works correctly again.

I'm not understanding something here. If the limit switch turns off power after the shaft is fully raised, HOW does it "re-power" to extend the shaft again and RAISE the outdrive? I'm going round and round on this
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.

It's got to be very simple. The UP and DOWN relays seem to work perfectly when the dash light is on."
 
"Maybe I can simplify this pro

"Maybe I can simplify this problem and shorten the question (For reference, this is a 2-wire motor).

When the tilt is ALL THE WAY DOWN AND LOCKED the dash light goes out. It will not respond when I move the toggle switch to raise it again--acts just like it has no power to the switch.

If I remove the black control box off the top of the lift unit--releasing the limit switch--it works perfectly UP and DOWN using the dash toggle switch (the light is on all the time then).
Control box back on--same problem again. No UP.

What is the problem?

IF the LIMIT SWITCH normally cuts power in the full DOWN position (With the control box connected to the top of the unit) --how can it get power again (when the toggle switch is moved) to raise the outdrive?"
 
"If I recall correctly, the li

"If I recall correctly, the limit switch only cuts power when the outdrive is fully down and the light is off. It should not cut power when lifting the outdrive.

One of these days, time permitting, I will try to make a couple of drawings indicating the current flow for "up" and "down" commands in the VP power tilt mechanism, as this is a question that resurfaces every year."
 
"E.P.,
Based on what I descr

"E.P.,
Based on what I described above, what's your best guess?
If I can't find it, I'm going to keep the control box off for sea trials. This boat is way overdue for the water.
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"
 
"Just to clarify for everyone,

"Just to clarify for everyone, when he says going UP he means the outdrive going down. Very confusing when I read it as well EL Pescador. He is refering to the shaft going up therefore outdrive dropping, but at other times referring to the outdrive... So that is why it is very confusing.

Sounds like your relays are fine. A quick check i do is reverse the input wires to the relays, now up on the switch means outdrive goes down, and vice versa, if it now works in only the opposite way it used to then clearly that relay is toast
"
 
"Thanks for the input E.P &amp

"Thanks for the input E.P & Jamie. Yep, it gets a little confusing just trying to write out the question and explain what's happening, how and when.

Good idea--I'll reverse the leads on the Control switch tomorrow. Then I'll reverse the leads on the little indicator light. Then work out from there if nothing changes. It's got to be something simple."
 
"This should read, "WHEN T

"This should read, "WHEN THE STERNDRIVE IS ALL THE WAY DOWN AND LOCKED the dash light goes out."
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"...When the tilt is ALL THE WAY DOWN AND LOCKED the dash light goes out. It will not respond when I move the toggle switch to raise it again--acts just like it has no power to the switch..."."
 
"I'm a bit jammed up today

"I'm a bit jammed up today, so I can't spend much time on this just now... but just two quick things:
1) Reversing the wires on the light won't tell you anything.
2) Just so I have a known starting point to figure this out for you... Does the drive itself lift up when you move the toggle switch arm up?"
 
"Robert,

Answer to #2 is no

"Robert,

Answer to #2 is no. The toggle position is reverse.

Toggle pushed down raises the drive. Toggle pushed up lowers it.

I just went out and looked behind the panel. Toggle switch has three terminals on it (top, center and bottom wires)

Top wire is BROWN.

Middle is RED (+), with a short red jumper wire to the indicator light.

Bottom wire is BLUE.

Should I reverse the BROWN & BLUE wires?

(The boat and all it's parts were in boxes for 10+ years. All the electrical stuff was a big jumble of wires, switches, etc. I've been learning as I put it all back together.)"
 
"Brown should be for the "

"Brown should be for the "down" relay, and blue for the "up" relay.

The limiter switch does not only stop the light when it opens (that is, when the outdrive is completely "down", not "up" like you said on your first post): it also de-energizes the "down" relay (not the "up" relay like seems to be your case). The "up" relay should work at any time (there is no limter switch affecting it).

It starts to sound like all your problem is having the brown and the blue wires swapped, and/or the motor is wired backwards."
 
just want to say thankyou to t

just want to say thankyou to those posting @bout the tilt issue. I have exactly the same issue with mine also and am looking forward to trying all the suggestions to cure my tilt ills.
 
""El" is correct...as

""El" is correct...as usual :) Since you had the motor disconnected and then reconnected, I'd start with the motor wiring."
 
"E.P.,

I just went out and

"E.P.,

I just went out and switched the BLUE & BROWN wires--twice to be sure.

First, there was some slight corrosion and they didn't come off easy. So, that's how the previous owner had them (not saying he had it right).

Next, with the wires reversed. BROWN on the bottom now, BLUE on top. The drive followed the direction of the toggle switch, i.e., UP on the switch, the drive went UP.

Whichever way I put those two wires on the switch--the terminal with the BROWN wire always makes a "CLICK" when the toggle is turned on (With the drive in the down, locked position and indicator light out). The BLUE lead is always silent.

Drive is in down/locked position. Here's what happens:

BROWN wire on top, Toggle UP--(indicator light if off)--"CLICK". Blue lead remains silent when switched to that position.

Reverse wires:

BROWN wire on bottom (of switch), Toggle DOWN--(Indicator light off)--"Click". Blue lead remains silent.

I'm going to buy a new Toggle switch today and see if that makes any difference.

One more thought. There's no ground wire from the Tilt Unit control box to the block. Is one needed? Could that be a problem?"
 
"Save your money, its not the

"Save your money, its not the toggle switch.
Yes, the control box needs a ground wire, although not having one would make it totally inoperative. Did you reverse the wires on the motor (with wires on toggle as they originally were)?"
 
You mean reverse the two wires

You mean reverse the two wires (brown & black) coming from the unit's motor? I'll go out and do that and see what happens. Back in a few minutes.
 
SUCCESS! With the BROWN/BLACK

SUCCESS! With the BROWN/BLACK motor wires reversed (Brown to Black and Black to Brown at the sealed connectors) it works perfectly.

Why? What was going on?
 
"Simple: when you gave the com

"Simple: when you gave the command "up", the motor was turning as it should turn for "down". And vice-versa. The problem was further compounded because the limiter switch is meant to de-enegize the "down" relay when the outdrive is completely down."
 
"So the motor is running backw

"So the motor is running backwards?
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Maybe I should turn the boat around with the bow toward the back of the trailer?
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BIG THANKS TO YOU AND ROBERT! You guys are the BEST! I'll buy the cold ones if we ever meet up!

I'm sure this discussion will be very useful to John M. and several others."
 
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