Need 9.9 advice from knowledgeable owner/service tech--see pics///please help

Just purchased a 2002 BFP9.9D Elect start-Remote XL shaft
I took the shroud off after not seeing any water coming out of pee holes. There are no lines connected--in fact I don't find any lines at all. There are 2 lines dropping down from the plastic pan next to the flywheel over the rear timing belt sprocket. The lines are on each side of the engine and placed in the proper holes. One line will reach but the left side line is only an inch below metal holding hole. Also there is an open screw hole above what I think is the thermostat housing-located behind the started housing. Inside the hole there looks like a plastic black shape in a +. So, I'm starting to worry about my purchase from a Honda employee who said the motor was fine and pumped water the last time he started it-ya right. My plan is to replace the water pump given the previous owner said it had sat for 3 years. The motor started up even with the old gas in carb and seemed ok after running new gas through--yah the carb will need a thorough cleaning to fine tune it asap. What have I gotten myself into. Please see attached photos.

Your first picture is of the thermostat housing. The hole you mentioned is the flush port.

I think i can see the water discharge hose in your second picture. it is the black hose closest to the oil filter. It comes up through the opening, then it should connect to the indicator nipple on the side cowling. The other nipple that you see in the cowling is for the carburator float bowl drain. It should be a clear plastic hose.

You may want to try to blow some compressed air back through the black indicator hose. Most likely, as it was sitting, small critters got in there and built some nests or just accumulated some debris.

When trying to run the motor, be sure to have it in a barrel with water covering well above water pump at the top of the lower unit. Rabbit ears do not work very well on this motor. They tend to slide off and loose their grip.

Hope that helps some..

Mike

hondadude said:

Your first picture is of the thermostat housing. The hole you mentioned is the flush port.

I think i can see the water discharge hose in your second picture. it is the black hose closest to the oil filter. It comes up through the opening, then it should connect to the indicator nipple on the side cowling. The other nipple that you see in the cowling is for the carburator float bowl drain. It should be a clear plastic hose.

You may want to try to blow some compressed air back through the black indicator hose. Most likely, as it was sitting, small critters got in there and built some nests or just accumulated some debris.

When trying to run the motor, be sure to have it in a barrel with water covering well above water pump at the top of the lower unit. Rabbit ears do not work very well on this motor. They tend to slide off and loose their grip.

Hope that helps some..

Mike

Click to expand...

Mike-thanks for jumping in-here is a follow-up.

1. What is the purpose and function of the flush port? Should it be open all the time or should there be a screw or threaded plug for it? Can you flush the system with it??

2. The thin black hose next to the oil filter goes from bottom of carb into the side of the muffler.

3. There is a plastic pan on the top side of the rear of the motor from which the 2 larger black hoses run--one on left and shorter than the one on right--left of the thin black hose--I plugged the left larger hose into the pee nozzle and it fit perfect. Has someone cut off the other(left side) one. There are 2 pee nozzles on this motor. Both of these hoses are attached to the left and right side of this black open top plastic what looks like a reservoir with no top at rear of motor on top. Doesn't make sense that these 2 lines are not attached to the cooling system some way-they both drain from the open reservoir.

4. There is a short thin clear plastic tube that moves to the front of the engine--probably the drain for carb--didn't look closely at that one yet.
The slip on clips for the 2 side pee ports are for the larger size hose (2 black) Would it be illegal to exit to have a carb brain out the side of the motor?

5. Going to barrel test it Friday and see what happens but would like more info first.

Let us ask you some questions:
In your second photo...isn't the black hose in the hole nearest the oil filter connected to the side of the engine? It SURE looks like it is. If so, THAT is your pee hose and it is connected properly to the engine and just needs to be re routed to the stbd side cover plastic nipple. If it is connected any other way and has water coming out of it, it could feed water into the engine! Straighten that mess out before worrying about anything else.

NOTE: that pee hose MUST come off of the nipple in the block and then go up, THROUGH THAT HOLE, in the "drain pan", and then out to the nipple on the side cover. If you route the hose to the side cover without putting it up through that "pan", then the hose will be pinched closed when the cover is installed and tightened down.

Now, back to your questions:
The flush port is just that, a valve port to flush out the thermostat housing. The threads you can see in the hole are for a special garden hose adapter to screw into that housing and apply water pressure. Do yourself a favor and don't use it. Flush the engine like Mike indicated by running it in a trashcan or test tank. The flush valve just doesn't seem to work all that great and it will begin leaking if you insist on using it. Don't worry though, if it leaks, it is easy and cheap to replace the components and you should replace the thermostat and internal anode every couple of years anyway.

