Maiden voyage disaster almost sank my boat

I bought the 1978 Bayliner a m

I bought the 1978 Bayliner a month ago and took it out for the first time yesterday. It came with a VP280 drive and AQ140A motor. I found a luabdry list of issues so far. It was hard starting and didn't want to idle too well but ran great above 1500 RPMs. So we launched and took off. It planed out pretty quickly and ran smooth and fast. After a couple of minutes of warmimg up I ran WOT and it got up to 5200 rpms no problem. Out 16' support boat with an 85 Suzuki couldn't keep up to us. The the boat just started slowing down and wouldn't keep on plane. I looked back and saw water splashing underneath the cowling. Not sure what that was about I headed straight for shore and beashed it. We pumped the water out which wasn't coming in just floating.

Started the motor up and saw water being pumped in through a hole in the oil cooler! Felt around and found the copper tube that was supposed to be plugged into it but it wouldn't reach because it was hiting on the opl filter. So concerning this I have a couple of questions:

1 I pulled the tube out last night and everything seems to be kosher but how does it attach into the oil cooler outlet? It's the tube that goes from the bottom of vertical oil cooler to the strainer (heat exchanger?) box. I couldn't find anywhere in the Clymer manual that shows how it attaches excetp for a gasket and pushing it in. It looks like this tube could fall out again pretty easily.

2. The oil filter that is on there is a car filter from FRAM. It is too big in diameter to allow the copper tube to reach the oil cooler? Should I be using a VP oil filter for this reason? Thanks. I have more questions but I'll digest this for now.

"PugetSounder, sorry to hear a

"PugetSounder, sorry to hear about your little ordeal, but I'm glad you are OK. Now let's see if we can fix your problem.

Look at the drawing in the link:

http://www.dougrussell.com/partscatalog/volvo_omc/index.cfm?fuseaction=comp&grou p=1954&GroupList=1943,1944,1945,1946,1947,1948,1949,1950,1951,1952,1953,1954,195 5,1956,1957,1958,1959,1960,1961,1966,1962,1963,1964,1965,1967,1968,1969,1970,197 1,1972,1973,1974,1975

As you see, the water copper pipes just slide in the oil cooler and two grommets (part 12) prevent them from leaking. The shapes of the pipes are such that once they slide into the oil cooler covers and are secured at the opposite side, they stain in place and are not supposed to move. In your case, it seems to me that one of the pipes has popped-out from the oil cooler cover, and that is usually due to back pressure caused by clogged water passages in the exhaust manifold (note: if if is the large pipe the one that popped out, it could also be due to a clogged tube nest in the oil cooler). The right solution is to either "boil" the exhaust manifold in a radiator shop to remove rust, sliudge and scale; or, if your current manifold is very old or you are not sure about its internal condition, just replace it. Here is a link to the Sierra aftermarket version:

http://www.marineengine.com/parts/part_details.php?pnum=SIE18-1930-1&returntopag e=80240786.htm

I have been using Fram filters for years in my old AQ140 and never had a problem; in fact, if you look at the diagram, the pipes should be installed away from the filter. Nevertheless, I had years ago a copper pipe popping out on my AQ140 due to a clogged exhaust manifold, but it was the one from the salt water pipe going into the coolant heat exchanger.

If the water that splashed on the engine was salt water, I suggest you cover the alternator, the distributor and the carbs with plastic bags and wash the engine with a fine spray of fresh hot water (a garden hose with a nozzle will do) to remove any traces of salt, then dry the engine throroughly and spray it with Fluid Film. Make sure the salt and moisture is removed from the timing gears, as if they become pitted they will chew the timing belt in no time.

