Logo

04 225 check enging and intermittant alarm

Jerry Stump

New member
Last week .....11-08....I had my motor in the shop to replace the main relay because I was having starting problems......while there I decided to get the computer download of the history of the motor....for 90 bucks....little pricey but I wanted the info.....the download showed a bad O2 sensor so they replaced that to ....195 bucks....after leaving dealer I ran boat and all was well this day. 2 days later was fishing and had 4 check engines and warning alarms.....only get the alarm when running @ no-wake speed about 3 to 4 min after comming off plane. I turn motor off and back on ....no alarm.....run @ no wake for 3 min....alarm....no alarm while running at speed. I called the dealer ....I have to take it back in to have them check for codes this thurs....the 18th....yesterday Mon and today I pulled out of garage hooked up the muffs and let it run....after 4 min...alarm.....restarted ran 20 min...no alarm....today...ran for 20 min....no alarm at all.....so ...what the heck.....I'm being told by friends that the simptoms I'm describing is bad O2 sensor....can a new one go bad in 2 days or did I get a bad one off the shelf......any input will be appeciated.....thanks....JS

<BR><BR>motor is on a 21' Ranger Bassboat<BR>some computer download info<BR>414 hrs<BR>5200 keystarts<BR>1 low oil pressure code<BR>4 overheat codes......never had a horn since I had boat.....bought used 2009...3rd season for me<BR>dealer was not concerned about these codes
 
sounds EXACTLY like a bad 02 sensor, Yes I have read on here this year of a Honda owner getting a bad one right of the shelf. Having my motors last 10 yrs I have seen my few bad 02 sensors.. Please let us know on flip side but my bet is 02.
 
What kind of alarm - continuous, long intermittent, or short intermittent? When alarm goes of, are any of the four lights on your key sitch assembly on besides the green oil light? There are a whole bunch of basic diagnostics based on the type of alarm and the lights on your consol.
 
Velly intelesting. That's my foreign "movie" accent.
So, let's review;

You had a starting problem but no alarms and (I'm assuming) they told you that it was the main relay. (Again, assuming) That fixed the starting problems (?) but you asked for a "history" and they sell you an O2 sensor for $195. HMMMM. Velly intelesting.

So, with a bad O2 sensor you get no alarms but with a new O2 sensor you get alarms. HMMMM. Velly, velly intelesting!

I've got it! These engines should only be run with bad O2 sensors!!!

Ok, I'll stop my lame attempts at humor 'cause at $300 a visit and who knows what happens next, I'm guessing you ain't laughing too hard right now.

And, why in the world would a shop be "not concerned " about 4 overheat occurrences? The answer might be that the ECM operating system on these things is a bit buggy and they may have seen this before. In the automotive world they call it "phantom codes". My question is when did they occur? If somewhere around 100 hours (before you bought the boat maybe?) or, closer to the current 400 hours and recent. It should be on the printout.

Yes, it does sound like you were sold a bad O2 sensor but it also sounds as if there might not have been anything wrong with your old one.

What folks (mechanics too) need to realize is that the engine computer is not the end of the story when it comes to diagnosing an issue. The ECM can tell you anything it's evil little inner workings wants to but that does not mean that you are getting the truth.

The O2 sensor is nothing more than a little battery that produces voltage when immersed in a stream of oxygen used for the catalyst. It can be checked independent of the engine computer with a volt meter. As a matter of fact, this is automotive repair 101 because so many auto ECMs have lied about O2 sensor performance in the past.

I'm not sure that the outboard service industry is quite up to speed on some of this "basic" cross checking of cause and effect when it comes to repairing fuel injected marine engines. The problem is though that the consumer always suffers from this lack of knowledge and technique. I am appalled at the lack of support that some of Honda of America's service centers has to offer their customers. Some are GREAT and some are AWFUL and some are in between. Honda offers training for their products but I don't think that they do a "stellar" job of monitoring the outcomes of many dealer/customer conflicts. This sometimes leaves the boat owner "on his own" to resolve problems with their outboard and that is just plain inexcusable.

But, inexcusable or not, it can be a reality that you could find yourself in with a dealer. Don't get me wrong, The dealer you're working with right now might be one of the good ones and will get you "fixed up and out the door" after a little more investigation. You have to give them a chance. But you also need to be prepared to be your own advocate. You should not get in a cycle of multiple visits to the dealer to solve a simple problem. Becoming, so to speak, their unpaid employee. I'm not advocating starting a fight but I will say that "firmness" gets results and you need to let them know that you are not one for any "nonsense". If the tech they put on your job ain't cuttin' it, you want to go right to the "A" team.

I would want to know PRECISELY why historic oil pressure and overheat codes don't interest them. I would ask them if they know how to perform a "cross count" voltage check on the O2 sensor to ensure that the one they sold you is working properly. Or, do they just accept what the ECM spits out and end of story? Those sorts of things.

Good luck and let us know what happens next.
 
Jimmy - Velly, velly intelesting, indeed. BTW - The Helm shop manual has a procedure for checking the HO2 sensors in the 200 and 225 external to the HDS.

Jerry - What is the serial number on that engine? And what about the answers to my previous questions?
 
Back
Top