The black plastic pan with the two hoses is there as a catch basin and drain. Water almost NEVER gets up there and it presents no problems. Yes, someone is very confused about where and why the hoses on your motor are routed and they PROBABLY did cut one of the pan drains to "make it fit" their own little small brain"s concept of a "perfect world". Those two hoses should be routed down and out two holes located in the bottom of the oil case. NO BIG DEAL! You can find replacement hose to fix that snafu at any auto parts store.

There are two "clear" plastic lines associated with this engine. One is short and is to provide a drain for the MUFFLER to a metal nipple in the lower case. It is a bi#$h to keep in the proper place and is not to be worried too much about.

The other is the drain tube from the bowl of the carburetor to the second nipple on the side cover. Yes, not only is it legal, it is a SAFETY requirement to direct raw gas out of the engine compartment should there be a leak. It is also a source of providing you with THE NUMBER ONE method of keeping your 9.9 runnin" happy... By giving you a means to drain your carb before each layup of more than a couple of days. USE THIS TUBE to your ADVANTAGE!

Let us know if the tank run produces any water flow and we will proceed from there. Good luck.

Thanks,

So there should be no plug or anything in flush port?

I will check out motor with what you have sent tonight and put it in my drum--hate muffs and repost Fri or Sat. Anyone have a Cd copy of manual out there?

I think the small line went up into carb--hope that is not the case. I will also post better pics--was late when these were taken.

The larger black lines make sense now--they will just hang down as suppose too.

There is a clear plastic line from bottom of carb (maybe 4 inches) heading toward the front of the engine. Is this the line that goes to the pee port?

Have to run--ttys

l

This is what I found out today. The thin black rubber hose that comes from the block behind the muffler was actually plugged into the bottom of the carb. I removed it and placed it onto one pf the pee ports. Then took gas line and went from the bottom of the carb to the second pee port. feeling better know. This engine was run with muffs and now I can see why there was no water coming from port. Could having the water line hooked to the bottom port of carb done and damage--seems like that is a one way valve. I blew out the water line and felt some resistant and then it opened up and I could hear air coming out the lower end. Should I fire it up with new plugs and see what happens or could there be water in the engine??? The oil looks fresh and I don't see any evidence of water on stick. Previous owner did oil change prior to storage 3 years ago. Let me know--your ideas have helped so far.

The drain you mentioned for the muffler--is it visible or located inside the engine?

Will post some pictures of the harness and rectangular plate that houses the 2 warning lights, kill switch, and key switch.

My next project will be hooking up a control box and cables ( need to purchase these) and hook up my steering from the side console (86 Alumacraft Classic Deluxe)

Yes, fire it up and run it in the can to see if clearing the water tell tale tube did the trick. I don't believe that any water entered the carb or engine. If your water pump is good then you should get a good pee stream almost immediately after start up and it should increase in intensity as the throttle is advanced. If not, your next project is to replace the impeller.

You have purchased one of the finest, most reliable and easy to maintain outboards ever made. The electric start 9.9 BF Honda is truly a thing of beauty. Power Trim n Tilt makes it even more beautiful. Do you have that too?

The little hose from the muffler box fits into a sort of "trough" in the case below. It's sort of hard to explain and I don't have one in front of me at the moment that I can use to come up with a better description. Don't be too concerned about it. It is something you can sort out at your leisure.

Ok guys,

Putting in new plugs today--what is best gap for mostly trolling?
Going to fire it up tonight and cross fingers. Have replaced
my share of impellors in past so will order one to have on hand.
Have a cut down white plastic 55 gallon barrel so it will have plenty of water
to run threw it. The muffler drain is internal?? The black hose next to the oil filter is now routed to the pee port--this is the water pump exit hose from what you have told me. Don't see any other hose near muffler.

Should I pull and test thermostat or just replace it. When I blow down thru block it release good bubbles at cavitation plate. IS there a way to clear the rest of the path?

Spark plug gap .031" to .035". Most folks here will recommend NGK spark plugs for the Honda outboard. I do too.
NGK CR5EH-9 for your engine.

Don't screw around with the thermostat, replace it. Cheapest insurance you will ever purchase. Running your outboard in a "tank" of fresh, clean water simulates operating conditions and, if the thermostat is working properly and the the pump is pumping as it should, will introduce flush water into every passage that needs flushing. That is what I recommend.

These water pumps will provide for flow with only one of the arms left on the spider. While you can see a stream, it will not flow enough to provide sufficient cooling. If you are unsure as to why the alarm is coming on, pull the pump and check the impeller. Better yet, just replace it and get on down the dock. Think: insurance.