Another lesson to be learned: have two bilge pumps of large capacity installed (at least one with automatic float switch), you never know when you will need them. And on the bright side, the boat performed quite well, you just need to deal with some teething problems which are to be expected in a new-to-you older boat. And once you have dealt with them, you may want to follow the advice I give to every VP engine owner: if you have points in the distributor, replace them with a Pertronix electronic ignition kit and end most starting and idling problems. "

"Thanks for the reply. Luckily

"Thanks for the reply. Luckily it was fresh water, cleaned things up up a bit. After looking at the diagram I found that I do not have #26 the support ring, and I had two #12 gaskets on the oil-cooler end of the copper tube. Could be why it fell off but who knows. I would be happy to have the exhaust mani boiled and cleaned but first I have another problem I need to fugure out. I have water in my engine oil! I nice milk shake on the dip stick and inside the cam cover. Had a little in the blow-by as well. It has freshwater cooling and I find no oil in the anti-freeze and the water level there doesn't seem to change at all. I kept an eagle eye on the temp gauge and it never got over ~ 170 degrees. Is it possible (I'm hoping) that raw water in getting into my oil from the cooler? It's the only place I can think of unless the manifold could be the culprit. I am going to change the oil tonight and hook up the copper tube while the filter is out and hope for the best. The FRAM filter on the boat is a PH16 but I find a different number for a volvo B23 block.

After that I will try and test to narrow down where the water is getting into the oil. If it's a head gasket I can handle that. If my block is cracked then I need to rethink whether I will keep this boat or not. It already has a long list of things to do and a new engine wasn't in the plans. Thanks."

"Pugetsounder, before you get

"Pugetsounder, before you get too alarmed just drain the engine oil, put a fresh batch, run the engine again, drain the oil again, then install a new filter and put a fresh batch of oil. Chances are the water entered the engine through the valve cover vent with so much spraying around from the copper cooling pipe.

Once you secure the pipe properly (with grommet 26) chances are it won't move again.

Regarding oil filters, check this thread:

http://www.marineengine.com/discus/messages/12487/80194.shtml

And worst case scenario, if the engine is NG, you can always get a used Volvo engine from a car and marinize it."

"You know besides the stress o

"You know besides the stress of possibly having a bad motor this is actually kind of fun. It's like puttung your brain back to work!

OK I figured out the tube last night although I'm still not convinced it's a great idea on Volvo's part. It ends up I do have the support ring. The last guy decided it goes where the copper tube fits through the plastic cover on the seawater strainer. What I found out it it's an important piece to keeping the copper tube from falling out as mine did. It goes where the copper tube fits through the motor mount and acts as a lever. When the top of the tube is bolted to the sea water strainer it keeps pressure through the lever into the oil cooler. Without the support ring there is no lever pressure and voila! The pipe falls out. BUT I still got some leakage from the oil cooler and I was wondering about some kind of gasket sealer in compound with the new gasket/grommet. Also one of the bolt holes on the sea water strainer is stripped out but I got it to not leak. Pictures do tell a thousand words! I never would've figured it out without that diagram.

As far as the oil I pumped out most of and did just what you said. I tried to loosen the oil pan drain plug but no success. Anybody know what size it is? My 24mm wouldn't fit and that's biggest I have. Hopefully another oil change will get most of it out. It still a little milky but not as bad. Is there anything to add to oil that will dissapate moisture such as something like HEET for the gas tank?

I'm having a hard time believing the engine is shot because it starts up and runs so nice! I hope its not. Frankly the boat needs a lot of work besides the engine so not sure I would replace it. It needs an interior and a canvas both $$$$. This is our first boat and if we end up selling it to upgrade then that's OK with me.

I passed on a really nice Searay 18' cuddy cabin really clean nice ineterior, full canvas for $2000. The only hitch was it needed a new motor. Unfortunately it had a Mercruiser instead of a volvo but you can't have everything! In retrospect I should've bought that and put motor in and that could've been a keeper for us. But i thought I woulr rather buy a good running boat instead of a pretty one. Our main goal is go boat camping since there are so many places to go on Puget Sound and the Vancouver Gulf Islands. So we'll have fun with this boat for this year to get our feet wet but we will be upgrading. Thanks for everything. I'll keep posting on the progress of the water in the oil."

"If you are having some water

"If you are having some water leaking fromt he oil cooler cover (I assume you are talking between the copper pipe and the cooler cover) it is probably because the copper pipe is bent forward. Try to bend it slightlu towards the stern so athat it has a tight fit, and also renew the seal if it does not look in good condtion. That should solve the problem.

