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View Full Version : 1988 85hp forcetiming advancethrottle stuck in idle



sportfish
06-20-2009, 09:42 PM
"Hi all- went from inboard to out board this past yr.- here it is, 89' 85 hp force, she ran great when I used her last year- started her up and she wouldnt throttle up. so I found that the linkage running from the throttle cable up to the timing advance is stuck. I pulled the flywheel and found rust/gunk/corrosion under the fly wheel and the ring??? that rotates was tight with dry gunk- I cleaned it all and now how do I lubricate- and with what???? Also, the ring which mounts under/inside the flywheel is loose-came out. Is it supposed too??? I put it back on/in- noticed it has a split, figured centrical force holds it in place- sorry for the lengthy tale- any help will help- thanks"

william_m
06-23-2009, 08:06 PM
Could you post a picture I'm having a brain fart and just can't visualize.

gonzo25
06-23-2009, 09:25 PM
"how did you take the flywheel off?

it sounds like you are talking about the ring or gear that the starter turns... that should not be loose and if it has a crack in it you need to replace it.

the only thing under the flywheel that moves is the advance plate, which is probably not where the problem is. the problem is probably in the cable or the tower shaft that operates the advance place and the carb.

if you mess with the tower you will have to readjust everything to make sure it is all in sync. that is easy enough if you don't change the timing. what i would do is; disconnect the cable from the tower and see if the cable moves freely when disconnected. if it does, then move to the tower shaft. Get back to me at that point because that is a little involved. But easy

Most important question…. Do you have a manual? If you don’t have a manual you have no business working on your motor, you can’t even change plugs without one. What is the plug gap? What is the torque on the plugs? Do you know how to read them to know if the motor is running to rich or to lean or to tell if there is a water leak. If you don’t have a manual you probably didn’t use a puller on the flywheel and you used a hammer and some pry bars to get it off.. if that is the case then the money you cost yourself to fix it would have paid for that manual ten times over"

sportfish
06-24-2009, 06:26 PM
"The advance plate is stuck- binds only when you tighten the 4 bolts. loosen the bolts, and it works fine. I have disconnected the tower cables- the throttle linkage was not moving. I then went further by removing the flywheel, that is when I discovered the advance plate. It was crusty with dust/oil/sludge. I cleaned it up, re-lubed with a electrical grease, tightened it back to spec- stuck/binding again. Loosened the 4 retaining bolts a little , basically hand tight- and it moves. As regards to the manual- got a copy of a cd repair manual from a local shop who used to work on forces. FYI-GEORGE SANDEN-I dont really know how to take the last paragraph in your response- I am QUITE sure you were not being an arrogant know it all who is full of nothing but negative advice??? I am a MASTER mechanic- I taught @ mechanics course for Acura Motor Co. for 6 yrs. I wont bragg, nor will I boast- However- I CAN work on things e.g.- outboards, etc. So in response to you- I was only FEELING around to see if this was a common problem. Its is nice to know that there are such HELPFULL folks out here- yeah right!!!!"

sportfish
06-24-2009, 06:32 PM
By the way George- Had you read the original post- you will notice that I CLEARLY stated that the "throttle linkage" was non-op/stuck. NOT the controls in the tower/console. HMMMM- isnt it Wise to first review before we jump in- a wise man once told me- "think before you speak- you will learn more". Thanks for the advice DAD.