Replace that pee hose. Yes they get kinked and they also get hard and trap small items that prevents the pee stream from being indicative of flow. I consider it a wear item and replace it every two seasons.

I don't see much, if any, advantage to running synthetic oils in these outboards and Honda actually recommends that you don't. There are plenty of opinions to go around on that subject but, ultimately, you have to make up your own mind. I can say that I run conventional petroleum oils in everything I own but do use LUCAS additives, including the engine oil supplement that they offer and have had great success over many, many years of doing so.

Not sure what all the "blackness" is in your tank but you are probably correct that the engine was fouling and that may clean up as you run it more. Just keep an eye on it

Good luck.

JGMO,

Going to take your advice and replace thermostat--what about that threaded hole for flush valve--leave it open. I looked at a parts diagram and on a 2003 it shows a bolt so I'm guessing my 2002 should also be closed--dah on my part.

Will replace the hose and then run again. Will the water tend to have a slight bend at idle or should it be a straight stream? If this motor was overheated by prior owner what am I looking at?

Should I do a compression check--thinking this may give me some info on shape of head gasket.

I found sand and black grit in bottom of barrel when emptying tub--good sign that it was flushed out.

Going to drain and fill lower unit and check seals or should I just replace those too? I do not have an owners manual and still waiting on my Honda Co. manual to arrive--snail mail.

The previous owner told me it pumped water fine when he purchase it 3 years ago after the season from his yacht club buddy who went up to a 15hp. He brought it home and put it in basement and there it set. Do the veins of the pump get a memory of position ? I guess changing it would keep me safe for the next couple years so for $100 in parts may cure being worried on the water when the wallye are biting and I'm 700 miles from home.

Draining the carb requires taking off the panel every time?

Maybe this will help. Look at the thermostat housing parts blow up link below and note that parts 2-3 & 4 are the flush port check valve pieces. There is NO bolt associated with the flush port hole. All the bolts listed are either labeled #10 for the thermostat cover or #11 for the thermostat housing flange. http://www.boats.net/parts/search/H... SHSA VIN# BABJ-1100001/THERMOSTAT/parts.html Yes, I know it has threads and, yes, I know it's tempting to want to stick something in that hole but it is not necessary. The threads you see are for the flush adapter.

The pee stream should be forceful and almost instantaneous on start up. It will increase some with RPM but should be a good, steady stream at idle.

The fact that engine starts and idles easily tells me that it is probably sound so try not to worry too much about what the previous owner did or didn't do....yet.

Replacing the seals in the lower end can be problematic for the "average" boater/weekend warrior mechanic. They don't easily come out and aren't real easy to get back in PROPERLY. If the prop shaft seal is leaking, I recommend buying and replacing the entire PROP SHAFT HOLDER. It isn't very expensive and comes with the seal. If you want to replace the old seal afterward, then you have the old holder to "practice" on. And you WILL need the practice!

Also, without the proper "evaluation" tools, it's hard to know if you did a good job or not. The gear housing MUST be inspected for holding positive as well as negative pressure when the job is complete. Otherwise, you have no way of knowing if water will be entering the gear case when you launch the boat.

Download yourself a free owner's manual here: http://marine.honda.com/owners/manuals

With the right, skinny, long screwdriver, you can drain the carburetor by only removing the hood. Even with the good and perfect tool, you have to "hold your mouth just right" but it can be done and I do it all the time. If you don't do this little chore before putting the boat away for several days or weeks, you will soon be visiting the land of hard starting and Honda carburetor rebuild.

These little babies are very sensitive to deposits left in the float chamber and will not run right when the least bit dirty. They do, however, respond well to love and Sea Foam gas additive along with religious draining of the float bowl. Do these simple things and she will start, idle and run happy. HTHY. jimmyd

If I do not have water in gear case lube then the seals are probably good? Putting new pee hose on tonight and will video what happens then upload results. I really appreciate all the help.

Affirmative. If you don't have water in the gear case then it is a pretty sure sign that the seals are ok. You need to get in the habit of pulling the prop and checking behind the thrust washer for fishing line or other debris wrapped around the prop shaft. Monofiliment fishing line is the #1 killer of prop shaft seals and prop shaft seal failure is the #1 killer of gear case components. The thrust washer is a wear item and needs to be replaced anytime it is noted that it is not smooth and flat on the seal side. Keep a fresh thrust washer behind the prop and keep the shaft free of line and you will be WAY AHEAD of the guy that lets this stuff slide.