Regarding the oil drain plug, it should have a 1" hexagonal head. However, you can also change the oil through the dipstick by using a syringe pump or a drill pump. Also, for flushing the engine, just use the cheapest generic oil you can find (WalMart, etc) as it won't be inside the engine for more that say 15-20 minutes. No need of using additives, just make sure that the engine has reached the operating temperature before you drain the oil.

Regarding your comments about the boat condition, I agree it is much better to have a safe boat than a good looking boat. If it is your first boat, you may want to hang on to it if it runs well, until you decide whether or not you want to upgrade. Just remember that when it comes to purchasing a boat, you normally get what you pay for (or less on some instances, but seldom more).

Good luck, summer is around the corner and you have a lot of testing to do before going camping. And remember: having two bilge pumps is better than having just one. "

"1"? I guess Volvo wasn&#3

"1"? I guess Volvo wasn't the only company confused about SAE or Metric back then. How about the oil cooler nut under the filter, same size? These bigger wrenches get expensive so it's nice to know before hand.

I did use a drill pump last night but my goal is to get every drop of the contaminated oil out of the pan. I filled her back up with some cheap oil and filter and added a can of restore and fired it back up. Ran until it was warmed up. Checked the oil again and it still had a bit of the contamination in it. So if I can get it all out the second time I will know for sure if I'm getting water in from somewhere else. Is it possible to get water in the oil via the cooler? I really don't think it's the closed system water getting in. I'll take it out for another test run this weekend. Thanks."

"Not sure about the size of th

"Not sure about the size of the nut under the filter, you may have to use a vernier caliper to find it out.

You can get water in the oil via the cooler, but since the oil pressure is higher than the water pressure, chances are you would get oil into the water and not the other way around. You can always remove the oil cooler and have it pressure-tested to clear any doubts.

In a case like yours, your best bet is to remove the oil drain plug so that you drain as much as possible. One thing I did in my old AQ140 was drilling and threading the drain plug and installing a threaded petcock with a hose attached at the other end (I had the hose capped at the free end as well). Whenever I wanted to drain the oil (of course, with the boat on the trailer), I would remove the boat's drain plug at the bottom of the tramsom and pass through it the hose; then run the engine and, after the oil was warm, shut the engine down, put a jug or bucket under the hose, open the petcock, and drain the oil without making a mess."

Thanks!

Your oil drain tub

Thanks!

Your oil drain tube idea is shear genius!

My friend added a drain to the

My friend added a drain to the pan drain and had a problem. Don't get too much weight hanging down when making the drain adaptor. His cracked and the oil was leaking out. Lots of vibrations and boat bounce ya know. Also my oil cooler has O rings at each end and you should replace the grommets on the copper pipes. Some would say to add a bit of diesel to the engine oil when trying to remove water.

"It's not my idea, I have

"It's not my idea, I have seen it done before. In fact, there are kits you can buy, but I did not find any that fitted directly the VP drain in the oil pan. Check this:

http://www.marineengine.com/parts/part_details.php?pnum=SIE18-7892&returntopage= 80240107.htm

Just one note of warning: if you are going to install a petcock like I did, be careful with the quality and material you select. If it opens by accident while the engine is running, you will loose the oil and blow the engine for good. You will be probably better off if you purchase an already made kit (like the one in the above link), then drill and thread the oil pan plug to make it fit."

"I'm not sure if this one

"I'm not sure if this one will fit an AQ140A or not, but I installed one of these on my AQ130C:

http://tinyurl.com/2cvfjd

It was a bear to install since access to the drain plug is very limited, but it sure makes oil changes very easy and clean!"

"That one will fit. I just che

"That one will fit. I just checked an old VP drain plug (ex-AQ140) and the thread is 3/4" x 16TPI.

Good job, Bob."

Actually I think I'd forge

Actually I think I'd forget the petcock and just plug the end of the high pressure hose threaded into the oil drain plug. Just remember to add enough oil to compensate for the hose filling up. Just as long as you tie the hose up out of the way away from the exhaust manifold and bilge water and make sure the plugged end of the hose fits through the bilge drain hole I think it would work. No reaching under the engine except feeding the tube through the drain.