gonzo25
06-25-2009, 03:16 AM
"j. lamothe

well to tell you the truth I did read your post, several times. if you notice the other person who responded to it said that he couldn't visualize it by your description. I guess I couldn't either, so much for "CLEARLY stated"."started her up and she wouldn’t throttle up. so I found that the linkage running from the throttle cable up to the timing advance is stuck." okay, we have "the linkage from the throttle cable UP to the timing advance is stuck" I know it must be me, but I have to look at what is between the cable and the timing advance that someone could call linkage? funny, the tower comes to mind, BUT I am not, nor have I claimed to be a "master mechanic".
if you are a "master mechanic" then you should know the importance of having a manual, especially if working on something that you are not familiar with. if you read the posts in here you will find a lot of people working on their motor that have no clue and no manual, either because they think they are a "master mechanic" or they are trying to save a buck. to give some credit or as an example I used something that was as simple as changing the spark plugs to show that even the easiest thing may require some information that none of us were born with. or at least I wasn't. and the last line was about that saving a dime to loose a dollar. if you didn't use a puller on the flywheel and used a hammer and pry bars. you may have broken the ring gear for the starter... which would cost you more to repair than buying a manual would. AS AN EXAMPLE. of course, I know that you know that.
if you look at the length of your post and note the last line, "sorry for the lengthy tale- any help will help" then take a look at mine, you will notice that there is a lot more in mine than in your "lengthy tale-" and I am not the one who is in here looking for help with their problem, I am the one giving my time to help someone I don't even know. WHY? because someone else has done it for me. did I ever get a response that I didn't like? sure, plenty...and most of it was from "arrogant know it all". the difference between the fool and the wise man is... the wise man realizes that they don't have to say anything and can let you suffer, it puts no money in their pocket, it takes up their time which could easily be spent doing something they want to do instead of trying to help give an answer to stupid questions asked by stupid people. then he takes the information, logs it, and thanks them for their time.
the fool on the other hand takes some thing that he should know is good advice, get a manual and blows it way out of proportion with serious attitude. step me out here, what was the "negative advice??"
the funny thing here is that I started this to say sorry for missing what you were describing, because most people in here aren't mechanics and don't know their way around the motors and you have to try and remember that when they give a description of things. example... the ring gear getting broken by taking the flywheel off with some pry bars. BUT that wasn't the case, and what I saw was someone that didn't like some good advice about getting a manual and showed what an AXX (a donkey, a lower pastier orifice) he really is. check out the quotes in this message, go up and confirm them from your post, they were a cut and paste.... and what is the negative advice? get a manual? your last line said "thanks for the advice dad". it seems to me that he didn't give you very good advice, or at least didn't teach you how to act. I am sure you were directing that to me, and that's okay, if you were here in san diego I would do what your dad should have done and give you a good spanking. if you want, avoid the buffer and send me an email, and I’ll met you on your C drive. other wise, your welcome."

william_m
06-25-2009, 10:38 AM
"Hey GL leave J alone- he's going to make some boat mechanic a ton of money. My buddy "Jay" would steer the free advice so far wrong, I couldn't believe it. He must have been a Catholic to get that much forgiveness.

I always gave advise when a customer would ask as- much like J you just can not get some of it to travel well and They always came back with a motor in a box and I never charged extra for being a frustrated bone head. Just like I can't do diddly on a computer except run it like a typwriter on meth. The "master mechanic" is a state of mind. Not an ability."

sportfish
06-25-2009, 06:42 PM
"iso the pissing contest has started- lets see, "If you don't have a manual, you have no business working on one"!!!! THat is Not an example, that was a point!!!! So think what you want- Like I said prior- I have a manual, dont need a boat mechanic- just a resource for the unscripted area of a stuck advance plate. NOT in the manual!!!!! By the way my good buddy william- why is religion a sore spot for you? Nevermind- scratch that, I hate to see what feeble response I get. I can HONESTLY say that everyone who has read this (95%) took your response as arrogant-George. Sorry for the opinion, but we all know how that goes. If you want to spank me- meet me for lunch at IN-N-Out Burger. I'll let you analize me then in person. Master Mechanic is nothing more than completion of multiple courses in a specific area of study with a 95% score or better. I have chosen to do that in alot of areas. The only difference between a master mechanic and a shade tree mechanic is $70-120k per year. You two, and this whole posting is a joke- It is a terrible thing that people ruin things like this with this type of crap. You should try and take a look on a "Real Repair Forum"- you know, the ones pros' hang out on. Oops- sorry for that, you cant get access!!!
Just so you know how I aquired the 95%- I took everything here-in and posted on a few of the Auto International repair forums- and I shared it with my class today-Everyone had a good laugh!!! The "Master Mechanic" is a state of mind, not an ability. That is now on my overhead projector in my class for everyone to see- thanks for the new phrase for the graduating class- cheers."

william_m
06-25-2009, 09:36 PM
Glad we could be of service. Best post I've seen in weeks!!!

gonzo25
06-26-2009, 05:39 AM
"Well it is easy to see where the problem is, the heart of this is your ability to read and comprehend the English language.
I am arrogant? Okay, I am arrogant… So, is that supposed to make me feel bad? Sorry, I have been called worse by much better men than you, the only time it hurts is when someone says shxx about you that is true… as it goes, “the truth hurts”
Yes I don’t think that anyone should be working on something that they know nothing about without a manual… that is true, and it was making a point, and the other point was that no one is born with the knowledge. When I said “you” I meant it in a general sense, as in anyone, not you personally… but then I didn’t know you were so insecure and would get so defensive. The rest of it, changing the spark plugs and the ring gear…. Those were examples. This too is an example. “By the way George- Had you read the original post- you will notice that I CLEARLY stated that the "throttle linkage" was non-op/stuck. NOT the controls in the tower/console. HMMMM- isn’t it Wise to first review before we jump in- a wise man once told me- "think before you speak- you will learn more". Thanks for the advice DAD” this is exactly where the problem is. NOT in the saying, that is a very good one. The only person who has said anything about controls or console is you. By reading this it sounds like I was telling you to do something with the controls in the towers console. Hmmm isn’t it wise to first review…. I never said anything about controls or your towers console. I heard or read “so I found that the linkage running from the throttle cable up to the timing advance is stuck” does that sound familiar? How about this? “the only thing under the flywheel that moves is the advance plate, which is probably not where the problem is. the problem is probably in the cable or the tower shaft that operates the advance place and the carb. “what I would do is; disconnect the cable from the tower and see if the cable moves freely when disconnected. if it does, then move to the tower shaft.
Does any of that sound familiar? It’s all out there, go back and read it again, this is all cut and paste. I don’t see anything in there where I told you jack shxx about the controls or the towers console. The tower shaft is the part between the cable and the advance plate….. of course that is what your manual would call it.
It is easy to see the problem, and I guess I could go back over every word and you still wouldn’t get it, honestly I feel sorry for you.
Your pathetic, you come in here looking for some help, you get help and good advice. Because you don’t know what a part is called you start claiming you got negative advice and go off about a controller and your towers console when you were the only one that ever said that. The advice you got was good and correct and if you didn’t like it then you didn’t have to use it. But instead of acting like a real man and showing some appreciation for someone taking the time to try and help you, you show your ignorance, attack the person who is giving you something most people don’t and you talk down to every guy in here trying to do the same thing, like you are so above all of them and they don’t measure up to the people in the forums that you go in…. we couldn’t even get in any of them…. Why are you here? No one here gets anything for helping others…. You definitely got more than what you paid for…. And personally, I don’t need to come in here and do this for people like you.
I am pretty impressed by you. If you were a man and had any class then you would man up and say hey I was wrong and thanks for trying to help me. Of course “if” pigs had wings they would fly, and what I expect to see is that this went right over your head like all the rest of it, and instead of man up it will be a little more of what I have already seen.
Yep, I’m arrogant, a know it all, got a big ego, hat size is 7 so I can’t say I have a big head, but my i.q. is 143 so there must be something in there, of course I think that I am all that don’t you? Women all love me, my dog adores me, did I leave anything out? Oh yeah… I’m good looking and got a big dick…. Gee don’t hurt my feelings okay? I am sensitive."

watersport01
06-26-2009, 07:44 AM
"These posts are getting ugly. There are people who are genuinley trying to seek good advise for engines and I see a lot of it being offered. This dialouge between two is really taking away from the purpose of the posts. Please exchange your personal emails and continue off the public forum, if both really feel you need to stay on this personal issue. I enjoy reading all the posts, but this is not helpful advice in any way, except to add fuel to a harming fire. Thank you for your understanding and remembering the goal of this post as it relates to motors and such."